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From: Anna Schumaker <Anna.Schumaker-HgOvQuBEEgTQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org>
To: "Pádraig Brady" <P@draigBrady.com>,
	linux-nfs-u79uwXL29TY76Z2rM5mHXA@public.gmane.org,
	linux-btrfs-u79uwXL29TY76Z2rM5mHXA@public.gmane.org,
	linux-fsdevel-u79uwXL29TY76Z2rM5mHXA@public.gmane.org,
	linux-api-u79uwXL29TY76Z2rM5mHXA@public.gmane.org,
	zab-ugsP4Wv/S6ZeoWH0uzbU5w@public.gmane.org,
	viro-RmSDqhL/yNMiFSDQTTA3OLVCufUGDwFn@public.gmane.org,
	clm-b10kYP2dOMg@public.gmane.org,
	darrick.wong-QHcLZuEGTsvQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org,
	mtk.manpages-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org,
	andros-HgOvQuBEEgTQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org,
	hch-wEGCiKHe2LqWVfeAwA7xHQ@public.gmane.org
Subject: Re: [PATCH v1 0/8] VFS: In-kernel copy system call
Date: Tue, 8 Sep 2015 14:23:23 -0400	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <55EF279B.3020101@Netapp.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <55EEFCEE.5090000-V8g9lnOeT5ydJdNcDFJN0w@public.gmane.org>

On 09/08/2015 11:21 AM, Pádraig Brady wrote:
> On 04/09/15 21:16, Anna Schumaker wrote:
>> Copy system calls came up during Plumbers a couple of weeks ago, because
>> several filesystems (including NFS and XFS) are currently working on copy
>> acceleration implementations.  We haven't heard from Zach Brown in a while,
>> so I volunteered to push his patches upstream so individual filesystems
>> don't need to keep writing their own ioctls.
> 
> Just mentioning that this is just pertaining to the data, not the metadata.
> Providing metadata copying facilities would be _very_ useful, as
> most file system specific details relate to the metadata, and having
> VFS operations for that would avoid the plethora of details in each userspace tool,
> and theoretically support translations between disparate metadata.

Metadata copying could be added later if somebody really wants it.

> 
>> The first three patches are a simple reposting of Zach's patches from several
>> months ago, with one minor error code fix.  The remaining patches add in a
>> fallback mechanism when filesystems don't provide a copy function.  This is
>> especially useful when doing a server-side copy on NFS (using the new COPY
>> operation in NFS v4.2).  This fallback can be disabled by passing the flag
>> COPY_REFLINK to the system call.
> 
> I see copy_file_range() is a reflink() on BTRFS?
> That's a bit surprising, as it avoids the copy completely.
> cp(1) for example considered doing a BTRFS clone by default,
> but didn't due to expectations that users actually wanted
> the data duplicated on disk for resilience reasons,
> and for performance reasons so that write latencies were
> restricted to the copy operation, rather than being
> introduced at usage time as the dest file is CoW'd.
> 
> If reflink() is a possibility for copy_file_range()
> then could it be done optionally with a flag?

The idea is that filesystems get to choose how to handle copies in the default case.  BTRFS could do a reflink, but NFS could do a server side copy instead.  I can change the default behavior to only do a data copy (unless the reflink flag is specified) instead, if that is desirable.

What does everybody think?

Anna

> 
> thanks,
> Pádraig
> 

WARNING: multiple messages have this Message-ID (diff)
From: Anna Schumaker <Anna.Schumaker@netapp.com>
To: "Pádraig Brady" <P@draigBrady.com>,
	linux-nfs@vger.kernel.org, linux-btrfs@vger.kernel.org,
	linux-fsdevel@vger.kernel.org, linux-api@vger.kernel.org,
	zab@zabbo.net, viro@zeniv.linux.org.uk, clm@fb.com,
	darrick.wong@oracle.com, mtk.manpages@gmail.com,
	andros@netapp.com, hch@infradead.org
Subject: Re: [PATCH v1 0/8] VFS: In-kernel copy system call
Date: Tue, 8 Sep 2015 14:23:23 -0400	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <55EF279B.3020101@Netapp.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <55EEFCEE.5090000@draigBrady.com>

On 09/08/2015 11:21 AM, Pádraig Brady wrote:
> On 04/09/15 21:16, Anna Schumaker wrote:
>> Copy system calls came up during Plumbers a couple of weeks ago, because
>> several filesystems (including NFS and XFS) are currently working on copy
>> acceleration implementations.  We haven't heard from Zach Brown in a while,
>> so I volunteered to push his patches upstream so individual filesystems
>> don't need to keep writing their own ioctls.
> 
> Just mentioning that this is just pertaining to the data, not the metadata.
> Providing metadata copying facilities would be _very_ useful, as
> most file system specific details relate to the metadata, and having
> VFS operations for that would avoid the plethora of details in each userspace tool,
> and theoretically support translations between disparate metadata.

Metadata copying could be added later if somebody really wants it.

> 
>> The first three patches are a simple reposting of Zach's patches from several
>> months ago, with one minor error code fix.  The remaining patches add in a
>> fallback mechanism when filesystems don't provide a copy function.  This is
>> especially useful when doing a server-side copy on NFS (using the new COPY
>> operation in NFS v4.2).  This fallback can be disabled by passing the flag
>> COPY_REFLINK to the system call.
> 
> I see copy_file_range() is a reflink() on BTRFS?
> That's a bit surprising, as it avoids the copy completely.
> cp(1) for example considered doing a BTRFS clone by default,
> but didn't due to expectations that users actually wanted
> the data duplicated on disk for resilience reasons,
> and for performance reasons so that write latencies were
> restricted to the copy operation, rather than being
> introduced at usage time as the dest file is CoW'd.
> 
> If reflink() is a possibility for copy_file_range()
> then could it be done optionally with a flag?

The idea is that filesystems get to choose how to handle copies in the default case.  BTRFS could do a reflink, but NFS could do a server side copy instead.  I can change the default behavior to only do a data copy (unless the reflink flag is specified) instead, if that is desirable.

What does everybody think?

Anna

> 
> thanks,
> Pádraig
> 


  parent reply	other threads:[~2015-09-08 18:23 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 121+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2015-09-04 20:16 [PATCH v1 0/8] VFS: In-kernel copy system call Anna Schumaker
2015-09-04 20:16 ` Anna Schumaker
2015-09-04 20:16 ` Anna Schumaker
2015-09-04 20:16 ` [PATCH v1 2/8] x86: add sys_copy_file_range to syscall tables Anna Schumaker
2015-09-04 20:16   ` Anna Schumaker
2015-09-04 20:16 ` [PATCH v1 3/8] btrfs: add .copy_file_range file operation Anna Schumaker
2015-09-04 20:16   ` Anna Schumaker
     [not found]   ` <1441397823-1203-4-git-send-email-Anna.Schumaker-ZwjVKphTwtPQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org>
2015-09-04 21:02     ` Josef Bacik
2015-09-04 21:02       ` Josef Bacik
2015-09-04 21:02       ` Josef Bacik
2015-09-09  8:39   ` David Sterba
2015-09-04 20:17 ` [PATCH v1 7/8] vfs: Copy should use file_out rather than file_in Anna Schumaker
2015-09-04 20:17   ` Anna Schumaker
     [not found] ` <1441397823-1203-1-git-send-email-Anna.Schumaker-ZwjVKphTwtPQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org>
2015-09-04 20:16   ` [PATCH v1 1/9] vfs: add copy_file_range syscall and vfs helper Anna Schumaker
2015-09-04 20:16     ` Anna Schumaker
2015-09-04 20:16     ` Anna Schumaker
2015-09-04 21:50     ` Darrick J. Wong
2015-09-04 20:16   ` [PATCH v1 4/8] btrfs: Add mountpoint checking during btrfs_copy_file_range Anna Schumaker
2015-09-04 20:16     ` Anna Schumaker
2015-09-04 20:16     ` Anna Schumaker
2015-09-09  9:18     ` David Sterba
2015-09-09 15:56       ` Anna Schumaker
2015-09-09 15:56         ` Anna Schumaker
2015-09-04 20:16   ` [PATCH v1 5/8] vfs: Remove copy_file_range mountpoint checks Anna Schumaker
2015-09-04 20:16     ` Anna Schumaker
2015-09-04 20:16     ` Anna Schumaker
2015-09-04 20:17   ` [PATCH v1 6/8] vfs: Copy should check len after file open mode Anna Schumaker
2015-09-04 20:17     ` Anna Schumaker
2015-09-04 20:17     ` Anna Schumaker
2015-09-04 20:17   ` [PATCH v1 8/8] vfs: Fall back on splice if no copy function defined Anna Schumaker
2015-09-04 20:17     ` Anna Schumaker
2015-09-04 20:17     ` Anna Schumaker
2015-09-04 21:08     ` Darrick J. Wong
     [not found]       ` <20150904210813.GA30681-PTl6brltDGh4DFYR7WNSRA@public.gmane.org>
2015-09-08 14:57         ` Anna Schumaker
2015-09-08 14:57           ` Anna Schumaker
2015-09-08 14:57           ` Anna Schumaker
2015-09-04 20:17   ` [PATCH v1 9/8] copy_file_range.2: New page documenting copy_file_range() Anna Schumaker
2015-09-04 20:17     ` Anna Schumaker
2015-09-04 20:17     ` Anna Schumaker
2015-09-04 21:38     ` Darrick J. Wong
     [not found]       ` <20150904213856.GC10391-PTl6brltDGh4DFYR7WNSRA@public.gmane.org>
2015-09-04 22:31         ` Andreas Dilger
2015-09-04 22:31           ` Andreas Dilger
     [not found]           ` <95674806-645C-410C-8A4B-A46F03AFFE20-m1MBpc4rdrD3fQ9qLvQP4Q@public.gmane.org>
2015-09-08 15:05             ` Anna Schumaker
2015-09-08 15:05               ` Anna Schumaker
2015-09-08 15:05               ` Anna Schumaker
2015-09-08 15:04         ` Anna Schumaker
2015-09-08 15:04           ` Anna Schumaker
2015-09-08 15:04           ` Anna Schumaker
2015-09-08 20:39           ` Darrick J. Wong
2015-09-09  9:16             ` David Sterba
     [not found]             ` <20150908203918.GB30681-PTl6brltDGh4DFYR7WNSRA@public.gmane.org>
2015-09-09 11:38               ` Austin S Hemmelgarn
2015-09-09 11:38                 ` Austin S Hemmelgarn
2015-09-09 17:17                 ` Darrick J. Wong
     [not found]                   ` <20150909171757.GE10391-PTl6brltDGh4DFYR7WNSRA@public.gmane.org>
2015-09-09 17:31                     ` Anna Schumaker
2015-09-09 17:31                       ` Anna Schumaker
2015-09-09 17:31                       ` Anna Schumaker
     [not found]                       ` <55F06CEC.5040208-ZwjVKphTwtPQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org>
2015-09-09 18:12                         ` Darrick J. Wong
2015-09-09 18:12                           ` Darrick J. Wong
2015-09-09 19:25                           ` Anna Schumaker
2015-09-09 19:25                             ` Anna Schumaker
2015-09-10 15:42                     ` David Sterba
2015-09-10 15:42                       ` David Sterba
     [not found]                       ` <20150910154251.GM8891-1ReQVI26iDCaZKY3DrU6dA@public.gmane.org>
2015-09-10 16:43                         ` Darrick J. Wong
2015-09-10 16:43                           ` Darrick J. Wong
2015-09-04 22:25   ` [PATCH v1 0/8] VFS: In-kernel copy system call Andreas Dilger
2015-09-04 22:25     ` Andreas Dilger
     [not found]     ` <4B41043F-5D85-42D6-8F20-2DCC45930EF4-m1MBpc4rdrD3fQ9qLvQP4Q@public.gmane.org>
2015-09-05  8:33       ` Al Viro
2015-09-05  8:33         ` Al Viro
     [not found]         ` <20150905083342.GG22011-3bDd1+5oDREiFSDQTTA3OLVCufUGDwFn@public.gmane.org>
2015-09-08 15:08           ` Anna Schumaker
2015-09-08 15:08             ` Anna Schumaker
2015-09-08 15:08             ` Anna Schumaker
2015-09-08 20:45             ` Darrick J. Wong
     [not found]               ` <20150908204517.GC30681-PTl6brltDGh4DFYR7WNSRA@public.gmane.org>
2015-09-08 20:49                 ` Anna Schumaker
2015-09-08 20:49                   ` Anna Schumaker
2015-09-08 20:49                   ` Anna Schumaker
2015-09-08 15:07     ` Anna Schumaker
2015-09-08 15:07       ` Anna Schumaker
2015-09-08 15:21   ` Pádraig Brady
2015-09-08 15:21     ` Pádraig Brady
     [not found]     ` <55EEFCEE.5090000-V8g9lnOeT5ydJdNcDFJN0w@public.gmane.org>
2015-09-08 18:23       ` Anna Schumaker [this message]
2015-09-08 18:23         ` Anna Schumaker
     [not found]         ` <55EF279B.3020101-ZwjVKphTwtPQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org>
2015-09-08 19:10           ` Andy Lutomirski
2015-09-08 19:10             ` Andy Lutomirski
     [not found]             ` <CALCETrXxRB-LXVb+=nkwfj0zEjWuXXTctkSAc9Oec0fgyOQ5Yg-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org>
2015-09-08 20:03               ` Pádraig Brady
2015-09-08 20:03                 ` Pádraig Brady
     [not found]                 ` <55EF3EFD.3080302-V8g9lnOeT5ydJdNcDFJN0w@public.gmane.org>
2015-09-08 21:29                   ` Darrick J. Wong
2015-09-08 21:29                     ` Darrick J. Wong
2015-09-08 21:45                     ` Andy Lutomirski
2015-09-08 21:45                       ` Andy Lutomirski
2015-09-08 22:39                       ` Darrick J. Wong
2015-09-08 22:39                         ` Darrick J. Wong
2015-09-08 23:08                         ` Andy Lutomirski
2015-09-08 23:08                           ` Andy Lutomirski
2015-09-09  1:19                           ` Darrick J. Wong
2015-09-09  1:19                             ` Darrick J. Wong
2015-09-09 20:09                           ` Chris Mason
     [not found]                             ` <20150909200921.GD9511-DzB2rL6jT1BHfPKRx072akEOCMrvLtNR@public.gmane.org>
2015-09-09 20:26                               ` Trond Myklebust
2015-09-09 20:26                                 ` Trond Myklebust
     [not found]                                 ` <CAHQdGtTSZ1beMMF4DJv=OuA1j2ww0xzJj3+9HMRAf3UpCCLaZg-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org>
2015-09-09 20:38                                   ` Chris Mason
2015-09-09 20:38                                     ` Chris Mason
     [not found]                                     ` <20150909203805.GE9511-DzB2rL6jT1BHfPKRx072akEOCMrvLtNR@public.gmane.org>
2015-09-09 20:41                                       ` Anna Schumaker
2015-09-09 20:41                                         ` Anna Schumaker
     [not found]                                         ` <55F0997E.1040105-ZwjVKphTwtPQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org>
2015-09-09 21:42                                           ` Darrick J. Wong
2015-09-09 21:42                                             ` Darrick J. Wong
2015-09-09 20:37                               ` Andy Lutomirski
2015-09-09 20:37                                 ` Andy Lutomirski
     [not found]                                 ` <CALCETrXPcxHWGwqhtkGStVabWDOsRbBy+VzrN+XxVZA_F9O0qA-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org>
2015-09-09 20:42                                   ` Chris Mason
2015-09-09 20:42                                     ` Chris Mason
     [not found]                           ` <CALCETrVsWBdqvAgwxHcG=gbcWRNPG2ZziWUg1g=siKDrDu7S2Q-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org>
2015-09-13 23:25                             ` Dave Chinner
2015-09-13 23:25                               ` Dave Chinner
2015-09-14 17:53                               ` Andy Lutomirski
2015-09-14 17:53                                 ` Andy Lutomirski
2015-09-09 18:52                         ` Anna Schumaker
2015-09-09 18:52                           ` Anna Schumaker
     [not found]                           ` <55F07FD8.4020507-ZwjVKphTwtPQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org>
2015-09-09 21:16                             ` Darrick J. Wong
2015-09-09 21:16                               ` Darrick J. Wong
2015-09-10 15:10                               ` Anna Schumaker
2015-09-10 15:10                                 ` Anna Schumaker
     [not found]                                 ` <55F19D7F.5090907-ZwjVKphTwtPQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org>
2015-09-10 15:49                                   ` Austin S Hemmelgarn
2015-09-10 15:49                                     ` Austin S Hemmelgarn
2015-09-10 11:40                           ` Austin S Hemmelgarn

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