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From: Jani Nikula <jani.nikula@intel.com>
To: "Theodore Y. Ts'o" <tytso@mit.edu>,
	Frank Rowand <frowand.list@gmail.com>
Cc: James Bottomley <James.Bottomley@HansenPartnership.com>,
	Tech Board Discuss
	<Tech-board-discuss@lists.linux-foundation.org>,
	"ksummit-discuss@lists.linuxfoundation.org"
	<ksummit-discuss@lists.linuxfoundation.org>
Subject: Re: [Ksummit-discuss] [Tech-board-discuss]  TAB non-nomination
Date: Tue, 13 Nov 2018 18:49:58 +0200	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <87r2fogbwp.fsf@intel.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <20181111055728.GC12818@thunk.org>

On Sun, 11 Nov 2018, "Theodore Y. Ts'o" <tytso@mit.edu> wrote:
> "Community" is a very slippery term.  I will note that there were
> *many* people who were participating on the threads, sometimes in very
> non-constructive or in a downright toxic fashion, who had zero commits
> in recent years.  In some cases, it was zero commits, *ever*.  I
> recall doing the research on one prolific author and found that while
> he did contribute the kernel, it was 3 or 4 commits... ~5 years
> ago... to a driver.
>
> And then there was one person who admitted that while he was just a
> user, he insisted he had a right to weigh in the issue.  They
> certainly have the right to have that belief, of course.  Whether or
> not maintainers are obliged to cater to people with those beliefs is a
> very different question, however.
>
> There seems to be an assumption that a open, public discussion will
> always give you the best review.  I don't think that's necessarily
> true.  It can often give you a very biased sample from the poeple who
> are most stridently on one side of the debate or the other, as well as
> being biased towards those who believe in the "last post wins" style
> of debate, since they end up speaking most loudly and posting most
> frequently and most aggressively.

I think it's interesting to note that ksummit-discuss seemed to be a
much more fruitful list for discussion than LKML in this matter. Would
we benefit from a non-technical mailing list to accompany LKML?
Something less "seasonal" than ksummit-discuss.

Could also restrict posting to subscribers only, with public archives,
and limit subscribers to, say, people in MAINTAINERS and/or some (fairly
low) number of required commits in the past years. I presume
ksummit-discuss had fairly good signal-to-noise because it's not well
known or publicized.

BR,
Jani.


-- 
Jani Nikula, Intel Open Source Graphics Center

WARNING: multiple messages have this Message-ID (diff)
From: Jani Nikula <jani.nikula@intel.com>
To: "Theodore Y. Ts'o" <tytso@mit.edu>,
	Frank Rowand <frowand.list@gmail.com>
Cc: James Bottomley <James.Bottomley@HansenPartnership.com>,
	Tech Board Discuss
	<Tech-board-discuss@lists.linux-foundation.org>,
	"ksummit-discuss@lists.linuxfoundation.org"
	<ksummit-discuss@lists.linuxfoundation.org>
Subject: Re: [Tech-board-discuss] [Ksummit-discuss]   TAB non-nomination
Date: Tue, 13 Nov 2018 18:49:58 +0200	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <87r2fogbwp.fsf@intel.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <20181111055728.GC12818@thunk.org>

On Sun, 11 Nov 2018, "Theodore Y. Ts'o" <tytso@mit.edu> wrote:
> "Community" is a very slippery term.  I will note that there were
> *many* people who were participating on the threads, sometimes in very
> non-constructive or in a downright toxic fashion, who had zero commits
> in recent years.  In some cases, it was zero commits, *ever*.  I
> recall doing the research on one prolific author and found that while
> he did contribute the kernel, it was 3 or 4 commits... ~5 years
> ago... to a driver.
>
> And then there was one person who admitted that while he was just a
> user, he insisted he had a right to weigh in the issue.  They
> certainly have the right to have that belief, of course.  Whether or
> not maintainers are obliged to cater to people with those beliefs is a
> very different question, however.
>
> There seems to be an assumption that a open, public discussion will
> always give you the best review.  I don't think that's necessarily
> true.  It can often give you a very biased sample from the poeple who
> are most stridently on one side of the debate or the other, as well as
> being biased towards those who believe in the "last post wins" style
> of debate, since they end up speaking most loudly and posting most
> frequently and most aggressively.

I think it's interesting to note that ksummit-discuss seemed to be a
much more fruitful list for discussion than LKML in this matter. Would
we benefit from a non-technical mailing list to accompany LKML?
Something less "seasonal" than ksummit-discuss.

Could also restrict posting to subscribers only, with public archives,
and limit subscribers to, say, people in MAINTAINERS and/or some (fairly
low) number of required commits in the past years. I presume
ksummit-discuss had fairly good signal-to-noise because it's not well
known or publicized.

BR,
Jani.


-- 
Jani Nikula, Intel Open Source Graphics Center

  parent reply	other threads:[~2018-11-13 16:50 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 50+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2018-11-09  0:04 [Ksummit-discuss] TAB non-nomination James Bottomley
2018-11-09  0:04 ` [Tech-board-discuss] " James Bottomley
2018-11-09  0:29 ` [Ksummit-discuss] " Steven Rostedt
2018-11-09  0:29   ` Steven Rostedt
2018-11-09  3:30 ` [Ksummit-discuss] " Chris Mason
2018-11-09  3:30   ` [Tech-board-discuss] " Chris Mason
2018-11-09 17:52   ` Shuah Khan
2018-11-09 17:52     ` [Tech-board-discuss] " Shuah Khan
2018-11-09 19:03     ` Theodore Y. Ts'o
2018-11-09 19:03       ` [Tech-board-discuss] " Theodore Y. Ts'o
2018-11-09 19:23       ` Joe Perches
2018-11-09 19:23         ` [Tech-board-discuss] " Joe Perches
2018-11-10 21:21         ` Theodore Y. Ts'o
2018-11-10 21:21           ` [Tech-board-discuss] " Theodore Y. Ts'o
2018-11-10 21:47           ` Joe Perches
2018-11-10 21:47             ` [Tech-board-discuss] " Joe Perches
2018-11-12 17:15           ` James Morris
2018-11-12 17:15             ` [Tech-board-discuss] " James Morris
2018-11-09 20:17       ` [Ksummit-discuss] better hot-topic discussion processes was: " Jason Cooper
2018-11-09 20:17         ` [Tech-board-discuss] " Jason Cooper
2018-11-10 19:26         ` [Ksummit-discuss] " Chris Mason
2018-11-10 19:26           ` [Tech-board-discuss] " Chris Mason
2018-11-10 21:55           ` Jason Cooper
2018-11-10 21:55             ` [Tech-board-discuss] " Jason Cooper
2018-11-14 18:25       ` [Ksummit-discuss] " Geert Uytterhoeven
2018-11-14 18:25         ` [Tech-board-discuss] " Geert Uytterhoeven
2018-11-09 19:54   ` [Ksummit-discuss] [Tech-board-discuss] " Frank Rowand
2018-11-09 19:54     ` [Tech-board-discuss] [Ksummit-discuss] " Frank Rowand
2018-11-10 19:15     ` [Ksummit-discuss] [Tech-board-discuss] " Chris Mason
2018-11-10 19:15       ` [Tech-board-discuss] [Ksummit-discuss] " Chris Mason
2018-11-10 21:59       ` [Ksummit-discuss] [Tech-board-discuss] " Jason Cooper
2018-11-10 21:59         ` [Tech-board-discuss] [Ksummit-discuss] " Jason Cooper
2018-11-11  3:18       ` [Ksummit-discuss] [Tech-board-discuss] " Frank Rowand
2018-11-11  3:18         ` [Tech-board-discuss] [Ksummit-discuss] " Frank Rowand
2018-11-11  5:57         ` [Ksummit-discuss] [Tech-board-discuss] " Theodore Y. Ts'o
2018-11-11  5:57           ` [Tech-board-discuss] [Ksummit-discuss] " Theodore Y. Ts'o
2018-11-12  4:44           ` [Ksummit-discuss] [Tech-board-discuss] " NeilBrown
2018-11-12  4:44             ` [Tech-board-discuss] [Ksummit-discuss] " NeilBrown
2018-11-12  4:54           ` [Ksummit-discuss] [Tech-board-discuss] " NeilBrown
2018-11-12  4:54             ` [Tech-board-discuss] [Ksummit-discuss] " NeilBrown
2018-11-12 17:00             ` [Ksummit-discuss] [Tech-board-discuss] " Steven Rostedt
2018-11-12 17:00               ` [Tech-board-discuss] [Ksummit-discuss] " Steven Rostedt
2018-11-13 16:49           ` Jani Nikula [this message]
2018-11-13 16:49             ` Jani Nikula
2018-11-13 19:59             ` [Ksummit-discuss] [Tech-board-discuss] " Laurent Pinchart
2018-11-13 19:59               ` [Tech-board-discuss] [Ksummit-discuss] " Laurent Pinchart
2018-11-14 17:28           ` [Ksummit-discuss] [Tech-board-discuss] " Mark Brown
2018-11-14 17:28             ` [Tech-board-discuss] [Ksummit-discuss] " Mark Brown
2018-11-09 17:19 ` Stephen Hemminger
2018-11-09 17:19   ` [Tech-board-discuss] " Stephen Hemminger

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