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From: hpa@zytor.com (H. Peter Anvin)
To: linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org
Subject: Re: UTF-8 and case-insensitivity
Date: Tue, 17 Feb 2004 07:43:40 +0000 (UTC)	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <c0sgnc$ngo$1@terminus.zytor.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: 16433.38038.881005.468116@samba.org

Followup to:  <16433.38038.881005.468116@samba.org>
By author:    tridge@samba.org
In newsgroup: linux.dev.kernel
>
> Given how much pain the "kernel is agnostic to charset encoding"
> attitude has cost me in terms of programming pain, I thought I should
> de-cloak from lurk mode and put my 2c into the UTF-8 issue.
> 
> Personally I think that eventually the Linux kernel will have to
> embrace the interpretation of the byte streams that applications have
> given it, despite the fact that this will be very painful and
> potentially quite complex. The reason is that I think that eventually
> the Linux kernel will need to efficiently support a userspace policy
> of case-insensitivity and the only way to do case-insensitive filename
> operations is to interpret those byte streams as a particular
> encoding.
> 

Realistically, the only sane way to do this is to set our foot down
and say: UTF-8 is *the* encoding.  A good step in that direction would
be to set utf-8 to be the default NLS in the kernel, but as long as
people keep the whole sick idea that we can continue to use
locale-dependent encoding we're in for a world of hurt.

That's really the long and short of it.  Until people are willing to
say "we support UTF-8, anything else and it's anyone's guess what
happens" then nothing is going to happen.

	-hpa
-- 
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  parent reply	other threads:[~2004-02-17  7:44 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 135+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2004-02-17  4:12 UTF-8 and case-insensitivity tridge
2004-02-17  5:11 ` Linus Torvalds
2004-02-17  6:54   ` tridge
2004-02-17  8:33     ` Neil Brown
2004-02-17 22:48       ` tridge
2004-02-18  0:06         ` Neil Brown
2004-02-18  9:47           ` Helge Hafting
2004-02-17 15:13     ` Linus Torvalds
2004-02-17 16:57       ` Linus Torvalds
2004-02-17 19:44         ` viro
2004-02-17 20:10           ` Linus Torvalds
2004-02-17 20:17             ` viro
2004-02-17 20:23               ` Linus Torvalds
2004-02-17 21:08         ` Robin Rosenberg
2004-02-17 21:17           ` Linus Torvalds
2004-02-17 22:27             ` Robin Rosenberg
2004-02-18  3:02               ` tridge
2004-02-17 23:57         ` tridge
2004-02-17 23:20       ` tridge
2004-02-17 23:43         ` Linus Torvalds
2004-02-18  3:26           ` tridge
2004-02-18  5:33             ` H. Peter Anvin
2004-02-18  7:54             ` Marc Lehmann
2004-02-18  2:37         ` H. Peter Anvin
2004-02-18  3:03           ` Linus Torvalds
2004-02-18  3:14             ` H. Peter Anvin
2004-02-18  3:27               ` Linus Torvalds
2004-02-18 21:31                 ` tridge
2004-02-18 22:23                   ` Linus Torvalds
2004-02-18 22:28                     ` Linus Torvalds
2004-02-18 22:50                       ` tridge
2004-02-18 22:59                         ` Linus Torvalds
2004-02-18 23:09                           ` tridge
2004-02-18 23:16                             ` Linus Torvalds
2004-02-19  8:10                               ` Jamie Lokier
2004-02-19 16:09                                 ` Linus Torvalds
2004-02-19 16:38                                   ` Jamie Lokier
2004-02-19 16:54                                     ` Linus Torvalds
2004-02-19 18:29                                       ` Jamie Lokier
2004-02-19 19:48                                         ` Eureka! (was Re: UTF-8 and case-insensitivity) Linus Torvalds
2004-02-19 19:51                                           ` Linus Torvalds
2004-02-19 19:48                                             ` H. Peter Anvin
2004-02-19 20:04                                               ` Linus Torvalds
2004-02-19 20:05                                           ` viro
2004-02-19 20:23                                             ` Linus Torvalds
2004-02-19 20:32                                               ` Linus Torvalds
2004-02-19 20:45                                                 ` viro
2004-02-19 21:26                                                   ` Linus Torvalds
2004-02-19 21:38                                                     ` Linus Torvalds
2004-02-19 21:45                                                     ` Linus Torvalds
2004-02-19 21:43                                                       ` viro
2004-02-19 21:53                                                         ` Linus Torvalds
2004-02-19 22:21                                                           ` David Lang
2004-02-19 20:48                                                 ` Jamie Lokier
2004-02-19 21:30                                                   ` Linus Torvalds
2004-02-20  0:00                                                     ` Jamie Lokier
2004-02-20  0:17                                                       ` Linus Torvalds
2004-02-20  0:24                                                         ` Linus Torvalds
2004-02-20  0:30                                                           ` Trond Myklebust
2004-02-20  0:54                                                           ` Jamie Lokier
2004-02-20  0:57                                                           ` tridge
2004-02-20  1:07                                                           ` Paul Wagland
2004-02-20 13:31                                                           ` Chris Wedgwood
2004-02-20  0:46                                                         ` Jamie Lokier
2004-02-23 10:13                                                           ` Tim Connors
2004-02-20  1:39                                                     ` Junio C Hamano
2004-02-20 12:54                                                       ` Jamie Lokier
2004-02-19 23:37                                           ` tridge
2004-02-20  0:02                                             ` Linus Torvalds
2004-02-20  0:16                                               ` tridge
2004-02-20  0:37                                                 ` Linus Torvalds
2004-02-20  1:26                                                   ` tridge
2004-02-20  1:07                                               ` H. Peter Anvin
2004-02-20  2:30                                           ` Theodore Ts'o
2004-02-20 12:04                                           ` explicit dcache <-> user-space cache coherency, sys_mark_dir_clean(), O_CLEAN Ingo Molnar
2004-02-20 13:19                                             ` Jamie Lokier
2004-02-20 13:37                                               ` Ingo Molnar
2004-02-20 14:00                                                 ` Ingo Molnar
2004-02-20 16:31                                                 ` Jamie Lokier
2004-02-20 13:23                                             ` [patch] " Ingo Molnar
2004-02-20 18:00                                               ` viro
2004-02-20 15:41                                             ` Linus Torvalds
2004-02-20 17:04                                               ` Ingo Molnar
2004-02-20 17:19                                                 ` Linus Torvalds
2004-02-20 18:48                                                   ` Ingo Molnar
2004-02-21  1:44                                                     ` Jamie Lokier
2004-02-21  7:58                                                     ` Ingo Molnar
2004-02-21  8:04                                                       ` viro
2004-02-21 17:46                                                         ` Ingo Molnar
2004-02-21 18:15                                                         ` Linus Torvalds
2004-02-21  8:26                                                       ` Keith Owens
2004-02-23 10:59                                                       ` Pavel Machek
2004-02-23 13:55                                                         ` Jamie Lokier
2004-02-23 16:45                                                           ` Ingo Molnar
2004-02-23 17:32                                                             ` Jamie Lokier
2004-02-20 23:00                                                   ` tridge
2004-02-20 17:33                                               ` Jamie Lokier
2004-02-20 18:22                                                 ` Linus Torvalds
2004-02-21  0:38                                                   ` Jamie Lokier
2004-02-21  1:10                                                     ` Linus Torvalds
2004-02-21  3:01                                                       ` Jamie Lokier
2004-02-20 17:47                                               ` Jamie Lokier
2004-02-20 20:38                                             ` Christer Weinigel
2004-02-22 15:07                                               ` Jamie Lokier
2004-02-22 16:55                                                 ` Miquel van Smoorenburg
2004-02-19 19:08                                       ` UTF-8 and case-insensitivity Helge Hafting
2004-02-18  4:08           ` tridge
2004-02-18 10:05             ` Robin Rosenberg
2004-02-18 11:43               ` tridge
2004-02-18 12:31                 ` Robin Rosenberg
2004-02-18 16:48                   ` H. Peter Anvin
2004-02-18 20:00                     ` H. Peter Anvin
2004-02-19  2:53   ` Daniel Newby
2004-02-17  5:25 ` Tim Connors
2004-02-17  7:43 ` H. Peter Anvin [this message]
2004-02-17  8:05   ` H. Peter Anvin
2004-02-17 14:25 ` Dave Kleikamp
2004-02-18  0:16 ` Robert White
2004-02-18  0:20   ` Linus Torvalds
2004-02-18  1:03     ` Robert White
2004-02-18 21:48     ` Ville Herva
2004-02-18  2:48   ` tridge
2004-02-18 20:56     ` Robert White
     [not found] <fa.epf5o9k.1rkudgo@ifi.uio.no>
     [not found] ` <fa.idvvhjl.1jge92d@ifi.uio.no>
2004-02-18  1:09   ` Andy Lutomirski
     [not found] <1q4Si-658-5@gated-at.bofh.it>
     [not found] ` <1q7no-8ss-7@gated-at.bofh.it>
     [not found]   ` <1qfb7-7s5-19@gated-at.bofh.it>
     [not found]     ` <1qmPm-6Gl-11@gated-at.bofh.it>
     [not found]       ` <1qpWI-1Sa-1@gated-at.bofh.it>
     [not found]         ` <1qqpO-2lx-3@gated-at.bofh.it>
     [not found]           ` <1qqzv-2tr-3@gated-at.bofh.it>
     [not found]             ` <1qqJc-2A2-5@gated-at.bofh.it>
     [not found]               ` <1qHAR-2Wm-49@gated-at.bofh.it>
     [not found]                 ` <1qIwr-5GB-11@gated-at.bofh.it>
     [not found]                   ` <1qIwr-5GB-9@gated-at.bofh.it>
     [not found]                     ` <1qIQ1-5WR-27@gated-at.bofh.it>
     [not found]                       ` <1qIZt-6b9-11@gated-at.bofh.it>
     [not found]                         ` <1qJsF-6Be-45@gated-at.bofh.it>
2004-02-19  0:06                           ` Pascal Schmidt
2004-02-19  1:01                             ` tridge
2004-02-19  1:08                               ` Hua Zhong
2004-02-19  1:46                                 ` tridge
2004-02-19  2:44                               ` Theodore Ts'o
2004-02-19  3:20                                 ` tridge
2004-02-19 10:18                                   ` Helge Hafting
2004-02-19 12:11                                   ` Paulo Marques
2004-02-19 19:04                                     ` Helge Hafting
2004-02-19 14:08                                   ` Theodore Ts'o
2004-02-19 20:12                                   ` Robert White

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