release planning

release planning

[Yoshinori K. Okuji]

Hello,

If there is no objection, I'd like to release the first version of GRUB 2 for 
developers at the beginning of August, whatever status it is in. At the 
moment, I'm devoting myself into bugfixes and incorporation of workarounds 
from GRUB Legacy. I'm also going to implement a simple installer for 
GNU/Linux within this month.

After that, I'd like to keep releasing new versions constantly. Hopefully, one 
per two or three months. The version numbers will be 1.9x, until we make GRUB 
2 stable enough on PC.

Currently, I believe that PC support is the priority, because people just 
stick to GRUB Legacy, and do not take part in GRUB 2. I won't push my opinion 
to others, but I wish others attach importance to the PC support and/or the 
generic part as well.

As I guess contributors in GRUB do not like to be specified what they should 
do, I'm not going to specify milestones for release management.

Okuji

Re: release planning

[Marco Gerards]

"Yoshinori K. Okuji" <okuji@enbug.org> writes:

Hi Okuji,

> If there is no objection, I'd like to release the first version of GRUB 2 for 
> developers at the beginning of August, whatever status it is in. At the 
> moment, I'm devoting myself into bugfixes and incorporation of workarounds 
> from GRUB Legacy. I'm also going to implement a simple installer for 
> GNU/Linux within this month.

It's very nice that you are working this hard now.  It is really nice
to see someone is working on the PC specific code again.  I am looking
forwards to the release.  It would be nice if we could get a
kerneltrap article, it could attract more developers. :)

> After that, I'd like to keep releasing new versions constantly. Hopefully, one 
> per two or three months. The version numbers will be 1.9x, until we make GRUB 
> 2 stable enough on PC.

Ok, fine for me.

> Currently, I believe that PC support is the priority, because people just 
> stick to GRUB Legacy, and do not take part in GRUB 2. I won't push my opinion 
> to others, but I wish others attach importance to the PC support and/or the 
> generic part as well.

Right.  I assume things remain like they are?  For me PC support is
very important, although I work more on PPC support.  Please tell us
when you think there is a problem for the PC support caused by another
port.

> As I guess contributors in GRUB do not like to be specified what they should 
> do, I'm not going to specify milestones for release management.

No, that would not be wise.  But having a good prioritized TODO list
is important and people pick up the TODO items quite well.

Thanks,
Marco

RE: release planning

[Gregg C Levine]

Hello from Gregg C Levine
Would anyone mind if I comment? Good.
How do I go about downloading the code that makes up GRUB2? To my mind
it's not at all very clear. I can, convince the CVS stores for GRUB
Legacy to download to my Linux box without fail, and have done so on
many occasions, but for GRUB2, I'm confused.

I confess that I found the web pages to be rather confusing at first
glance.
-----
Gregg C Levine hansolofalcon@worldnet.att.net
---
"Remember the Force will be with you. Always." Obi-Wan Kenobi 

> -----Original Message-----
> From: grub-devel-bounces+hansolofalcon=worldnet.att.net@gnu.org
[mailto:grub-
> devel-bounces+hansolofalcon=worldnet.att.net@gnu.org] On Behalf Of
Marco
> Gerards
> Sent: Sunday, July 17, 2005 4:24 PM
> To: The development of GRUB 2
> Subject: Re: release planning
> 
> "Yoshinori K. Okuji" <okuji@enbug.org> writes:
> 
> Hi Okuji,
> 
> > If there is no objection, I'd like to release the first version of
GRUB 2 for
> > developers at the beginning of August, whatever status it is in.
At the
> > moment, I'm devoting myself into bugfixes and incorporation of
workarounds
> > from GRUB Legacy. I'm also going to implement a simple installer
for
> > GNU/Linux within this month.
> 
> It's very nice that you are working this hard now.  It is really
nice
> to see someone is working on the PC specific code again.  I am
looking
> forwards to the release.  It would be nice if we could get a
> kerneltrap article, it could attract more developers. :)
> 
> > After that, I'd like to keep releasing new versions constantly.
Hopefully, one
> > per two or three months. The version numbers will be 1.9x, until
we make GRUB
> > 2 stable enough on PC.
> 
> Ok, fine for me.
> 
> > Currently, I believe that PC support is the priority, because
people just
> > stick to GRUB Legacy, and do not take part in GRUB 2. I won't push
my opinion
> > to others, but I wish others attach importance to the PC support
and/or the
> > generic part as well.
> 
> Right.  I assume things remain like they are?  For me PC support is
> very important, although I work more on PPC support.  Please tell us
> when you think there is a problem for the PC support caused by
another
> port.
> 
> > As I guess contributors in GRUB do not like to be specified what
they should
> > do, I'm not going to specify milestones for release management.
> 
> No, that would not be wise.  But having a good prioritized TODO list
> is important and people pick up the TODO items quite well.
> 
> Thanks,
> Marco

Re: release planning

[Marco Gerards]

"Gregg C Levine" <hansolofalcon@worldnet.att.net> writes:

Hi Gregg,

> Would anyone mind if I comment? Good.

Please do.

> How do I go about downloading the code that makes up GRUB2? To my mind
> it's not at all very clear. I can, convince the CVS stores for GRUB
> Legacy to download to my Linux box without fail, and have done so on
> many occasions, but for GRUB2, I'm confused.
>
> I confess that I found the web pages to be rather confusing at first
> glance.

Can you please tell us what is not clear about these instructions?:

http://www.gnu.org/software/grub/grub-2-download.en.html

--
Marco

RE: release planning

[Gregg C Levine]

Hello from Gregg C Levine
Well for one thing, for the CVS commands, I am used to seeing the
login sequence first. That page presupposes that I have my SSH key
registered with the servers for the sake of thinking that I might be a
member of the developers group. I'm not at the moment. The Savannah
pages even contained things that way for the most part.
-----
Gregg C Levine hansolofalcon@worldnet.att.net
---
"Remember the Force will be with you. Always." Obi-Wan Kenobi 

> -----Original Message-----
> From: grub-devel-bounces+hansolofalcon=worldnet.att.net@gnu.org
[mailto:grub-
> devel-bounces+hansolofalcon=worldnet.att.net@gnu.org] On Behalf Of
Marco
> Gerards
> Sent: Sunday, July 17, 2005 5:13 PM
> To: The development of GRUB 2
> Subject: Re: release planning
> 
> "Gregg C Levine" <hansolofalcon@worldnet.att.net> writes:
> 
> Hi Gregg,
> 
> > Would anyone mind if I comment? Good.
> 
> Please do.
> 
> > How do I go about downloading the code that makes up GRUB2? To my
mind
> > it's not at all very clear. I can, convince the CVS stores for
GRUB
> > Legacy to download to my Linux box without fail, and have done so
on
> > many occasions, but for GRUB2, I'm confused.
> >
> > I confess that I found the web pages to be rather confusing at
first
> > glance.
> 
> Can you please tell us what is not clear about these instructions?:
> 
> http://www.gnu.org/software/grub/grub-2-download.en.html
> 
> --
> Marco
> 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Grub-devel mailing list
> Grub-devel@gnu.org
> http://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/grub-devel

Re: release planning

[Yoshinori K. Okuji]

Hi Gregg,

On Sunday 17 July 2005 23:39, Gregg C Levine wrote:
> Well for one thing, for the CVS commands, I am used to seeing the
> login sequence first. That page presupposes that I have my SSH key
> registered with the servers for the sake of thinking that I might be a
> member of the developers group. I'm not at the moment. The Savannah
> pages even contained things that way for the most part.

No, it does not presume that you register your SSH key. The CVS configuration 
in Savannah uses CVS over SSH even for anonymous. Try it. It should work, 
regardless of your key.

Okuji

RE: release planning

[Gregg C Levine]

Hello from Gregg C Levine
Well after SSH here asked me to confirm the authenticity of the SSH
server roosting at Savannah, that is the CVS server the project is on,
it did indeed work. I checked out the code for both GRUB2, and
GRUB-Legacy, figuring correctly if I'm going to be doing some
non-standard hacking for the Legacy stuff, I should have the code from
CVS rather then a released version.

As for how GRUB2 builds here, more later on that subject.
------
Gregg C Levine hansolofalcon@worldnet.att.net
---
"Remember the Force will be with you. Always." Obi-Wan Kenobi 

> -----Original Message-----
> From: grub-devel-bounces+hansolofalcon=worldnet.att.net@gnu.org
[mailto:grub-
> devel-bounces+hansolofalcon=worldnet.att.net@gnu.org] On Behalf Of
Yoshinori
> K. Okuji
> Sent: Monday, July 18, 2005 5:08 AM
> To: The development of GRUB 2
> Subject: Re: release planning
> 
> Hi Gregg,
> 
> On Sunday 17 July 2005 23:39, Gregg C Levine wrote:
> > Well for one thing, for the CVS commands, I am used to seeing the
> > login sequence first. That page presupposes that I have my SSH key
> > registered with the servers for the sake of thinking that I might
be a
> > member of the developers group. I'm not at the moment. The
Savannah
> > pages even contained things that way for the most part.
> 
> No, it does not presume that you register your SSH key. The CVS
configuration
> in Savannah uses CVS over SSH even for anonymous. Try it. It should
work,
> regardless of your key.
> 
> Okuji
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Grub-devel mailing list
> Grub-devel@gnu.org
> http://lists.gnu.org/mailman/listinfo/grub-devel

Re: GRUB history

[Hollis Blanchard]

On Jul 17, 2005, at 4:23 PM, Marco Gerards wrote:
> I am looking
> forwards to the release.  It would be nice if we could get a
> kerneltrap article, it could attract more developers. :)

I would be interested in this myself. I do not know the history of GRUB 
development: How many people were active in GRUB 0.9x development? What 
was PUPA? Why did GRUB2 have to be a rewrite? What are the benefits of 
the now-rewritten code? Etc.

-Hollis

Re: GRUB history

[Marco Gerards]

Hollis Blanchard <hollis@penguinppc.org> writes:

> On Jul 17, 2005, at 4:23 PM, Marco Gerards wrote:
>> I am looking
>> forwards to the release.  It would be nice if we could get a
>> kerneltrap article, it could attract more developers. :)
>
> I would be interested in this myself. I do not know the history of
> GRUB development: How many people were active in GRUB 0.9x
> development? What was PUPA? Why did GRUB2 have to be a rewrite? What
> are the benefits of the now-rewritten code? Etc.

That might be more interesting for the wiki or osnews, right?  AFAIK
kerneltrap is for news.

--
Marco

Re: release planning

[Tobias Wollgam]

> If there is no objection, I'd like to release the first version of
> GRUB 2 for
> developers at the beginning of August, whatever status it is in. At
> the moment, I'm devoting myself into bugfixes and incorporation of
> workarounds
> from GRUB Legacy. I'm also going to implement a simple installer for
> GNU/Linux within this month.
>
> After that, I'd like to keep releasing new versions constantly.
> Hopefully, one
> per two or three months. The version numbers will be 1.9x, until we
> make GRUB
> 2 stable enough on PC.

I agree, I  await eagerly ... then I will start testing on our hardware.

> Currently, I believe that PC support is the priority, because people
> just
> stick to GRUB Legacy, and do not take part in GRUB 2. I won't push my
> opinion
> to others, but I wish others attach importance to the PC support
> and/or the
> generic part as well.

full ack

Many thanks!

	Tobias


-- 
Tobias Wollgam
Softwaredevelopment
Competence Center System Management
Business Unit Information 
_________________________________________________
MATERNA GmbH Information & Communications
Vosskuhle 37 * 44141 Dortmund  
http://www.materna.de 

Re: release planning

[Hollis Blanchard]

On Jul 17, 2005, at 11:39 AM, Yoshinori K. Okuji wrote:
>
> If there is no objection, I'd like to release the first version of 
> GRUB 2 for
> developers at the beginning of August, whatever status it is in. At the
> moment, I'm devoting myself into bugfixes and incorporation of 
> workarounds
> from GRUB Legacy. I'm also going to implement a simple installer for
> GNU/Linux within this month.

Great!

> After that, I'd like to keep releasing new versions constantly. 
> Hopefully, one
> per two or three months. The version numbers will be 1.9x, until we 
> make GRUB
> 2 stable enough on PC.

For me, for PowerPC, the question has been first "can we replace 
current bootloaders?" and second "what features can we add to compel 
people to switch?" I think releasing GRUB2 without all the features of 
GRUB 0.9x would be a tough sell... but of course, I'm talking about end 
users here. Developers and early adopters may find it interesting 
enough even in its current state.

-Hollis

Re: release planning

[James Buchanan]

Would be nice to have GRUB2 for the IA-64 as well.  Intel documents the 
Extensible Firmware Interface and makes a lot of docs and tools 
available, plus driver writer guides and oodles of examples.

I might be lucky enough to have an IA-64 system (HP workstation, 
Itanium2 900MHz, 2GB RAM, 2x 36GB SCSI-3 disks, picked up second hand on 
eBay...) later this week.  It's interesting enough for me to have spent 
the last 5 hours transfixed by the docs. :)

I'll be sure to hack up the GRUB2 sources for IA-64 and give it a go.

Sniff... can't afford a 64-bit PPC...

-- 
James Buchanan

Re: release planning

[Marco Gerards]

James Buchanan <jamesb.au@iinet.net.au> writes:

Hi James,

> Would be nice to have GRUB2 for the IA-64 as well.  Intel documents
> the Extensible Firmware Interface and makes a lot of docs and tools
> available, plus driver writer guides and oodles of examples.

Right, I completely agree.  It is wise to make the EFI code as generic
as possible so it can be used for other (non-IA64) EFI systems.  The
sme is currently done for the IEEE 1275 code (Open Firmware).

> I might be lucky enough to have an IA-64 system (HP workstation,
> Itanium2 900MHz, 2GB RAM, 2x 36GB SCSI-3 disks, picked up second hand
> on eBay...) later this week.  It's interesting enough for me to have
> spent the last 5 hours transfixed by the docs. :)

Nice box!  please tell us if you need any help or visit our IRC
channel.

> I'll be sure to hack up the GRUB2 sources for IA-64 and give it a go.

Good luck :)

--
Marco

Re: release planning

[Yoshinori K. Okuji]

On Monday 18 July 2005 17:30, James Buchanan wrote:
> I might be lucky enough to have an IA-64 system (HP workstation,
> Itanium2 900MHz, 2GB RAM, 2x 36GB SCSI-3 disks, picked up second hand on
> eBay...) later this week.  It's interesting enough for me to have spent
> the last 5 hours transfixed by the docs. :)
>
> I'll be sure to hack up the GRUB2 sources for IA-64 and give it a go.

That's great!

Okuji