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From: Jon Hunter <jon-hunter@ti.com>
To: Arnd Bergmann <arnd@arndb.de>
Cc: Stephen Warren <swarren@wwwdotorg.org>,
	Jassi Brar <jaswinder.singh@linaro.org>,
	Stephen Warren <swarren@nvidia.com>,
	Benoit Cousson <b-cousson@ti.com>,
	device-tree <devicetree-discuss@lists.ozlabs.org>,
	Nicolas Ferre <nicolas.ferre@atmel.com>,
	Rob Herring <rob.herring@calxeda.com>,
	Grant Likely <grant.likely@secretlab.ca>,
	Russell King <linux@arm.linux.org.uk>,
	linux-omap <linux-omap@vger.kernel.org>,
	linux-arm <linux-arm-kernel@lists.infradead.org>
Subject: Re: [PATCH V3 1/2] of: Add generic device tree DMA helpers
Date: Wed, 13 Jun 2012 17:32:22 -0500	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <4FD914F6.6000402@ti.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <201206090004.10086.arnd@arndb.de>

Hi Arnd,

On 06/08/2012 07:04 PM, Arnd Bergmann wrote:
> On Friday 08 June 2012, Jon Hunter wrote:
>> On 05/21/2012 03:32 PM, Stephen Warren wrote:
>>> On 05/21/2012 12:18 PM, Arnd Bergmann wrote:
>>>> On Monday 21 May 2012, Stephen Warren wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> If so, that seems a little odd; you have to request a DMA channel for
>>>>> "TX", but then end up having the common code check all the entries in
>>>>> the dmas property since it can't know which are TX, and then have the
>>>>> wrong ones almost accidentally fail, since the DMAC will then determine
>>>>> that it can't support TX on the RX DMA request IDs.
>>>>
>>>> I think the direction must be encoded in a way that does not depend on
>>>> the binding for the specific controller. There are two ways I can see
>>>> how we might do it:
>>>>
>>>> 1. have separate property names for tx and rx channels, and probably
>>>>    one for combined rx/tx channels
>>>
>>>> 2. define the second cell in each channel specifier to be the direction
>>>>    in a predefined format, followed by the other (controller specific)
>>>>    attributes, if any.
>>>
>>> In this option, lets say bit 0 is 0==TX, 1==RX (or perhaps 2 bits if
>>> combined TX/RX is needed)
>>>
>>> Then, we could reserve say bits 7:1 as client DMA request ID.
>>>
>>> And then have bits 31:8 as DMAC specific data.
>>>
>>> Wouldn't that allow us to have our cake and eat it?
>>
>> Sorry for not responding sooner.
>>
>> It seems to me we were pretty close on alignment. In fact, I was quite
>> happy with Steven's 2nd to last proposal of  ...
>>
>> simple 1 req:
>> dmas = <0 &dmac1 xxx>;
>>
>> simple 2 req:
>> dmas = <0 &dmac1 xxx 1 &dmac1 yyy>;
>>
>> multiple dmacs:
>> dmas = <0 &dmac1 xxx 0 &dmac2 zzz 1 &dmac1 yyy>;
>>
>> Arnd, I know that you had some concerns. However, in the above case I
>> would expect that the 3rd parameter be optional and it can be some sort
>> of match variable. In other words, we don't care how the 32-bits are
>> encoded or what they represent but they would be used appropriately by
>> the xlate function being used. So the xlate and this "match" variable
>> would have to speak the same language.
> 
> I would at least put the &dmac part first to be consistent with other
> bindings that refer to some node. That controller should then be
> able to specify the number of additional cells used to describe the
> dma request. We can define that the first cell after the controller
> phandle is always the same thing, e.g. the direction (in/out/inout)
> or a client-specific ID or a combination of that with other predefined
> bits that are not dependent on dma controller specifics.

I agree with putting the &dmac phandle first, that makes sense.

> As I said previously, I think just encoding the direction but not
> the client specific ID (meaning we would have to disambiguate
> the more complex cases that Stephen mentioned using a dma-names
> property) would be the best because it keeps the common case simple,
> but I could live with other things going in there too.

Ok, so you are saying that there are some DMA controllers where there is
no channel/request ID and only a direction is needed? So an even simpler
case than what I had imagined.

So in that case, I don't see why the first cell after the phandle could
not be an index which could be either a direction or request-id and then
the next cell after that be a secondary match variable.

So simple case with just a index (either req-id or direction) ...

dmas = <&dmac0 index>

More complex case ...

dmas = <&dmac0 index match>

For example, for OMAP index = req-id and match = direction ...

dmas = <&dmac0 req-id direction>

Or am I way off the page?

Cheers
Jon

WARNING: multiple messages have this Message-ID (diff)
From: jon-hunter@ti.com (Jon Hunter)
To: linux-arm-kernel@lists.infradead.org
Subject: [PATCH V3 1/2] of: Add generic device tree DMA helpers
Date: Wed, 13 Jun 2012 17:32:22 -0500	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <4FD914F6.6000402@ti.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <201206090004.10086.arnd@arndb.de>

Hi Arnd,

On 06/08/2012 07:04 PM, Arnd Bergmann wrote:
> On Friday 08 June 2012, Jon Hunter wrote:
>> On 05/21/2012 03:32 PM, Stephen Warren wrote:
>>> On 05/21/2012 12:18 PM, Arnd Bergmann wrote:
>>>> On Monday 21 May 2012, Stephen Warren wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> If so, that seems a little odd; you have to request a DMA channel for
>>>>> "TX", but then end up having the common code check all the entries in
>>>>> the dmas property since it can't know which are TX, and then have the
>>>>> wrong ones almost accidentally fail, since the DMAC will then determine
>>>>> that it can't support TX on the RX DMA request IDs.
>>>>
>>>> I think the direction must be encoded in a way that does not depend on
>>>> the binding for the specific controller. There are two ways I can see
>>>> how we might do it:
>>>>
>>>> 1. have separate property names for tx and rx channels, and probably
>>>>    one for combined rx/tx channels
>>>
>>>> 2. define the second cell in each channel specifier to be the direction
>>>>    in a predefined format, followed by the other (controller specific)
>>>>    attributes, if any.
>>>
>>> In this option, lets say bit 0 is 0==TX, 1==RX (or perhaps 2 bits if
>>> combined TX/RX is needed)
>>>
>>> Then, we could reserve say bits 7:1 as client DMA request ID.
>>>
>>> And then have bits 31:8 as DMAC specific data.
>>>
>>> Wouldn't that allow us to have our cake and eat it?
>>
>> Sorry for not responding sooner.
>>
>> It seems to me we were pretty close on alignment. In fact, I was quite
>> happy with Steven's 2nd to last proposal of  ...
>>
>> simple 1 req:
>> dmas = <0 &dmac1 xxx>;
>>
>> simple 2 req:
>> dmas = <0 &dmac1 xxx 1 &dmac1 yyy>;
>>
>> multiple dmacs:
>> dmas = <0 &dmac1 xxx 0 &dmac2 zzz 1 &dmac1 yyy>;
>>
>> Arnd, I know that you had some concerns. However, in the above case I
>> would expect that the 3rd parameter be optional and it can be some sort
>> of match variable. In other words, we don't care how the 32-bits are
>> encoded or what they represent but they would be used appropriately by
>> the xlate function being used. So the xlate and this "match" variable
>> would have to speak the same language.
> 
> I would at least put the &dmac part first to be consistent with other
> bindings that refer to some node. That controller should then be
> able to specify the number of additional cells used to describe the
> dma request. We can define that the first cell after the controller
> phandle is always the same thing, e.g. the direction (in/out/inout)
> or a client-specific ID or a combination of that with other predefined
> bits that are not dependent on dma controller specifics.

I agree with putting the &dmac phandle first, that makes sense.

> As I said previously, I think just encoding the direction but not
> the client specific ID (meaning we would have to disambiguate
> the more complex cases that Stephen mentioned using a dma-names
> property) would be the best because it keeps the common case simple,
> but I could live with other things going in there too.

Ok, so you are saying that there are some DMA controllers where there is
no channel/request ID and only a direction is needed? So an even simpler
case than what I had imagined.

So in that case, I don't see why the first cell after the phandle could
not be an index which could be either a direction or request-id and then
the next cell after that be a secondary match variable.

So simple case with just a index (either req-id or direction) ...

dmas = <&dmac0 index>

More complex case ...

dmas = <&dmac0 index match>

For example, for OMAP index = req-id and match = direction ...

dmas = <&dmac0 req-id direction>

Or am I way off the page?

Cheers
Jon

  reply	other threads:[~2012-06-13 22:32 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 258+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2012-04-30 21:17 [PATCH V3 1/2] of: Add generic device tree DMA helpers Jon Hunter
2012-04-30 21:17 ` Jon Hunter
2012-05-03 22:26 ` Stephen Warren
2012-05-03 22:26   ` Stephen Warren
     [not found]   ` <4FA30604.1030401-3lzwWm7+Weoh9ZMKESR00Q@public.gmane.org>
2012-05-03 23:25     ` Russell King - ARM Linux
2012-05-03 23:25       ` Russell King - ARM Linux
2012-05-04 12:39     ` Arnd Bergmann
2012-05-04 12:39       ` Arnd Bergmann
2012-05-04 15:06   ` Jon Hunter
2012-05-04 15:06     ` Jon Hunter
     [not found]     ` <4FA3F08D.7030603-l0cyMroinI0@public.gmane.org>
2012-05-04 15:14       ` Russell King - ARM Linux
2012-05-04 15:14         ` Russell King - ARM Linux
2012-05-04 18:21     ` Stephen Warren
2012-05-04 18:21       ` Stephen Warren
2012-05-04 19:19       ` Jon Hunter
2012-05-04 19:19         ` Jon Hunter
2012-05-04  6:56 ` Jassi Brar
2012-05-04  6:56   ` Jassi Brar
2012-05-04 15:17   ` Jon Hunter
2012-05-04 15:17     ` Jon Hunter
2012-05-04 19:01     ` Jassi Brar
2012-05-04 19:01       ` Jassi Brar
2012-05-04 19:23       ` Arnd Bergmann
2012-05-04 19:23         ` Arnd Bergmann
2012-05-05 17:10         ` Jassi Brar
2012-05-05 17:10           ` Jassi Brar
2012-05-07 15:53           ` Stephen Warren
2012-05-07 15:53             ` Stephen Warren
2012-05-07 17:19             ` Jassi Brar
2012-05-07 17:19               ` Jassi Brar
2012-05-08 16:35               ` Stephen Warren
2012-05-08 16:35                 ` Stephen Warren
2012-05-08 19:09                 ` Jassi Brar
2012-05-08 19:09                   ` Jassi Brar
2012-05-09 12:30                   ` Arnd Bergmann
2012-05-09 12:30                     ` Arnd Bergmann
2012-05-09 19:10                   ` Stephen Warren
2012-05-09 19:10                     ` Stephen Warren
2012-05-09 21:38                     ` Jassi Brar
2012-05-09 21:38                       ` Jassi Brar
2012-05-10 17:00                       ` Stephen Warren
2012-05-10 17:00                         ` Stephen Warren
2012-05-10 19:59                         ` Jassi Brar
2012-05-10 19:59                           ` Jassi Brar
2012-05-11 19:28                           ` Stephen Warren
2012-05-11 19:28                             ` Stephen Warren
2012-05-11 21:06                             ` Jassi Brar
2012-05-11 21:06                               ` Jassi Brar
2012-05-11 23:51                               ` Stephen Warren
2012-05-11 23:51                                 ` Stephen Warren
2012-05-12 13:40                                 ` Jassi Brar
2012-05-12 13:40                                   ` Jassi Brar
2012-05-16  1:05                                   ` Jon Hunter
2012-05-16  1:05                                     ` Jon Hunter
2012-05-17 13:18                         ` Russell King - ARM Linux
2012-05-17 13:18                           ` Russell King - ARM Linux
2012-05-07 17:21             ` Arnd Bergmann
2012-05-07 17:21               ` Arnd Bergmann
2012-05-16  1:11       ` Jon Hunter
2012-05-16  1:11         ` Jon Hunter
2012-05-16 12:37         ` Jassi Brar
2012-05-16 12:37           ` Jassi Brar
2012-05-16 13:15           ` Jon Hunter
2012-05-16 13:15             ` Jon Hunter
2012-05-16 15:44             ` Stephen Warren
2012-05-16 15:44               ` Stephen Warren
2012-05-16 16:04               ` Jon Hunter
2012-05-16 16:04                 ` Jon Hunter
2012-05-16 16:01             ` Jon Hunter
2012-05-16 16:01               ` Jon Hunter
2012-05-16 16:15               ` Stephen Warren
2012-05-16 16:15                 ` Stephen Warren
2012-05-16 16:22                 ` Jassi Brar
2012-05-16 16:22                   ` Jassi Brar
2012-05-16 17:09                   ` Jon Hunter
2012-05-16 17:09                     ` Jon Hunter
2012-05-16 19:42                   ` Arnd Bergmann
2012-05-16 19:42                     ` Arnd Bergmann
2012-05-16 21:16                     ` Jassi Brar
2012-05-16 21:16                       ` Jassi Brar
2012-05-17 19:32                       ` Stephen Warren
2012-05-17 19:32                         ` Stephen Warren
2012-05-18 17:12                         ` Jassi Brar
2012-05-18 17:12                           ` Jassi Brar
2012-05-18 21:04                       ` Arnd Bergmann
2012-05-18 21:04                         ` Arnd Bergmann
2012-05-16 23:59                     ` Stephen Warren
2012-05-16 23:59                       ` Stephen Warren
2012-05-17  4:05                       ` Jassi Brar
2012-05-17  4:05                         ` Jassi Brar
2012-05-18 20:49                       ` Arnd Bergmann
2012-05-18 20:49                         ` Arnd Bergmann
2012-05-18 21:07                         ` Stephen Warren
2012-05-18 21:07                           ` Stephen Warren
2012-05-18 21:43                           ` Arnd Bergmann
2012-05-18 21:43                             ` Arnd Bergmann
2012-05-18 22:20                             ` Stephen Warren
2012-05-18 22:20                               ` Stephen Warren
2012-05-19  8:44                               ` Arnd Bergmann
2012-05-19  8:44                                 ` Arnd Bergmann
2012-05-21 17:33                                 ` Stephen Warren
2012-05-21 17:33                                   ` Stephen Warren
2012-05-21 18:18                                   ` Arnd Bergmann
2012-05-21 18:18                                     ` Arnd Bergmann
2012-05-21 20:32                                     ` Stephen Warren
2012-05-21 20:32                                       ` Stephen Warren
2012-06-08 19:04                                       ` Jon Hunter
2012-06-08 19:04                                         ` Jon Hunter
2012-06-09  0:04                                         ` Arnd Bergmann
2012-06-09  0:04                                           ` Arnd Bergmann
2012-06-13 22:32                                           ` Jon Hunter [this message]
2012-06-13 22:32                                             ` Jon Hunter
2012-06-14  4:45                                             ` Jassi Brar
2012-06-14  4:45                                               ` Jassi Brar
2012-06-14 11:48                                             ` Arnd Bergmann
2012-06-14 11:48                                               ` Arnd Bergmann
2012-06-14 15:39                                               ` Jon Hunter
2012-06-14 15:39                                                 ` Jon Hunter
2012-06-15  8:40                                                 ` Arnd Bergmann
2012-06-15  8:40                                                   ` Arnd Bergmann
2012-06-22 22:52                                               ` Jon Hunter
2012-06-22 22:52                                                 ` Jon Hunter
     [not found]                                                 ` <4FE4F718.3080204-l0cyMroinI0@public.gmane.org>
2012-06-22 23:12                                                   ` Russell King - ARM Linux
2012-06-22 23:12                                                     ` Russell King - ARM Linux
2012-06-25 16:51                                                     ` Jon Hunter
2012-06-25 16:51                                                       ` Jon Hunter
2012-06-25 18:04                                                       ` Vinod Koul
2012-06-25 18:04                                                         ` Vinod Koul
2012-06-25 20:30                                                         ` Arnd Bergmann
2012-06-25 20:30                                                           ` Arnd Bergmann
2012-06-26  9:40                                                           ` Vinod Koul
2012-06-26  9:40                                                             ` Vinod Koul
2012-06-26 14:59                                                             ` Arnd Bergmann
2012-06-26 14:59                                                               ` Arnd Bergmann
2012-06-26 17:50                                                               ` Vinod Koul
2012-06-26 17:50                                                                 ` Vinod Koul
2012-06-26 20:27                                                                 ` Arnd Bergmann
2012-06-26 20:27                                                                   ` Arnd Bergmann
2012-06-27 13:45                                                                   ` Vinod Koul
2012-06-27 13:45                                                                     ` Vinod Koul
2012-06-27 15:20                                                                     ` Arnd Bergmann
2012-06-27 15:20                                                                       ` Arnd Bergmann
2012-07-13  6:45                                                                       ` Vinod Koul
2012-07-13  6:45                                                                         ` Vinod Koul
2012-07-13 21:52                                                                         ` Guennadi Liakhovetski
2012-07-13 21:52                                                                           ` Guennadi Liakhovetski
2012-07-17 19:24                                                                         ` Arnd Bergmann
2012-07-17 19:24                                                                           ` Arnd Bergmann
2012-07-20  4:00                                                                           ` Vinod Koul
2012-07-20  4:00                                                                             ` Vinod Koul
2012-07-20  8:39                                                                             ` Arnd Bergmann
2012-07-20  8:39                                                                               ` Arnd Bergmann
2012-07-20  9:37                                                                               ` Vinod Koul
2012-07-20  9:37                                                                                 ` Vinod Koul
2012-07-24 19:07                                                                                 ` Jon Hunter
2012-07-24 19:07                                                                                   ` Jon Hunter
2012-07-24 19:27                                                                                   ` Arnd Bergmann
2012-07-24 19:27                                                                                     ` Arnd Bergmann
2012-07-26  6:42                                                                                   ` Vinod Koul
2012-07-26  6:42                                                                                     ` Vinod Koul
2012-07-26  7:14                                                                                     ` Arnd Bergmann
2012-07-26  7:14                                                                                       ` Arnd Bergmann
2012-07-26 11:28                                                                                       ` Vinod Koul
2012-07-26 11:28                                                                                         ` Vinod Koul
2012-07-26 15:53                                                                                         ` Jon Hunter
2012-07-26 15:53                                                                                           ` Jon Hunter
     [not found]                                                                                           ` <5011680A.6040400-l0cyMroinI0@public.gmane.org>
2012-07-31 11:06                                                                                             ` Vinod Koul
2012-07-31 11:06                                                                                               ` Vinod Koul
2012-07-26 17:43                                                                                     ` Jon Hunter
2012-07-26 17:43                                                                                       ` Jon Hunter
2012-07-31 11:12                                                                                       ` Vinod Koul
2012-07-31 11:12                                                                                         ` Vinod Koul
2012-08-01 20:43                                                                                         ` Jon Hunter
2012-08-01 20:43                                                                                           ` Jon Hunter
2012-08-03  9:55                                                                                           ` Vinod Koul
2012-08-03  9:55                                                                                             ` Vinod Koul
2012-07-20  9:08                                                                             ` Robert Jarzmik
2012-07-20  9:08                                                                               ` Robert Jarzmik
2012-07-20  9:41                                                                               ` Vinod Koul
2012-07-20  9:41                                                                                 ` Vinod Koul
2012-07-26  4:56                                                                             ` zhangfei gao
2012-07-26  4:56                                                                               ` zhangfei gao
2012-07-23 21:29                                                                           ` Stephen Warren
2012-07-23 21:29                                                                             ` Stephen Warren
2012-07-24  7:19                                                                             ` Arnd Bergmann
2012-07-24  7:19                                                                               ` Arnd Bergmann
2012-07-24 16:04                                                                               ` Stephen Warren
2012-07-24 16:04                                                                                 ` Stephen Warren
2012-07-24 18:55                                                                                 ` Arnd Bergmann
2012-07-24 18:55                                                                                   ` Arnd Bergmann
2012-07-24 12:54                                                                             ` Sergei Shtylyov
2012-07-24 12:54                                                                               ` Sergei Shtylyov
2012-07-06 11:36                                                           ` Guennadi Liakhovetski
2012-07-06 11:36                                                             ` Guennadi Liakhovetski
     [not found]                                                             ` <Pine.LNX.4.64.1207061315470.29809-0199iw4Nj15frtckUFj5Ag@public.gmane.org>
2012-07-06 15:28                                                               ` Arnd Bergmann
2012-07-06 15:28                                                                 ` Arnd Bergmann
     [not found]                                                                 ` <201207061528.58291.arnd-r2nGTMty4D4@public.gmane.org>
2012-07-06 15:43                                                                   ` Guennadi Liakhovetski
2012-07-06 15:43                                                                     ` Guennadi Liakhovetski
2012-07-06 17:31                                                                     ` Arnd Bergmann
2012-07-06 17:31                                                                       ` Arnd Bergmann
2012-07-06 21:01                                                                     ` Russell King - ARM Linux
2012-07-06 21:01                                                                       ` Russell King - ARM Linux
2012-07-06 20:57                                                               ` Russell King - ARM Linux
2012-07-06 20:57                                                                 ` Russell King - ARM Linux
2012-07-06 22:49                                                                 ` Guennadi Liakhovetski
2012-07-06 22:49                                                                   ` Guennadi Liakhovetski
2012-07-13  6:51                                                             ` Vinod Koul
2012-07-13  6:51                                                               ` Vinod Koul
2012-06-14 15:17                                           ` Guennadi Liakhovetski
2012-06-14 15:17                                             ` Guennadi Liakhovetski
2012-06-14 21:52                                             ` Jon Hunter
2012-06-14 21:52                                               ` Jon Hunter
2012-06-15  8:41                                               ` Guennadi Liakhovetski
2012-06-15  8:41                                                 ` Guennadi Liakhovetski
2012-06-15  9:00                                               ` Arnd Bergmann
2012-06-15  9:00                                                 ` Arnd Bergmann
2012-06-15  9:18                                                 ` Guennadi Liakhovetski
2012-06-15  9:18                                                   ` Guennadi Liakhovetski
2012-06-15 11:27                                                   ` Arnd Bergmann
2012-06-15 11:27                                                     ` Arnd Bergmann
     [not found]                                                     ` <201206151127.24386.arnd-r2nGTMty4D4@public.gmane.org>
2012-06-15 16:11                                                       ` Mitch Bradley
2012-06-15 16:11                                                         ` Mitch Bradley
     [not found]                                                         ` <4FDB5ECF.3000701-D5eQfiDGL7eakBO8gow8eQ@public.gmane.org>
2012-06-16  6:56                                                           ` Arnd Bergmann
2012-06-16  6:56                                                             ` Arnd Bergmann
2012-06-21 11:21                                                     ` Guennadi Liakhovetski
2012-06-21 11:21                                                       ` Guennadi Liakhovetski
2012-06-21 14:56                                                       ` Arnd Bergmann
2012-06-21 14:56                                                         ` Arnd Bergmann
     [not found]                     ` <201205161942.20296.arnd-r2nGTMty4D4@public.gmane.org>
2012-05-17 13:22                       ` Russell King - ARM Linux
2012-05-17 13:22                         ` Russell King - ARM Linux
2012-05-17 13:52                         ` Mark Brown
2012-05-17 13:52                           ` Mark Brown
2012-05-17 14:16                           ` Russell King - ARM Linux
2012-05-17 14:16                             ` Russell King - ARM Linux
2012-05-16 16:16               ` Jassi Brar
2012-05-16 16:16                 ` Jassi Brar
2012-05-16 17:12                 ` Jon Hunter
2012-05-16 17:12                   ` Jon Hunter
2012-05-16 17:24                   ` Jassi Brar
2012-05-16 17:24                     ` Jassi Brar
2012-05-16 17:37                     ` Jon Hunter
2012-05-16 17:37                       ` Jon Hunter
2012-05-16 17:46                       ` Stephen Warren
2012-05-16 17:46                         ` Stephen Warren
2012-05-16 18:03                         ` Jon Hunter
2012-05-16 18:03                           ` Jon Hunter
2012-05-04 15:22   ` Jon Hunter
2012-05-04 15:22     ` Jon Hunter
2012-05-04 15:56 ` Arnd Bergmann
2012-05-04 15:56   ` Arnd Bergmann
2012-05-04 17:19   ` Jon Hunter
2012-05-04 17:19     ` Jon Hunter
2012-05-04 19:06     ` Arnd Bergmann
2012-05-04 19:06       ` Arnd Bergmann
2012-05-04 19:26       ` Jon Hunter
2012-05-04 19:26         ` Jon Hunter
2012-05-04 18:30   ` Stephen Warren
2012-05-04 18:30     ` Stephen Warren

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