Re: ymfpci : four speakers with OSS-emulation

Re: ymfpci : four speakers with OSS-emulation

[Adam K Kirchhoff]

On Wed, 13 Mar 2002, Takashi Iwai wrote:

> if you only need duplication, this can be done on alsa-lib without
> changing the driver itself.
> try to add the following in your ~/.asoundrc.
> 
> 	pcm.ch4dup {
> 		type plug
> 		slave.pcm surround40
> 		ttable.0.0 1
> 		ttable.1.1 1
> 		ttable.0.2 1
> 		ttable.1.3 1
> 	}
> 
> then run like this
> 
> 	% aplay -D ch4dup foo.wav

Well, even this doesn't seem to want to work for me at the moment :-(  I'm
still only getting audio from the front speakers.

[ adamk@sorrow ~ ]$ cat .asoundrc 
pcm.ch4dup {
        type plug
        slave.pcm surround40
        ttable.0.0 1
        ttable.1.1 1
        ttable.0.2 1
        ttable.1.3 1
}

[ adamk@sorrow ~ ]$ aplay -D ch4dup saved/sounds/Thunder.wav 
Playing WAVE 'saved/sounds/Thunder.wav' : Signed 16 bit Little Endian, Rate 22050 Hz, Stereo

Any further ideas?

Adam


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ymfpci : four speakers with OSS-emulation

[xavier.allamigeon]

Sure Adam, but according to http://www.mail-archive.com/alsa-
devel@lists.sourceforge.net/msg01977.html , there is a solution.
The solution with the option for snd-pcm-oss doesn't work, but at this message 
http://www.mail-archive.com/alsa-devel@lists.sourceforge.net/msg01987.html , 
Jaroslav have given you an another solution. Does it work ?
Thank you.

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Re: ymfpci : four speakers with OSS-emulation

[Adam K Kirchhoff]

The solution the Jaroslav gave in that e-mail actually requires changes to
the ymfpci driver, as I understand it.  Last time I pulled code from CVS,
this hadn't been done yet.  From the sound of it (based on your
experience) it looks like it still hasn't been done.  At the moment, I
don't really understand Alsa (or sound drivers in general) well enough to
make the change myself, nor do I really have the time to pick up that
knowledge at the moment.

However, it's also my impression from Jaroslav's explanation that this
would simply duplicate the output from the fron channel on the rear
channel. Can someone let me know if this is correct?

Adam

On Wed, 13 Mar 2002 xavier.allamigeon@free.fr wrote:

> Sure Adam, but according to http://www.mail-archive.com/alsa-
> devel@lists.sourceforge.net/msg01977.html , there is a solution.
> The solution with the option for snd-pcm-oss doesn't work, but at this message 
> http://www.mail-archive.com/alsa-devel@lists.sourceforge.net/msg01987.html , 
> Jaroslav have given you an another solution. Does it work ?
> Thank you.
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Alsa-devel mailing list
> Alsa-devel@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/alsa-devel
> 


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Re: ymfpci : four speakers with OSS-emulation

[Takashi Iwai]

At Wed, 13 Mar 2002 08:01:02 -0500 (EST),
Adam K Kirchhoff wrote:
> 
> The solution the Jaroslav gave in that e-mail actually requires changes to
> the ymfpci driver, as I understand it.  Last time I pulled code from CVS,
> this hadn't been done yet.  From the sound of it (based on your
> experience) it looks like it still hasn't been done.  At the moment, I
> don't really understand Alsa (or sound drivers in general) well enough to
> make the change myself, nor do I really have the time to pick up that
> knowledge at the moment.
> 
> However, it's also my impression from Jaroslav's explanation that this
> would simply duplicate the output from the fron channel on the rear
> channel. Can someone let me know if this is correct?

if you only need duplication, this can be done on alsa-lib without
changing the driver itself.
try to add the following in your ~/.asoundrc.

	pcm.ch4dup {
		type plug
		slave.pcm surround40
		ttable.0.0 1
		ttable.1.1 1
		ttable.0.2 1
		ttable.1.3 1
	}

then run like this

	% aplay -D ch4dup foo.wav

To use this technique on OSS emulation, you'll need aoss wrapper
(included in alsa-oss package).
suppose that the application uses /dev/dsp, add the following in
~/.asoundrc.

	pcm.dsp0 pcm.ch4dup

then run your oss application via aoss script

	% aoss foobar


Takashi

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Re: ymfpci : four speakers with OSS-emulation

[Adam K Kirchhoff]

On Wed, 13 Mar 2002, Takashi Iwai wrote:

> At Wed, 13 Mar 2002 08:01:02 -0500 (EST),
> Adam K Kirchhoff wrote:
> > 
> > The solution the Jaroslav gave in that e-mail actually requires changes to
> > the ymfpci driver, as I understand it.  Last time I pulled code from CVS,
> > this hadn't been done yet.  From the sound of it (based on your
> > experience) it looks like it still hasn't been done.  At the moment, I
> > don't really understand Alsa (or sound drivers in general) well enough to
> > make the change myself, nor do I really have the time to pick up that
> > knowledge at the moment.
> > 
> > However, it's also my impression from Jaroslav's explanation that this
> > would simply duplicate the output from the fron channel on the rear
> > channel. Can someone let me know if this is correct?
> 
> if you only need duplication, this can be done on alsa-lib without
> changing the driver itself.

<snip>

What would be required if you're looking for more than duplication?

Adam



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Re: ymfpci : four speakers with OSS-emulation

[Takashi Iwai]

At Wed, 13 Mar 2002 09:29:58 -0500 (EST),
Adam K Kirchhoff wrote:
> 
> 
> On Wed, 13 Mar 2002, Takashi Iwai wrote:
> 
> > At Wed, 13 Mar 2002 08:01:02 -0500 (EST),
> > Adam K Kirchhoff wrote:
> > > 
> > > The solution the Jaroslav gave in that e-mail actually requires changes to
> > > the ymfpci driver, as I understand it.  Last time I pulled code from CVS,
> > > this hadn't been done yet.  From the sound of it (based on your
> > > experience) it looks like it still hasn't been done.  At the moment, I
> > > don't really understand Alsa (or sound drivers in general) well enough to
> > > make the change myself, nor do I really have the time to pick up that
> > > knowledge at the moment.
> > > 
> > > However, it's also my impression from Jaroslav's explanation that this
> > > would simply duplicate the output from the fron channel on the rear
> > > channel. Can someone let me know if this is correct?
> > 
> > if you only need duplication, this can be done on alsa-lib without
> > changing the driver itself.
> 
> <snip>
> 
> What would be required if you're looking for more than duplication?

dunno.  depending on what you want ;)
for example, if you need dynamic volume/pan controls for each channel,
then alsa-lib cannot do it.  its routing function is static only.


Takashi

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Re: ymfpci : four speakers with OSS-emulation

[Adam K Kirchhoff]

On Wed, 13 Mar 2002, Takashi Iwai wrote:

> At Wed, 13 Mar 2002 09:29:58 -0500 (EST),
> Adam K Kirchhoff wrote:
> > 
> > 
> > On Wed, 13 Mar 2002, Takashi Iwai wrote:
> > 
> > > At Wed, 13 Mar 2002 08:01:02 -0500 (EST),
> > > Adam K Kirchhoff wrote:
> > > > 
> > > > The solution the Jaroslav gave in that e-mail actually requires changes to
> > > > the ymfpci driver, as I understand it.  Last time I pulled code from CVS,
> > > > this hadn't been done yet.  From the sound of it (based on your
> > > > experience) it looks like it still hasn't been done.  At the moment, I
> > > > don't really understand Alsa (or sound drivers in general) well enough to
> > > > make the change myself, nor do I really have the time to pick up that
> > > > knowledge at the moment.
> > > > 
> > > > However, it's also my impression from Jaroslav's explanation that this
> > > > would simply duplicate the output from the fron channel on the rear
> > > > channel. Can someone let me know if this is correct?
> > > 
> > > if you only need duplication, this can be done on alsa-lib without
> > > changing the driver itself.
> > 
> > <snip>
> > 
> > What would be required if you're looking for more than duplication?
> 
> dunno.  depending on what you want ;)
> for example, if you need dynamic volume/pan controls for each channel,
> then alsa-lib cannot do it.  its routing function is static only.

Well, this is largely what comes to mind (speaking as one who has a
limited understanding of sound drivers)...

When playing mp3s with a SB Live (using the Alsa drivers) I'm quite
certain that each channel, and each speaker on the channel, is outputting
sound quite independent of the other speakers/channels.  In other words,
the left and right front speakers, and the left and right rear speakers
are independent of each other.  This also works when playing games such as
UnrealTournament.  You can tell whether someone is coming up behind you
from the left or the right.  Make sense so far?

Now, this also works with the ymfpci OSS drivers (the commercial ones,
anyway) as well as the BeOS drivers for the card, so it doesn't seem to be
a limitation of the hardware (though please correct me if I'm wrong).

Now, I'm going to assume here that the ymfpci driver would need some
significant work to be able to do this, correct?

Adam



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Re: ymfpci : four speakers with OSS-emulation

[Takashi Iwai]

At Tue, 13 Mar 2001 17:57:14 -0500 (EST),
Adam K Kirchhoff wrote:
> 
> 
> On Wed, 13 Mar 2002, Takashi Iwai wrote:
> 
> > if you only need duplication, this can be done on alsa-lib without
> > changing the driver itself.
> > try to add the following in your ~/.asoundrc.
> > 
> > 	pcm.ch4dup {
> > 		type plug
> > 		slave.pcm surround40
> > 		ttable.0.0 1
> > 		ttable.1.1 1
> > 		ttable.0.2 1
> > 		ttable.1.3 1
> > 	}
> > 
> > then run like this
> > 
> > 	% aplay -D ch4dup foo.wav
> 
> Well, even this doesn't seem to want to work for me at the moment :-(  I'm
> still only getting audio from the front speakers.
> 
> [ adamk@sorrow ~ ]$ cat .asoundrc 
> pcm.ch4dup {
>         type plug
>         slave.pcm surround40
>         ttable.0.0 1
>         ttable.1.1 1
>         ttable.0.2 1
>         ttable.1.3 1
> }
> 
> [ adamk@sorrow ~ ]$ aplay -D ch4dup saved/sounds/Thunder.wav 
> Playing WAVE 'saved/sounds/Thunder.wav' : Signed 16 bit Little Endian, Rate 22050 Hz, Stereo
> 
> Any further ideas?

what shows with -v option?
can you hear from rear speakers when you play with -Drear ?


Takashi

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Re: ymfpci : four speakers with OSS-emulation

[Adam K Kirchhoff]

On Thu, 14 Mar 2002, Takashi Iwai wrote:

> 
> what shows with -v option?
> can you hear from rear speakers when you play with -Drear ?
> 
> 
> Takashi
> 

Takashi,

	My apologies, but for some reason I had "surround" muted in
alsamixer.  Once I unmuted it, I *am* getting the duplicate sound on the
rear speakers.

	So now, is it likely that we'll see the ymfpci driver changed at
some point so that we can use both the front and rear speakers so that
they don't duplicate each other (as I described in my message yesterday)?
:-)

Adam




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ymfpci : four speakers with OSS-emulation

[xavier.allamigeon]

Cool, it works with aplay ! But the .asoundrc isn't right, you have to change 
it : 
pcm.ch4dup {
             type plug
             slave.pcm surround40
             ttable.0.0 1
             ttable.0.1 1
             ttable.0.2 1
             ttable.0.3 1
     }
and then
aplay -D ch4dup foo.wav will play the sound on the four speakers !!!
 
Otherwise, I have tried aoss, and it doesn't work. Of course, I have added the 
following line to the .asoundrc file
pcm.dsp0 pcm.ch4dup
and then I have tried "aoss tuxracer", and there was no sound in the game. 
But I use the CVS version of alsa-OSS, so maybe there is a bug, I don't know.
Furthermore, why pcm.dsp0 and not pcm.dsp1 or pcm.dsp2 ?

Thank you very much for your great help !
Xavier


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Re: ymfpci : four speakers with OSS-emulation

[Takashi Iwai]

At Thu, 14 Mar 2002 14:30:52 +0100 (MET),
xavier.allamigeon@free.fr wrote:
> 
> Cool, it works with aplay ! But the .asoundrc isn't right, you have to change 
> it : 
> pcm.ch4dup {
>              type plug
>              slave.pcm surround40
>              ttable.0.0 1
>              ttable.0.1 1
>              ttable.0.2 1
>              ttable.0.3 1
>      }
> and then
> aplay -D ch4dup foo.wav will play the sound on the four speakers !!!

no, this will route only the left channel to all 4 speakers..

> Otherwise, I have tried aoss, and it doesn't work. Of course, I have added the 
> following line to the .asoundrc file
> pcm.dsp0 pcm.ch4dup
> and then I have tried "aoss tuxracer", and there was no sound in the game. 
> But I use the CVS version of alsa-OSS, so maybe there is a bug, I don't know.

if the application needs mmap, this doesn't work.
i'm not sure whether tux racer requires oss mmap, though.

> Furthermore, why pcm.dsp0 and not pcm.dsp1 or pcm.dsp2 ?

because as default /dev/dsp is mapped /dev/dsp0.
/dev/dsp1 and dsp2 are for the second and third card.


Takashi

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Re: ymfpci : four speakers with OSS-emulation

[Xavier ALLAMIGEON]

I'm sorry, but my .asoundrc work very fine for me.
O.K. for tux racer, I have understood. XMMS works fine with aoss, that's 
great !
And for the application which use mmap, there is no solution, isn't it ?

Le Jeudi 14 Mars 2002 18:01, vous avez écrit :
> At Thu, 14 Mar 2002 14:30:52 +0100 (MET),
>
> xavier.allamigeon@free.fr wrote:
> > Cool, it works with aplay ! But the .asoundrc isn't right, you have to
> > change it :
> > pcm.ch4dup {
> >              type plug
> >              slave.pcm surround40
> >              ttable.0.0 1
> >              ttable.0.1 1
> >              ttable.0.2 1
> >              ttable.0.3 1
> >      }
> > and then
> > aplay -D ch4dup foo.wav will play the sound on the four speakers !!!
>
> no, this will route only the left channel to all 4 speakers..
>
> > Otherwise, I have tried aoss, and it doesn't work. Of course, I have
> > added the following line to the .asoundrc file
> > pcm.dsp0 pcm.ch4dup
> > and then I have tried "aoss tuxracer", and there was no sound in the
> > game. But I use the CVS version of alsa-OSS, so maybe there is a bug, I
> > don't know.
>
> if the application needs mmap, this doesn't work.
> i'm not sure whether tux racer requires oss mmap, though.
>
> > Furthermore, why pcm.dsp0 and not pcm.dsp1 or pcm.dsp2 ?
>
> because as default /dev/dsp is mapped /dev/dsp0.
> /dev/dsp1 and dsp2 are for the second and third card.
>
>
> Takashi

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Re: ymfpci : four speakers with OSS-emulation

[Adam K Kirchhoff]

On Thu, 14 Mar 2002, Adam K Kirchhoff wrote:

> 
> On Thu, 14 Mar 2002, Takashi Iwai wrote:
> 
> > 
> > what shows with -v option?
> > can you hear from rear speakers when you play with -Drear ?
> > 
> > 
> > Takashi
> > 
> 
> Takashi,
> 
> 	My apologies, but for some reason I had "surround" muted in
> alsamixer.  Once I unmuted it, I *am* getting the duplicate sound on the
> rear speakers.
> 
> 	So now, is it likely that we'll see the ymfpci driver changed at
> some point so that we can use both the front and rear speakers so that
> they don't duplicate each other (as I described in my message yesterday)?
> :-)

I guess that this is something I shouldn't expect to see from Alsa any
time in the not-too-distant future unless I do it myself, then.

Does anyone have any tips or pointers they'd like to give on how one would
go about adding this support to a driver?

Adam



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