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From: Avi Kivity <avi@redhat.com>
To: Anthony Liguori <anthony@codemonkey.ws>
Cc: kvm@vger.kernel.org, satoshi.itoh@aist.go.jp,
	t.hirofuchi@aist.go.jp, dlaor@redhat.com,
	Orit Wasserman <owasserm@redhat.com>,
	qemu-devel@nongnu.org, Isaku Yamahata <yamahata@valinux.co.jp>
Subject: Re: [RFC] postcopy livemigration proposal
Date: Mon, 08 Aug 2011 18:36:50 +0300	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <4E400292.1030005@redhat.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <4E4000BF.20708@codemonkey.ws>

On 08/08/2011 06:29 PM, Anthony Liguori wrote:
>
>>>> - Efficient, reduce needed traffic no need to re-send pages.
>>>
>>> It's not quite that simple. Post-copy needs to introduce a protocol
>>> capable of requesting pages.
>>
>> Just another subsection.. (kidding), still it shouldn't be too
>> complicated, just an offset+pagesize and return page_content/error
>
> What I meant by this is that there is potentially a lot of round trip 
> overhead.  Pre-copy migration works well with reasonable high latency 
> network connections because the downtime is capped only by the maximum 
> latency sending from one point to another.
>
> But with something like this, the total downtime is 
> 2*max_latency*nb_pagefaults.  That's potentially pretty high.

Let's be generous and assume that the latency is dominated by page copy 
time.  So the total downtime is equal to the first live migration pass, 
~20 sec for 2GB on 1GbE.  It's distributed over potentially even more 
time, though.  If the guest does a lot of I/O, it may not be noticeable 
(esp. if we don't copy over pages read from disk).  If the guest is 
cpu/memory bound, it'll probably suck badly.

>
> So it may be desirable to try to reduce nb_pagefaults by prefaulting 
> in pages, etc.  Suffice to say, this ends up getting complicated and 
> may end up burning network traffic too.

Yeah, and prefaulting in the background adds latency to synchronous 
requests.

This really needs excellent networking resources to work well.

-- 
error compiling committee.c: too many arguments to function

WARNING: multiple messages have this Message-ID (diff)
From: Avi Kivity <avi@redhat.com>
To: Anthony Liguori <anthony@codemonkey.ws>
Cc: kvm@vger.kernel.org, satoshi.itoh@aist.go.jp,
	t.hirofuchi@aist.go.jp, dlaor@redhat.com,
	Orit Wasserman <owasserm@redhat.com>,
	qemu-devel@nongnu.org, Isaku Yamahata <yamahata@valinux.co.jp>
Subject: Re: [Qemu-devel] [RFC] postcopy livemigration proposal
Date: Mon, 08 Aug 2011 18:36:50 +0300	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <4E400292.1030005@redhat.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <4E4000BF.20708@codemonkey.ws>

On 08/08/2011 06:29 PM, Anthony Liguori wrote:
>
>>>> - Efficient, reduce needed traffic no need to re-send pages.
>>>
>>> It's not quite that simple. Post-copy needs to introduce a protocol
>>> capable of requesting pages.
>>
>> Just another subsection.. (kidding), still it shouldn't be too
>> complicated, just an offset+pagesize and return page_content/error
>
> What I meant by this is that there is potentially a lot of round trip 
> overhead.  Pre-copy migration works well with reasonable high latency 
> network connections because the downtime is capped only by the maximum 
> latency sending from one point to another.
>
> But with something like this, the total downtime is 
> 2*max_latency*nb_pagefaults.  That's potentially pretty high.

Let's be generous and assume that the latency is dominated by page copy 
time.  So the total downtime is equal to the first live migration pass, 
~20 sec for 2GB on 1GbE.  It's distributed over potentially even more 
time, though.  If the guest does a lot of I/O, it may not be noticeable 
(esp. if we don't copy over pages read from disk).  If the guest is 
cpu/memory bound, it'll probably suck badly.

>
> So it may be desirable to try to reduce nb_pagefaults by prefaulting 
> in pages, etc.  Suffice to say, this ends up getting complicated and 
> may end up burning network traffic too.

Yeah, and prefaulting in the background adds latency to synchronous 
requests.

This really needs excellent networking resources to work well.

-- 
error compiling committee.c: too many arguments to function

  reply	other threads:[~2011-08-08 15:36 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 54+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2011-08-08  3:24 [RFC] postcopy livemigration proposal Isaku Yamahata
2011-08-08  3:24 ` [Qemu-devel] " Isaku Yamahata
2011-08-08  9:20 ` Dor Laor
2011-08-08  9:20   ` [Qemu-devel] " Dor Laor
2011-08-08  9:40   ` Yaniv Kaul
2011-08-08  9:40     ` [Qemu-devel] " Yaniv Kaul
2011-08-08 21:42     ` Anthony Liguori
2011-08-08 21:42       ` Anthony Liguori
2011-08-08 10:59   ` Nadav Har'El
2011-08-08 10:59     ` [Qemu-devel] " Nadav Har'El
2011-08-08 11:47     ` Dor Laor
2011-08-08 11:47       ` [Qemu-devel] " Dor Laor
2011-08-08 16:52       ` Cleber Rosa
2011-08-08 15:52         ` Anthony Liguori
2011-08-08 12:32   ` Anthony Liguori
2011-08-08 12:32     ` [Qemu-devel] " Anthony Liguori
2011-08-08 15:11     ` Dor Laor
2011-08-08 15:11       ` Dor Laor
2011-08-08 15:29       ` Anthony Liguori
2011-08-08 15:29         ` Anthony Liguori
2011-08-08 15:36         ` Avi Kivity [this message]
2011-08-08 15:36           ` Avi Kivity
2011-08-08 15:59           ` Anthony Liguori
2011-08-08 15:59             ` Anthony Liguori
2011-08-08 19:47             ` Dor Laor
2011-08-08 19:47               ` [Qemu-devel] " Dor Laor
2011-08-09  2:07               ` Isaku Yamahata
2011-08-09  2:07                 ` Isaku Yamahata
2011-08-08  9:38 ` Stefan Hajnoczi
2011-08-08  9:38   ` Stefan Hajnoczi
2011-08-08  9:43   ` Isaku Yamahata
2011-08-08  9:43     ` Isaku Yamahata
2011-08-08 12:38 ` Avi Kivity
2011-08-08 12:38   ` [Qemu-devel] " Avi Kivity
2011-08-09  2:33   ` Isaku Yamahata
2011-08-09  2:33     ` [Qemu-devel] " Isaku Yamahata
2011-08-10 13:55     ` Avi Kivity
2011-08-10 13:55       ` [Qemu-devel] " Avi Kivity
2011-08-11  2:19       ` Isaku Yamahata
2011-08-11  2:19         ` [Qemu-devel] " Isaku Yamahata
2011-08-11 16:55         ` Andrea Arcangeli
2011-08-11 16:55           ` [Qemu-devel] " Andrea Arcangeli
2011-08-12 11:07 ` [PATCH][RFC] post copy chardevice (was Re: [RFC] postcopy livemigration proposal) Isaku Yamahata
2011-08-12 11:07   ` [Qemu-devel] " Isaku Yamahata
2011-08-12 11:09   ` Isaku Yamahata
2011-08-12 11:09     ` [Qemu-devel] " Isaku Yamahata
2011-08-12 21:26   ` Blue Swirl
2011-08-12 21:26     ` Blue Swirl
2011-08-15 19:29   ` Avi Kivity
2011-08-15 19:29     ` [Qemu-devel] " Avi Kivity
2011-08-16  1:42     ` Isaku Yamahata
2011-08-16  1:42       ` [Qemu-devel] " Isaku Yamahata
2011-08-16 13:40       ` Avi Kivity
2011-08-16 13:40         ` [Qemu-devel] " Avi Kivity

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