Nouveau for FreeBSD

Nouveau for FreeBSD

[Curtis Hamilton]

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Any progress on the FreeBSD front?


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Re: Nouveau for FreeBSD

[cbergstrom-Hl0AACgZOF5l57MIdRCFDg]

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Re: Nouveau for FreeBSD

[Ilia Mirkin]

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Nouveau kernel module has a largely os-agnostic "core" component (called
nvkm/nvif now) which encompasses the actual operation of the GPU. The drm
wrapper around it provides the relevant interfaces for KMS/ioctls/etc. Any
port would want the ioctl bits as well, since that's what the userspace
mesa/ddx components rely on.

That said, I'm not aware of any serious effort to port nouveau to any other
OS.

  -ilia

On Wed, Nov 4, 2015 at 2:08 AM, <cbergstrom-Hl0AACgZOF5l57MIdRCFDg@public.gmane.org> wrote:

> Is anyone actually and or actively working on this?
> Github.com/pathscale/pscnv is totally bitrot but waaay more portable base.
> Nouveau made hard Linux assumptions that will be difficult to overcome
> afaik.
>
>
>
> *From: *Curtis Hamilton
> *Sent: *Wednesday, November 4, 2015 08:06
> *To: *nouveau-PD4FTy7X32lNgt0PjOBp9y5qC8QIuHrW@public.gmane.org
> *Subject: *[Nouveau] Nouveau for FreeBSD
>
> Any progress on the FreeBSD front?
>
>
> _______________________________________________
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> Nouveau-PD4FTy7X32lNgt0PjOBp9y5qC8QIuHrW@public.gmane.org
> http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/nouveau
>
>

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Re: Nouveau for FreeBSD

[Martin Peres]

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On 04/11/15 09:08, cbergstrom-Hl0AACgZOF5l57MIdRCFDg@public.gmane.org wrote:
> Is anyone actually and or actively working on this? 
> Github.com/pathscale/pscnv is totally bitrot but waaay more portable 
> base. Nouveau made hard Linux assumptions that will be difficult to 
> overcome afaik.

As pointed out by Ilia, this is not true anymore. Nouveau can also 
partially run in the userspace, the hard dependencies on Linux have been 
abstracted.

Also, pscnv does not support the newest GPUs and receives no further 
development because everything it provided is now provided by Nouveau.

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Re: Nouveau for FreeBSD

[C Bergström]

On Wed, Nov 4, 2015 at 3:33 PM, Martin Peres <martin.peres@free.fr> wrote:
> On 04/11/15 09:08, cbergstrom@pathscale.com wrote:
>
> Is anyone actually and or actively working on this?
> Github.com/pathscale/pscnv is totally bitrot but waaay more portable base.
> Nouveau made hard Linux assumptions that will be difficult to overcome
> afaik.
>
>
> As pointed out by Ilia, this is not true anymore. Nouveau can also partially
> run in the userspace, the hard dependencies on Linux have been abstracted.
>
> Also, pscnv does not support the newest GPUs and receives no further
> development because everything it provided is now provided by Nouveau.

I did mention pscnv was bitrot, but I'm not yet convinced that some of
the key things which are implemented in nouveau were done to a
comparable level of quality (would need to evaluate and don't have
time/interest)
-------
To bring this conversation back on track - where would someone start
*exactly* to port this to another OS? What kernel dependencies are
there?
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Re: Nouveau for FreeBSD

[Martin Peres]

On 04/11/15 10:38, C Bergström wrote:
> On Wed, Nov 4, 2015 at 3:33 PM, Martin Peres <martin.peres@free.fr> wrote:
>> On 04/11/15 09:08, cbergstrom@pathscale.com wrote:
>>
>> Is anyone actually and or actively working on this?
>> Github.com/pathscale/pscnv is totally bitrot but waaay more portable base.
>> Nouveau made hard Linux assumptions that will be difficult to overcome
>> afaik.
>>
>>
>> As pointed out by Ilia, this is not true anymore. Nouveau can also partially
>> run in the userspace, the hard dependencies on Linux have been abstracted.
>>
>> Also, pscnv does not support the newest GPUs and receives no further
>> development because everything it provided is now provided by Nouveau.
> I did mention pscnv was bitrot, but I'm not yet convinced that some of
> the key things which are implemented in nouveau were done to a
> comparable level of quality (would need to evaluate and don't have
> time/interest)
> -------
> To bring this conversation back on track - where would someone start
> *exactly* to port this to another OS? What kernel dependencies are
> there?

This needs to be ported to the other OS, along with drm and ttm (which I 
believe have already been ported to all the BSDs):
http://cgit.freedesktop.org/~darktama/nouveau/tree/lib/include/nvif/os.h
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Re: Nouveau for FreeBSD

[Pierre Moreau]

Wasn't there some work being done by François Tigeot or Jean-Sébastien Pédron
to port Nouveau to DragonFlyBSD/FreeBSD? Or at least they were talking about porting it
at XDC 2014, no idea what the current status is.

Pierre

PS: Looking at François' slides from this year XDC, it seems there isn't much
progress about it.


On 10:44 AM - Nov 04 2015, Martin Peres wrote:
> 
> 
> On 04/11/15 10:38, C Bergström wrote:
> >On Wed, Nov 4, 2015 at 3:33 PM, Martin Peres <martin.peres@free.fr> wrote:
> >>On 04/11/15 09:08, cbergstrom@pathscale.com wrote:
> >>
> >>Is anyone actually and or actively working on this?
> >>Github.com/pathscale/pscnv is totally bitrot but waaay more portable base.
> >>Nouveau made hard Linux assumptions that will be difficult to overcome
> >>afaik.
> >>
> >>
> >>As pointed out by Ilia, this is not true anymore. Nouveau can also partially
> >>run in the userspace, the hard dependencies on Linux have been abstracted.
> >>
> >>Also, pscnv does not support the newest GPUs and receives no further
> >>development because everything it provided is now provided by Nouveau.
> >I did mention pscnv was bitrot, but I'm not yet convinced that some of
> >the key things which are implemented in nouveau were done to a
> >comparable level of quality (would need to evaluate and don't have
> >time/interest)
> >-------
> >To bring this conversation back on track - where would someone start
> >*exactly* to port this to another OS? What kernel dependencies are
> >there?
> 
> This needs to be ported to the other OS, along with drm and ttm (which I
> believe have already been ported to all the BSDs):
> http://cgit.freedesktop.org/~darktama/nouveau/tree/lib/include/nvif/os.h
> _______________________________________________
> Nouveau mailing list
> Nouveau@lists.freedesktop.org
> http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/nouveau
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Re: Nouveau for FreeBSD

[Martin Peres]

On 04/11/15 11:58, Pierre Moreau wrote:
> Wasn't there some work being done by François Tigeot or Jean-Sébastien Pédron
> to port Nouveau to DragonFlyBSD/FreeBSD? Or at least they were talking about porting it
> at XDC 2014, no idea what the current status is.

 From what they said, they never really cared about nvidia because 
nvidia provides a binary driver that works, unlike intel and amd.

I guess it will come some day!
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Re: Nouveau for FreeBSD

[Jean-Sébastien Pédron]

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On 04.11.2015 11:56, Martin Peres wrote:
> From what they said, they never really cared about nvidia because nvidia
> provides a binary driver that works, unlike intel and amd.

They provide a binary driver for FreeBSD only. DragonFly and other BSDs
don't have that luxury.

-- 
Jean-Sébastien Pédron


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Re: Nouveau for FreeBSD

[Francois Tigeot]

Martin Peres wrote:
> On 04/11/15 11:58, Pierre Moreau wrote:
>> Wasn't there some work being done by François Tigeot or Jean-Sébastien
>> Pédron
>> to port Nouveau to DragonFlyBSD/FreeBSD? Or at least they were talking
>> about porting it
>> at XDC 2014, no idea what the current status is.
>
>  From what they said, they never really cared about nvidia because
> nvidia provides a binary driver that works, unlike intel and amd.

Hey, I never said that !

There has never been a Nvidia binary driver for DragonFly.

Nvidia support had also been getting worse and worse since xf86-video-nv 
was abandoned so naturally not many people in the DragonFly community 
bought Nvidia hardware and interest in Nouveau is relatively low.

I played with it a bit but my hands are currently full updating and 
fixing the bugs in drm/i915 and the DragonFly Linux compatibility layer.

-- 
Francois Tigeot
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Re: Nouveau for FreeBSD

[Martin Peres]

On 05/11/15 11:42, Francois Tigeot wrote:
> Martin Peres wrote:
>> On 04/11/15 11:58, Pierre Moreau wrote:
>>> Wasn't there some work being done by François Tigeot or Jean-Sébastien
>>> Pédron
>>> to port Nouveau to DragonFlyBSD/FreeBSD? Or at least they were talking
>>> about porting it
>>> at XDC 2014, no idea what the current status is.
>>
>>  From what they said, they never really cared about nvidia because
>> nvidia provides a binary driver that works, unlike intel and amd.
>
> Hey, I never said that !
>
> There has never been a Nvidia binary driver for DragonFly.
>
> Nvidia support had also been getting worse and worse since 
> xf86-video-nv was abandoned so naturally not many people in the 
> DragonFly community bought Nvidia hardware and interest in Nouveau is 
> relatively low.
>
> I played with it a bit but my hands are currently full updating and 
> fixing the bugs in drm/i915 and the DragonFly Linux compatibility layer.
>
I see, sorry. I guess I just interpreted it like that... Good luck!

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Re: Nouveau for FreeBSD

[Jean-Sébastien Pédron]

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On 04.11.2015 10:58, Pierre Moreau wrote:
> Wasn't there some work being done by François Tigeot or Jean-Sébastien Pédron
> to port Nouveau to DragonFlyBSD/FreeBSD? Or at least they were talking about porting it
> at XDC 2014, no idea what the current status is.
> 
> Pierre
> 
> PS: Looking at François' slides from this year XDC, it seems there isn't much
> progress about it.

Hi!

Pierre, you're right, and the same applies to FreeBSD: nobody started to
work on this.

I will let François comment for DragonFly, but on FreeBSD, our problem
is that the diff with Linux was too large to do an easy port of a
driver. This was fixed in DRM core earlier this year, and I'm about to
finish an update to i915 which is the last part to finally have a small
diff with Linux. At that point our entire DRM subsystem will correspond
to Linux 3.8 (minus dma-buf).

At that point, it will be far easier to contribute to FreeBSD. As Martin
said, TTM is already ported so I believe everything is in place to port
Nouveau.

In the coming months, the goal will be to bring our DRM subsystem to
match Linux 3.9 then 3.10, etc. I personnally have no plan to work on
Nouveau for the time being because the i915 and Radeon drivers are
enough to keep me busy. However, we would welcome any contributions!
People are asking about this on a regular basis, so please contact me if
you are willing to work on this.

Soon, we'll see Tux proudly holding a trident in the logo! :)

(Don't get me wrong, I love the current logo)

-- 
Jean-Sébastien Pédron


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Re: Nouveau for FreeBSD

[Ilia Mirkin]

On Wed, Nov 4, 2015 at 3:38 AM, C Bergström <cbergstrom@pathscale.com> wrote:
> To bring this conversation back on track - where would someone start
> *exactly* to port this to another OS? What kernel dependencies are
> there?

drivers/gpu/drm/nouveau/{nvkm,nvif,usif} can be dropped in wholesale
with just a small handful of shims and helper functions. This is the
code that presents the GPU's internals in a fairly generation-agnostic
way, and also provides some high-level functionality.

drivers/gpu/drm/nouveau/* needs to be ported to the other OS's
infrastructure. If the OS also has a port of linux's DRM and TTM
infrastructures, a lot of that will be able to be taken wholesale.
This is the code that interacts with the core above. Decodes ioctls,
manages memory, performs kernel-side modesetting, etc.

Cheers,

  -ilia
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Nouveau for FreeBSD

[Curtis Hamilton]

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Is anyone working on nouveau for FreeBSD?


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Re: Nouveau for FreeBSD

[Chris]

On Mon, 12 Jan 2015 17:28:56 -0500 "Curtis Hamilton" <hamiltcl@verizon.net>
wrote

> Is anyone working on nouveau for FreeBSD?
I asked the same question, when I joined the list. Here's the
response I got from Jean-Sébastien Pédron:

Hi!

The Nouveau kernel driver is close to the Radeon kernel in terms of
DRM/TTM infrastructure requirements. We have that working in FreeBSD.

So the task consists of:
    1. Taking Nouveau from Linux, preferrably 3.8 to keep our DRM code
       on the same base (so we can update the whole consistently).
    2. Adding the source files to the FreeBSD kernel
    3. Start the porting effort: the locking primitives, the PCI API,
       how memory is allocated, etc. are different compared to Linux.

It's probably not that difficult to do, however, it needs time. I would
recommend to not start this effort right now: we are in the process of
updating the DRM device-independent code to match Linux 3.8.
Furthermore, I'm preparing a proposal to have some sort of Linux kernel
API wrapper above FreeBSD facilities to reduce the diff with Linux and
help with porting new drivers.

-- 
Jean-Sébastien Pédron


--Chris


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