* [Printing-architecture] pwgtoraster vs calibrated spaces
@ 2014-05-31 9:30 James Cloos
2014-06-02 1:29 ` James Cloos
0 siblings, 1 reply; 12+ messages in thread
From: James Cloos @ 2014-05-31 9:30 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: printing-architecture
I was wrong about sGray. It turns out that sGray is not defined as
having the same curve as sRGB, but rather it always has gamma 2.2.
The cupsraster document says srgb gamma/whitepoint, and the pwg raster
doc says srgb grayscale. But everything else I've found says 2.2.
And it seems a D50 illuminate.
That being said, this colorspace dictionary:
[ /CalGray
<< /WhitePoint [ 0.96420288 1.0 0.82490540 ]
/Gamma 2.2
>>
]
in stead of /DeviceGray should work for converting sGray pages to pdf.
For AdobeRGB, you can use this:
[ /CalRGB
<< /WhitePoint [ 0.95045471 1.0 1.08905029 ]
/Gamma [ 2.2 2.2 2.2 ]
>>
endobj
For sRGB, though, you'll have to embed the icc file.
AFAICT, put the space in an object and specify a ref to that object
where you currently specify /DeviceRGB, usw.
-JimC
--
James Cloos <cloos@jhcloos.com> OpenPGP: 0x997A9F17ED7DAEA6
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 12+ messages in thread* Re: [Printing-architecture] pwgtoraster vs calibrated spaces
2014-05-31 9:30 [Printing-architecture] pwgtoraster vs calibrated spaces James Cloos
@ 2014-06-02 1:29 ` James Cloos
2014-06-02 11:53 ` Michael Sweet
0 siblings, 1 reply; 12+ messages in thread
From: James Cloos @ 2014-06-02 1:29 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: printing-architecture
>>>>> "JC" == James Cloos <cloos@jhcloos.com> writes:
JC> [ /CalGray
JC> << /WhitePoint [ 0.96420288 1.0 0.82490540 ]
JC> /Gamma 2.2
JC> >>
JC> ]
JC> [ /CalRGB
JC> << /WhitePoint [ 0.95045471 1.0 1.08905029 ]
JC> /Gamma [ 2.2 2.2 2.2 ]
JC> >>
JC> ]
I forgot the matrix in that last one. Add:
/Matrix [ 0.60974121 0.31111145 0.01947021 0.20527649 0.62567139 0.06086731 0.14918518 0.06321716 0.74456785 ]
to that /CalRGB.
-JimC
--
James Cloos <cloos@jhcloos.com> OpenPGP: 0x997A9F17ED7DAEA6
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 12+ messages in thread* Re: [Printing-architecture] pwgtoraster vs calibrated spaces
2014-06-02 1:29 ` James Cloos
@ 2014-06-02 11:53 ` Michael Sweet
2014-06-02 18:24 ` James Cloos
0 siblings, 1 reply; 12+ messages in thread
From: Michael Sweet @ 2014-06-02 11:53 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: James Cloos; +Cc: printing-architecture@lists.linux-foundation.org
[-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 1442 bytes --]
James,
What standard defines sGray? Because all of the informal definitions online and the one we (Apple) went with some 12 years ago says that sGray uses the sRGB transfer function (gamma). Anything else would be simply confusing.
(of course gamma 2.2 is so close to sRGB's transfer function that it doesn't really matter, but I'm really interested in knowing why you think the CUPS definition of sGray is wrong...)
On Jun 1, 2014, at 9:29 PM, James Cloos <cloos@jhcloos.com> wrote:
>>>>>> "JC" == James Cloos <cloos@jhcloos.com> writes:
>
> JC> [ /CalGray
> JC> << /WhitePoint [ 0.96420288 1.0 0.82490540 ]
> JC> /Gamma 2.2
> JC> >>
> JC> ]
>
> JC> [ /CalRGB
> JC> << /WhitePoint [ 0.95045471 1.0 1.08905029 ]
> JC> /Gamma [ 2.2 2.2 2.2 ]
> JC> >>
> JC> ]
>
> I forgot the matrix in that last one. Add:
>
> /Matrix [ 0.60974121 0.31111145 0.01947021 0.20527649 0.62567139 0.06086731 0.14918518 0.06321716 0.74456785 ]
>
> to that /CalRGB.
>
> -JimC
> --
> James Cloos <cloos@jhcloos.com> OpenPGP: 0x997A9F17ED7DAEA6
> _______________________________________________
> Printing-architecture mailing list
> Printing-architecture@lists.linux-foundation.org
> https://lists.linuxfoundation.org/mailman/listinfo/printing-architecture
_________________________________________________________
Michael Sweet, Senior Printing System Engineer, PWG Chair
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^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 12+ messages in thread
* Re: [Printing-architecture] pwgtoraster vs calibrated spaces
2014-06-02 11:53 ` Michael Sweet
@ 2014-06-02 18:24 ` James Cloos
2014-06-02 18:34 ` Michael Sweet
0 siblings, 1 reply; 12+ messages in thread
From: James Cloos @ 2014-06-02 18:24 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Michael Sweet; +Cc: printing-architecture
>>>>> "MS" == Michael Sweet <msweet@apple.com> writes:
MS> What standard defines sGray?
Every search I did returned gs's sgray (which is a simple 2.2 with the
whitepoint I mentioned) and references to multi-ink black-and-white
photograph printing which all said 2.2. I do not recall mention of
the whitepoint for most of the latter, but one implied Lab(1.0,0.0,0.0).
(or Lab(100.0,0.0,0.0) if one prefers [0 100 -127 127 -127 127].)
I didn't see *any* search results referencing srgb's transfer function
except the cupsraster document. The pwg raster document didn't show
up in the search.
I found no evidence, when I searched, that Apple prefers otherwise.
And some of the photographers mentioned using osx.
-JimC
--
James Cloos <cloos@jhcloos.com> OpenPGP: 0x997A9F17ED7DAEA6
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 12+ messages in thread
* Re: [Printing-architecture] pwgtoraster vs calibrated spaces
2014-06-02 18:24 ` James Cloos
@ 2014-06-02 18:34 ` Michael Sweet
2014-06-02 19:04 ` James Cloos
0 siblings, 1 reply; 12+ messages in thread
From: Michael Sweet @ 2014-06-02 18:34 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: James Cloos; +Cc: printing-architecture@lists.linux-foundation.org
[-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 1413 bytes --]
James,
A simple search of "sgray color space" yields a page of links that all mention sGray as a version of sRGB. And while I respect the work that the Ghostscript developers do, their support for sGray came long after it was already in gdevcups and the rest of the raster filters used by CUPS. I would suggest filing a bug with the Ghostscript developers...
On Jun 2, 2014, at 2:24 PM, James Cloos <cloos@jhcloos.com> wrote:
>>>>>> "MS" == Michael Sweet <msweet@apple.com> writes:
>
> MS> What standard defines sGray?
>
> Every search I did returned gs's sgray (which is a simple 2.2 with the
> whitepoint I mentioned) and references to multi-ink black-and-white
> photograph printing which all said 2.2. I do not recall mention of
> the whitepoint for most of the latter, but one implied Lab(1.0,0.0,0.0).
> (or Lab(100.0,0.0,0.0) if one prefers [0 100 -127 127 -127 127].)
>
> I didn't see *any* search results referencing srgb's transfer function
> except the cupsraster document. The pwg raster document didn't show
> up in the search.
>
> I found no evidence, when I searched, that Apple prefers otherwise.
> And some of the photographers mentioned using osx.
>
> -JimC
> --
> James Cloos <cloos@jhcloos.com> OpenPGP: 0x997A9F17ED7DAEA6
_________________________________________________________
Michael Sweet, Senior Printing System Engineer, PWG Chair
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^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 12+ messages in thread
* Re: [Printing-architecture] pwgtoraster vs calibrated spaces
2014-06-02 18:34 ` Michael Sweet
@ 2014-06-02 19:04 ` James Cloos
2014-06-03 0:44 ` James Cloos
0 siblings, 1 reply; 12+ messages in thread
From: James Cloos @ 2014-06-02 19:04 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Michael Sweet; +Cc: printing-architecture@lists.linux-foundation.org
>>>>> "MS" == Michael Sweet <msweet@apple.com> writes:
MS> A simple search of "sgray color space" yields a page of links that all
MS> mention sGray as a version of sRGB.
I didn't see anything like that. But I tried sgray colorspace, sgray icc
and sgray.icc.
Even with the space in color space, I'm not finding the page you mention.
I did just find a github project with an sGray.icc which is © Adobe and
uses a chad and a 1024-entry curve. The icc seems to be part of Sun's
com/sun/pdfview java.
There is a page which says photoshop has a (hard to access) sgray icc,
but doesn't characterize it at all.
Most of the hits still reference gs.
Goog can tell I'm coming from a linux box; perhaps that colours ☺ the
results I get vs the results you get?
-JimC
--
James Cloos <cloos@jhcloos.com> OpenPGP: 0x997A9F17ED7DAEA6
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 12+ messages in thread
* Re: [Printing-architecture] pwgtoraster vs calibrated spaces
2014-06-02 19:04 ` James Cloos
@ 2014-06-03 0:44 ` James Cloos
2014-06-03 2:49 ` Chris Murphy
2014-06-03 11:51 ` Kai-Uwe Behrmann
0 siblings, 2 replies; 12+ messages in thread
From: James Cloos @ 2014-06-03 0:44 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: printing-architecture
[-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 184 bytes --]
This is an attempt at an sGray icc Based on Argyll's sRGB.
Corrections or verifications welcome.
If valid, or once fixed, rastertopdf should embed it when dealing with
sGray pages.
[-- Attachment #2: sGray.icc --]
[-- Type: application/vnd.iccprofile, Size: 2596 bytes --]
[-- Attachment #3: sGray.xml --]
[-- Type: application/xml, Size: 9089 bytes --]
<?xml version="1.0" encoding="UTF-8"?>
<IccProfile>
<Header>
<PreferredCMMType>lcms</PreferredCMMType>
<ProfileVersion>3.40</ProfileVersion>
<ProfileDeviceClass>mntr</ProfileDeviceClass>
<DataColourSpace>sGray</DataColourSpace>
<PCS>XYZ </PCS>
<CreationDateTime>2014-06-02T23:47:17</CreationDateTime>
<PrimaryPlatform>APPL</PrimaryPlatform>
<ProfileFlags EmbeddedInFile="false" UseWithEmbeddedDataOnly="false"/>
<DeviceManufacturer>lcms</DeviceManufacturer>
<DeviceAttributes ReflectiveOrTransparency="reflective" GlossyOrMatte="glossy" MediaPolarity="positive" MediaColour="colour"/>
<RenderingIntent>Perceptual</RenderingIntent>
<PCSIlluminant>
<XYZNumber X="0.96420288" Y="1.00000000" Z="0.82490540"/>
</PCSIlluminant>
<ProfileCreator>lcms</ProfileCreator>
</Header>
<Tags>
<textDescriptionType>
<TagSignature>desc</TagSignature>
<ASCII><![CDATA[Gray]]></ASCII>
</textDescriptionType>
<textType>
<TagSignature>cprt</TagSignature>
<ASCII><![CDATA[Public Domain. No Warranty, Use at own risk.]]></ASCII>
</textType>
<signatureType>
<TagSignature>tech</TagSignature>
<Signature>CRT </Signature>
</signatureType>
<viewingConditionsType>
<TagSignature>view</TagSignature>
<IlluminantXYZ X="19.64251709" Y="20.37182617" Z="16.80471802"/>
<SurroundXYZ X="3.92849731" Y="4.07437134" Z="3.36094666"/>
<IllumType>Illuminant D50</IllumType>
</viewingConditionsType>
<XYZType>
<TagSignature>lumi</TagSignature>
<XYZNumber X="76.03999329" Y="80.00000000" Z="87.11999512"/>
</XYZType>
<measurementType>
<TagSignature>meas</TagSignature>
<StandardObserver>CIE 1931 standard colorimetric observer</StandardObserver>
<MeasurementBacking X="0.00000000" Y="0.00000000" Z="0.00000000"/>
<Geometry>Geometry Unknown</Geometry>
<Flare>Unknown Flare '655'</Flare>
<StandardIlluminant>Illuminant D65</StandardIlluminant>
</measurementType>
<XYZType>
<TagSignature>wtpt</TagSignature>
<XYZNumber X="0.95045471" Y="1.00000000" Z="1.08905029"/>
</XYZType>
<XYZType>
<TagSignature>bkpt</TagSignature>
<XYZNumber X="0.00000000" Y="0.00000000" Z="0.00000000"/>
</XYZType>
<curveType>
<TagSignature>kTRC</TagSignature>
<Curve>
0 5 10 15 20 25 30 35 40 45 50 55 59 64 69 74
79 84 89 94 99 104 109 114 119 124 129 134 139 144 149 154
159 164 169 174 178 183 188 193 198 203 208 213 219 224 229 235
240 246 251 257 263 269 275 281 287 293 299 306 312 318 325 332
338 345 352 359 366 373 380 387 395 402 410 417 425 433 441 449
457 465 473 481 489 498 506 515 524 532 541 550 559 568 577 587
596 605 615 625 634 644 654 664 674 684 694 705 715 725 736 747
757 768 779 790 801 813 824 835 847 858 870 882 894 906 918 930
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9767 9815 9863 9911 9960 10008 10057 10106 10155 10204 10253 10303 10353 10402 10452 10502
10552 10603 10653 10704 10754 10805 10856 10907 10959 11010 11062 11113 11165 11217 11269 11321
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24172 24253 24335 24417 24499 24581 24663 24746 24828 24911 24994 25077 25161 25244 25328 25411
25495 25579 25664 25748 25833 25917 26002 26087 26173 26258 26344 26429 26515 26601 26687 26774
26860 26947 27034 27121 27208 27295 27383 27471 27559 27647 27735 27823 27912 28000 28089 28178
28267 28356 28446 28536 28625 28715 28806 28896 28986 29077 29168 29259 29350 29441 29533 29624
29716 29808 29900 29992 30085 30177 30270 30363 30456 30550 30643 30737 30830 30924 31018 31113
31207 31302 31397 31492 31587 31682 31777 31873 31969 32065 32161 32257 32354 32450 32547 32644
32741 32839 32936 33034 33131 33229 33328 33426 33524 33623 33722 33821 33920 34019 34119 34219
34318 34418 34519 34619 34719 34820 34921 35022 35123 35225 35326 35428 35530 35632 35734 35836
35939 36042 36145 36248 36351 36454 36558 36662 36766 36870 36974 37078 37183 37288 37393 37498
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39312 39420 39528 39637 39746 39855 39964 40073 40183 40292 40402 40512 40622 40733 40843 40954
41065 41176 41287 41398 41510 41622 41734 41846 41958 42070 42183 42296 42409 42522 42635 42749
42862 42976 43090 43204 43319 43433 43548 43663 43778 43893 44009 44124 44240 44356 44472 44589
44705 44822 44939 45056 45173 45290 45408 45526 45643 45762 45880 45998 46117 46236 46355 46474
46593 46713 46832 46952 47072 47193 47313 47434 47554 47675 47797 47918 48039 48161 48283 48405
48527 48650 48772 48895 49018 49141 49264 49388 49511 49635 49759 49883 50008 50132 50257 50382
50507 50632 50758 50883 51009 51135 51261 51388 51514 51641 51768 51895 52022 52150 52277 52405
52533 52661 52790 52918 53047 53176 53305 53434 53564 53694 53823 53953 54084 54214 54345 54475
54606 54737 54869 55000 55132 55264 55396 55528 55660 55793 55926 56059 56192 56325 56458 56592
56726 56860 56994 57129 57263 57398 57533 57668 57804 57939 58075 58211 58347 58483 58620 58756
58893 59030 59167 59305 59442 59580 59718 59856 59995 60133 60272 60411 60550 60689 60828 60968
61108 61248 61388 61528 61669 61810 61951 62092 62233 62375 62516 62658 62800 62942 63085 63227
63370 63513 63656 63800 63943 64087 64231 64375 64519 64664 64809 64954 65099 65244 65389 65535
</Curve>
</curveType>
</Tags>
</IccProfile>
[-- Attachment #4: Type: text/plain, Size: 78 bytes --]
-JimC
--
James Cloos <cloos@jhcloos.com> OpenPGP: 0x997A9F17ED7DAEA6
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 12+ messages in thread* Re: [Printing-architecture] pwgtoraster vs calibrated spaces
2014-06-03 0:44 ` James Cloos
@ 2014-06-03 2:49 ` Chris Murphy
2014-06-03 11:51 ` Kai-Uwe Behrmann
1 sibling, 0 replies; 12+ messages in thread
From: Chris Murphy @ 2014-06-03 2:49 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: printing-architecture@lists.linux-foundation.org
On Jun 2, 2014, at 6:44 PM, James Cloos <cloos@jhcloos.com> wrote:
> This is an attempt at an sGray icc Based on Argyll's sRGB.
>
> Corrections or verifications welcome.
>
> If valid, or once fixed, rastertopdf should embed it when dealing with
> sGray pages.
>
> <sGray.icc><sGray.xml>
Although only Y should matter, there is a difference in the X and Z values in the lumi tag.
Chris Murphy
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 12+ messages in thread
* Re: [Printing-architecture] pwgtoraster vs calibrated spaces
2014-06-03 0:44 ` James Cloos
2014-06-03 2:49 ` Chris Murphy
@ 2014-06-03 11:51 ` Kai-Uwe Behrmann
2014-06-03 17:15 ` Chris Murphy
2014-06-05 9:23 ` James Cloos
1 sibling, 2 replies; 12+ messages in thread
From: Kai-Uwe Behrmann @ 2014-06-03 11:51 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: James Cloos, printing-architecture
[-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 1764 bytes --]
Am 03.06.2014 02:44, schrieb James Cloos:
> This is an attempt at an sGray icc Based on Argyll's sRGB.
>
> Corrections or verifications welcome.
>
> If valid, or once fixed, rastertopdf should embed it when dealing with
> sGray pages.
>
>
>
>
Color space is not standard.
Data Color Space should be GRAY.
$ iccDumpProfile -v /tmp/sGray.icc
Profile: '/tmp/sGray.icc'
Profile ID: Profile ID not calculated.
Size: 2596(0xa24) bytes
Header
------
Attributes: Reflective | Glossy
Cmm: Little CMS
Creation Date: 6/2/2014 23:47:17
Creator: 'lcms' = 6C636D73
Data Color Space: Unknown 'sGra' = 73477261
Flags EmbeddedProfileFalse | UseAnywhere
PCS Color Space: XYZData
Platform: Macintosh
Rendering Intent: Perceptual
Type: DisplayClass
Version: 3.40
Illuminant: X=0.9642, Y=1.0000, Z=0.8249
Profile Tags
------------
Tag ID Offset Size
---- ------ ------ ----
profileDescriptionTag 'desc' 240 95
copyrightTag 'cprt' 336 53
technologyTag 'tech' 392 12
viewingConditionsTag 'view' 404 36
luminanceTag 'lumi' 440 20
measurementTag 'meas' 460 36
mediaWhitePointTag 'wtpt' 496 20
mediaBlackPointTag 'bkpt' 516 20
grayTRCTag 'kTRC' 536 2060
Validation Report
-----------------
Profile has Critical Error(s) that violate ICC specificaiton.
Error! - - Unknown 'sGra' = 73477261: Unknown color space!
Error! - Critical tag(s) missing.
kind regards
Kai-Uwe
[-- Attachment #2: Type: text/html, Size: 4585 bytes --]
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 12+ messages in thread* Re: [Printing-architecture] pwgtoraster vs calibrated spaces
2014-06-03 11:51 ` Kai-Uwe Behrmann
@ 2014-06-03 17:15 ` Chris Murphy
2014-06-05 9:23 ` James Cloos
1 sibling, 0 replies; 12+ messages in thread
From: Chris Murphy @ 2014-06-03 17:15 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: printing-architecture@lists.linux-foundation.org
On Jun 3, 2014, at 5:51 AM, Kai-Uwe Behrmann <ku.b-list@gmx.de> wrote:
> Am 03.06.2014 02:44, schrieb James Cloos:
>> This is an attempt at an sGray icc Based on Argyll's sRGB.
>>
>> Corrections or verifications welcome.
>>
>> If valid, or once fixed, rastertopdf should embed it when dealing with
>> sGray pages.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
> Color space is not standard.
> Data Color Space should be GRAY.
Yes definitely good catch. That field also seems to have single quotes in it.
Chris Murphy
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 12+ messages in thread
* Re: [Printing-architecture] pwgtoraster vs calibrated spaces
2014-06-03 11:51 ` Kai-Uwe Behrmann
2014-06-03 17:15 ` Chris Murphy
@ 2014-06-05 9:23 ` James Cloos
2014-06-05 11:59 ` Kai-Uwe Behrmann
1 sibling, 1 reply; 12+ messages in thread
From: James Cloos @ 2014-06-05 9:23 UTC (permalink / raw)
To: Kai-Uwe Behrmann; +Cc: printing-architecture
>>>>> "KB" == Kai-Uwe Behrmann <ku.b-list@gmx.de> writes:
KB> Data Color Space: Unknown 'sGra' = 73477261
So Data Color Space is a 32bit int, then?
Fixed.
As I wrote, I based this on the xml conversion of the sRGB shipped with
Argyll.
Are the viewingConditionsType and measurementType sections of value?
That seems to be where some of the issues are.
-JimC
--
James Cloos <cloos@jhcloos.com> OpenPGP: 0x997A9F17ED7DAEA6
^ permalink raw reply [flat|nested] 12+ messages in thread
end of thread, other threads:[~2014-06-05 11:59 UTC | newest]
Thread overview: 12+ messages (download: mbox.gz follow: Atom feed
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2014-05-31 9:30 [Printing-architecture] pwgtoraster vs calibrated spaces James Cloos
2014-06-02 1:29 ` James Cloos
2014-06-02 11:53 ` Michael Sweet
2014-06-02 18:24 ` James Cloos
2014-06-02 18:34 ` Michael Sweet
2014-06-02 19:04 ` James Cloos
2014-06-03 0:44 ` James Cloos
2014-06-03 2:49 ` Chris Murphy
2014-06-03 11:51 ` Kai-Uwe Behrmann
2014-06-03 17:15 ` Chris Murphy
2014-06-05 9:23 ` James Cloos
2014-06-05 11:59 ` Kai-Uwe Behrmann
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