Headphone jack and auto-mute of speak output

Headphone jack and auto-mute of speak output

[Davyd McColl]

Good day

I'm new to this list (though I've done some searching, I'm sure I could have
missed something), so please bear with me.

I filed a bug report recently against Ubuntu with respect to the problem I'm
experiencing (as per the subject: jacking in my headphones doesn't mute the
speaker output) and was informed that the decision had been made upstream as
a design intention. I was linked off to:
http://mailman.alsa-project.org/pipermail/alsa-devel/2010-August/030071.html
with respect to the thread on this topic. I'd like to raise it again though,
perhaps as a configurable feature, for the following reasons:

1) headphones muting the speakers used to work some time ago (before Ubuntu
9.04, iirc), so we have an established user expectation even under Linux
distros.
2) headphones mute the built-in speakers of my laptop (windows and ubuntu)
-- why the inconsistent behaviour for a desktop? Just because the speakers
in the laptop are bolted into the frame of the machine?
3) Windows "gets it right": plugging in headphones mutes external speakers
-- it's convenient (Though I think you can disable that feature if you
want). I'm told by a person at work that his Mac does the same. Again, the
user expectation is unmet under a newish Linux distro.
4) The user expectation theory is held up by the number of bug reports
against this design choice on Ubuntu Launchpad alone (I haven't looked at
other bug lists). The average user is not expecting the current behaviour,
obviously
5) For people without hardware volume controls on their speakers, the
problem is exacerbated: instead of being able to plug in headphones to
disturb others around them less (ie: contain their music/noises), they have
to unplug their speakers too -- which may not be trivial since speakers are
normally plugged in at the back of the machine, not at the front where the
headphone jack would be found. On a machine in an enclosure, this is
especially troublesome.

So I'd really like to know if it would be possible to allow the behaviour
most users are expecting. Sometimes it's useful to be able to output to both
speakers and headphones, but I would say that the average user doesn't want
both at the same time.

-d


-- 
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
The competent programmer is fully aware of the limited size of his own
skull. He therefore approaches his task with full humility, and avoids
clever tricks like the plague.
- Djikstra.

Re: Headphone jack and auto-mute of speak output

[Raymond Yau]

2010/10/7 Davyd McColl <davydm@gmail.com>

> Good day
>
> I'm new to this list (though I've done some searching, I'm sure I could
> have
> missed something), so please bear with me.
>
> I filed a bug report recently against Ubuntu with respect to the problem
> I'm
> experiencing (as per the subject: jacking in my headphones doesn't mute the
> speaker output) and was informed that the decision had been made upstream
> as
> a design intention. I was linked off to:
>
> http://mailman.alsa-project.org/pipermail/alsa-devel/2010-August/030071.html
> with respect to the thread on this topic. I'd like to raise it again
> though,
> perhaps as a configurable feature, for the following reasons:
>

Enable auto-muting in model=auto only for devices with HP and speakers.

http://git.alsa-project.org/?p=alsa-kernel.git;a=commitdiff;h=2a2ed0dfc9ec44a899c7d4672f73f2c045099118;hp=299f293b3428ae6d73406642cd7d41f08d524c83


if the bios set your laptop 's speaker as line out , you need to implement a
new model for your laptop ,

model=auto assume the bios had already correctly setup all the pin complex
of your computer



>
> 1) headphones muting the speakers used to work some time ago (before Ubuntu
> 9.04, iirc), so we have an established user expectation even under Linux
> distros.
> 2) headphones mute the built-in speakers of my laptop (windows and ubuntu)
> -- why the inconsistent behaviour for a desktop? Just because the speakers
> in the laptop are bolted into the frame of the machine?
> 3) Windows "gets it right": plugging in headphones mutes external speakers
> -- it's convenient (Though I think you can disable that feature if you
> want). I'm told by a person at work that his Mac does the same. Again, the
> user expectation is unmet under a newish Linux distro.
> 4) The user expectation theory is held up by the number of bug reports
> against this design choice on Ubuntu Launchpad alone (I haven't looked at
> other bug lists). The average user is not expecting the current behaviour,
> obviously
> 5) For people without hardware volume controls on their speakers, the
> problem is exacerbated: instead of being able to plug in headphones to
> disturb others around them less (ie: contain their music/noises), they have
> to unplug their speakers too -- which may not be trivial since speakers are
> normally plugged in at the back of the machine, not at the front where the
> headphone jack would be found. On a machine in an enclosure, this is
> especially troublesome.
>
> So I'd really like to know if it would be possible to allow the behaviour
> most users are expecting. Sometimes it's useful to be able to output to
> both
> speakers and headphones, but I would say that the average user doesn't want
> both at the same time.
>
> -d
>
>
> --
> -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
> The competent programmer is fully aware of the limited size of his own
> skull. He therefore approaches his task with full humility, and avoids
> clever tricks like the plague.
> - Djikstra.
> _______________________________________________
> Alsa-devel mailing list
> Alsa-devel@alsa-project.org
> http://mailman.alsa-project.org/mailman/listinfo/alsa-devel
>

Re: Headphone jack and auto-mute of speak output

[Davyd McColl]

Ehm...

I don't understand. Are you saying that my laptop is "doing the wrong thing"
and should be playing out through the built-in speakers as well as
headphones when jacked in?

Also, the issue here isn't that I (or other, run-of-the-mill users) *want*
both outputs to play. I'm asking for the more common behaviour where the
speaker output was muted when headphones were plugged in.

If you're answering my question, I just don't understand you ): Please
explain again?

-d


On 7 October 2010 15:43, Raymond Yau <superquad.vortex2@gmail.com> wrote:

> 2010/10/7 Davyd McColl <davydm@gmail.com>
>
> > Good day
> >
> > I'm new to this list (though I've done some searching, I'm sure I could
> > have
> > missed something), so please bear with me.
> >
> > I filed a bug report recently against Ubuntu with respect to the problem
> > I'm
> > experiencing (as per the subject: jacking in my headphones doesn't mute
> the
> > speaker output) and was informed that the decision had been made upstream
> > as
> > a design intention. I was linked off to:
> >
> >
> http://mailman.alsa-project.org/pipermail/alsa-devel/2010-August/030071.html
> > with respect to the thread on this topic. I'd like to raise it again
> > though,
> > perhaps as a configurable feature, for the following reasons:
> >
>
> Enable auto-muting in model=auto only for devices with HP and speakers.
>
>
> http://git.alsa-project.org/?p=alsa-kernel.git;a=commitdiff;h=2a2ed0dfc9ec44a899c7d4672f73f2c045099118;hp=299f293b3428ae6d73406642cd7d41f08d524c83
>
>
> if the bios set your laptop 's speaker as line out , you need to implement
> a
> new model for your laptop ,
>
> model=auto assume the bios had already correctly setup all the pin complex
> of your computer
>
>
>
> >
> > 1) headphones muting the speakers used to work some time ago (before
> Ubuntu
> > 9.04, iirc), so we have an established user expectation even under Linux
> > distros.
> > 2) headphones mute the built-in speakers of my laptop (windows and
> ubuntu)
> > -- why the inconsistent behaviour for a desktop? Just because the
> speakers
> > in the laptop are bolted into the frame of the machine?
> > 3) Windows "gets it right": plugging in headphones mutes external
> speakers
> > -- it's convenient (Though I think you can disable that feature if you
> > want). I'm told by a person at work that his Mac does the same. Again,
> the
> > user expectation is unmet under a newish Linux distro.
> > 4) The user expectation theory is held up by the number of bug reports
> > against this design choice on Ubuntu Launchpad alone (I haven't looked at
> > other bug lists). The average user is not expecting the current
> behaviour,
> > obviously
> > 5) For people without hardware volume controls on their speakers, the
> > problem is exacerbated: instead of being able to plug in headphones to
> > disturb others around them less (ie: contain their music/noises), they
> have
> > to unplug their speakers too -- which may not be trivial since speakers
> are
> > normally plugged in at the back of the machine, not at the front where
> the
> > headphone jack would be found. On a machine in an enclosure, this is
> > especially troublesome.
> >
> > So I'd really like to know if it would be possible to allow the behaviour
> > most users are expecting. Sometimes it's useful to be able to output to
> > both
> > speakers and headphones, but I would say that the average user doesn't
> want
> > both at the same time.
> >
> > -d
> >
> >
> > --
> > -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
> > The competent programmer is fully aware of the limited size of his own
> > skull. He therefore approaches his task with full humility, and avoids
> > clever tricks like the plague.
> > - Djikstra.
> > _______________________________________________
> > Alsa-devel mailing list
> > Alsa-devel@alsa-project.org
> > http://mailman.alsa-project.org/mailman/listinfo/alsa-devel
> >
> _______________________________________________
> Alsa-devel mailing list
> Alsa-devel@alsa-project.org
> http://mailman.alsa-project.org/mailman/listinfo/alsa-devel
>



-- 
-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
The competent programmer is fully aware of the limited size of his own
skull. He therefore approaches his task with full humility, and avoids
clever tricks like the plague.
- Djikstra.

Re: Headphone jack and auto-mute of speak output

[David Henningsson]

On 2010-10-07 15:43, Raymond Yau wrote:
> 2010/10/7 Davyd McColl<davydm@gmail.com>
>
>> Good day
>>
>> I'm new to this list (though I've done some searching, I'm sure I could
>> have
>> missed something), so please bear with me.
>>
>> I filed a bug report recently against Ubuntu with respect to the problem
>> I'm
>> experiencing (as per the subject: jacking in my headphones doesn't mute the
>> speaker output) and was informed that the decision had been made upstream
>> as
>> a design intention. I was linked off to:
>>
>> http://mailman.alsa-project.org/pipermail/alsa-devel/2010-August/030071.html
>> with respect to the thread on this topic. I'd like to raise it again
>> though,
>> perhaps as a configurable feature, for the following reasons:
>>
>
> Enable auto-muting in model=auto only for devices with HP and speakers.
>
> http://git.alsa-project.org/?p=alsa-kernel.git;a=commitdiff;h=2a2ed0dfc9ec44a899c7d4672f73f2c045099118;hp=299f293b3428ae6d73406642cd7d41f08d524c83
>
>
> if the bios set your laptop 's speaker as line out , you need to implement a
> new model for your laptop ,

Can't you just override the pin config (via user_pin_configs in sysfs, 
or a patch file) in this case?

-- 
David Henningsson, Canonical Ltd.
http://launchpad.net/~diwic

Re: Headphone jack and auto-mute of speak output

[Raymond Yau]

2010/10/8 David Henningsson <david.henningsson@canonical.com>

> On 2010-10-07 15:43, Raymond Yau wrote:
> > 2010/10/7 Davyd McColl<davydm@gmail.com>
> >
> >> Good day
> >>
> >> I'm new to this list (though I've done some searching, I'm sure I could
> >> have
> >> missed something), so please bear with me.
> >>
> >> I filed a bug report recently against Ubuntu with respect to the problem
> >> I'm
> >> experiencing (as per the subject: jacking in my headphones doesn't mute
> the
> >> speaker output) and was informed that the decision had been made
> upstream
> >> as
> >> a design intention. I was linked off to:
> >>
> >>
> http://mailman.alsa-project.org/pipermail/alsa-devel/2010-August/030071.html
> >> with respect to the thread on this topic. I'd like to raise it again
> >> though,
> >> perhaps as a configurable feature, for the following reasons:
> >>
> >
> > Enable auto-muting in model=auto only for devices with HP and speakers.
> >
> >
> http://git.alsa-project.org/?p=alsa-kernel.git;a=commitdiff;h=2a2ed0dfc9ec44a899c7d4672f73f2c045099118;hp=299f293b3428ae6d73406642cd7d41f08d524c83
> >
> >
> > if the bios set your laptop 's speaker as line out , you need to
> implement a
> > new model for your laptop ,
>
> Can't you just override the pin config (via user_pin_configs in sysfs,
> or a patch file) in this case?
>
> --
> David Henningsson, Canonical Ltd.
> http://launchpad.net/~diwic <http://launchpad.net/%7Ediwic>
>

As you have not provided any output of alsa-info.sh  , it is impossible to
say this case is a regression or not


If the driver cannot find the [Pin Complex] Speaker at Int when you select
model=auto.
it assume that it is a desktop instead of a laptop

Some HDA codecs have "independent HP" switch (e.g. some of those VIA
codecs), the playback device 0 has 2 subdevices o allow headphone and the
line out - green jack at rear panel to play different audio stream
concurrently.

The driver cannot automute the line out when you pluggin the headphone in
this case and those VIA codecs have onle and only one model=auto

Re: Headphone jack and auto-mute of speak output

[Davyd McColl]

On 8 October 2010 01:05, Raymond Yau <superquad.vortex2@gmail.com> wrote:

> 2010/10/8 David Henningsson <david.henningsson@canonical.com>
>
> As you have not provided any output of alsa-info.sh  , it is impossible to
> say this case is a regression or not
>
Apologies. ALSA information can be found here:
http://www.alsa-project.org/db/?f=e0b199a8e8de35452f761359e753f0f668bb9551

In addition, the original bug I submitted can be found here:
https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/655351

There is a full hardware info dump as made by apport alongside that.

If the driver cannot find the [Pin Complex] Speaker at Int when you select
> model=auto.
> it assume that it is a desktop instead of a laptop
>
The machine presenting the issue is indeed a desktop, not a laptop.

-d

Re: Headphone jack and auto-mute of speak output

[Raymond Yau]

2010/10/8 Davyd McColl <davydm@gmail.com>

> On 8 October 2010 01:05, Raymond Yau <superquad.vortex2@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>>  2010/10/8 David Henningsson <david.henningsson@canonical.com>
>>
>> As you have not provided any output of alsa-info.sh  , it is impossible to
>> say this case is a regression or not
>>
> Apologies. ALSA information can be found here:
> http://www.alsa-project.org/db/?f=e0b199a8e8de35452f761359e753f0f668bb9551
>
> In addition, the original bug I submitted can be found here:
> https://bugs.launchpad.net/bugs/655351
>
> There is a full hardware info dump as made by apport alongside that.
>
> If the driver cannot find the [Pin Complex] Speaker at Int when you select
>> model=auto.
>> it assume that it is a desktop instead of a laptop
>>
> The machine presenting the issue is indeed a desktop, not a laptop.
>
> -d
>


According to the output of alsa-infos.h, the motherboard seem has 6 audio
jacks and spdif out at the rear panel ,  green/pink jack at front panel

In theory the model should be 6stack-dig but hda-emu seem has several error
messages when using your codec-info.

The ALC888 series are high-performance 7.1+2 Channel High Definition Audio
Codecs providing ten DAC channels that simultaneously support 7.1 sound
playback, plus 2 channels of independent stereo sound output (multiple
streaming) through the front panel stereo outputs. The series integrates two
stereo ADCs that can support a stereo microphone

There are five volume controls and mute switches In the Block diagram (page
5 of alc888 datasheet) and the driver had created

The driver only implement stream_analog_alt_capture, but the 2 channels of
indpendent stereo has not been implemented if you look at the comment in
patch_realtek.c


Node 0x25 [Audio Output] wcaps 0x11: Stereo
  Converter: stream=0, channel=0
  PCM:
    rates [0x560]: 44100 48000 96000 192000
    bits [0xe]: 16 20 24

    formats [0x1]: PCM
Node 0x26 [Audio Mixer] wcaps 0x20010f: Stereo Amp-In Amp-Out
  Amp-In caps: ofs=0x00, nsteps=0x00, stepsize=0x00, mute=1
  Amp-In vals:  [0x00 0x00] [0x00 0x00]
  Amp-Out caps: ofs=0x1f, nsteps=0x1f, stepsize=0x05, mute=0

  Amp-Out vals:  [0x00 0x00]
  Connection: 2
     0x25 0x0b




Headphones don't mute master sound is quite different from your previous
posts and David 's post

You expect all the 4 audio jacks in the rear panel should be muted when the
headphone is plugged in


>> This first appeared on my upgrade to 9.04

http://git.alsa-project.org/?p=alsa-kernel.git;a=commit;h=2134ea4f37d36addbe86d4901f6c67a22a5db006

since the virtual master volume control and playback switch is to allow
codecs that have no real hardware master volume registers

The virtual master playback switch of reatek codecs 's slave  contains the
following switches

static const char *alc_slave_sws[] = {
       "Front Playback Switch",
       "Surround Playback Switch",
       "Center Playback Switch",
       "LFE Playback Switch",
       "Side Playback Switch",
       "Headphone Playback Switch",
       "Speaker Playback Switch",
       "Mono Playback Switch",
       "iSpeaker Playback Switch",
       NULL,
}


You should notice that the Left/Right balance control of Kmix was removed
because both left/right channels are increase/decrease at the same time when
you moved the volume slider  of the virtual master volume control

Your problem can be solved if someone implement stream_analog_alt_playback
for the headphone so that you can use the new playback device to play audio
to the headphone only

    /* FIXME: setup DAC5 */
    /*spec->stream_analog_alt_playback = &alc880_pcm_analog_alt_playback;*/

This feature is not new , the alt playback device is /dev/adsp in the oss
driver ,

PA will has two sinks for the internal audio , you just switch the profile
to the independent headphone profile or use the sound preference to switch
the audio stream from analog-output sink to independent headphone sink