Obsolete documentation?

Obsolete documentation?

[Derek Johansen]

Does elks/Documentation/text/networking_guide.txt make
elks/Documentation/text/networking.txt obsolete?  The latter in
Section 2 says ELKS only supports SLIP connections.  I don't think
this is still true?

Re: Obsolete documentation?

[Paul Osmialowski]

So what happened to SLIP support in ELKS? 8-bit ISA ethernet cards 
(with RJ-45 connector) are very rare (I have only one of them, work nicely 
under FreeDOS and in theory it should be supported by ELKS's ne2k driver, 
but it isn't). Within my one more XT machine to play with ELKS, serial 
port is the only means of external communication. PPP/IP or SLIP is 
something ELKS should definitely have IMHO.

Cheers,
Paul

On Sat, 15 Feb 2020, Derek Johansen wrote:

> Does elks/Documentation/text/networking_guide.txt make
> elks/Documentation/text/networking.txt obsolete?  The latter in
> Section 2 says ELKS only supports SLIP connections.  I don't think
> this is still true?
> 

Re: Obsolete documentation?

[Marc-F. Lucca-Daniau]

Hello Derek and Paul,

ELKS is indeed still SLIP capable : 
https://github.com/elks-org/elks/issues/304

One has just to change the command line of 'ktcp' to remove Ethernet and 
put back SLIP.

Documentation is quite outdated. Georges made an effort to document 
Ethernet and some other things while debugging networking features, but 
there are still many legacy documents that need to be reorderer and updated.

Thanks,

MFLD


Le 16/02/2020 à 12:08, Paul Osmialowski a écrit :
> So what happened to SLIP support in ELKS? 8-bit ISA ethernet cards
> (with RJ-45 connector) are very rare (I have only one of them, work nicely
> under FreeDOS and in theory it should be supported by ELKS's ne2k driver,
> but it isn't). Within my one more XT machine to play with ELKS, serial
> port is the only means of external communication. PPP/IP or SLIP is
> something ELKS should definitely have IMHO.
>
> Cheers,
> Paul
>
> On Sat, 15 Feb 2020, Derek Johansen wrote:
>
>> Does elks/Documentation/text/networking_guide.txt make
>> elks/Documentation/text/networking.txt obsolete?  The latter in
>> Section 2 says ELKS only supports SLIP connections.  I don't think
>> this is still true?
>>

Re: Obsolete documentation?

[Georg Potthast]

I wrote a SLIP documentation which shows how to setup a SLIP connection 
between an ELKS system running in QEMU und the host where QEMU is running. 
You could send data from the host to the ELKS system and vice versa. This is 
this document:
elks/Documentation/html/user/setup_slip.html
To me this seemed easier to set up instead of two ELKS systems connected 
with a cross-over serial cable.

Georg

-----Ursprüngliche Nachricht----- 
From: Marc-F. Lucca-Daniau
Sent: Sunday, February 16, 2020 6:05 PM
To: Paul Osmialowski ; Derek Johansen
Cc: ELKS
Subject: Re: Obsolete documentation?

Hello Derek and Paul,

ELKS is indeed still SLIP capable :
https://github.com/elks-org/elks/issues/304

One has just to change the command line of 'ktcp' to remove Ethernet and
put back SLIP.

Documentation is quite outdated. Georges made an effort to document
Ethernet and some other things while debugging networking features, but
there are still many legacy documents that need to be reorderer and updated.

Thanks,

MFLD


Le 16/02/2020 à 12:08, Paul Osmialowski a écrit :
> So what happened to SLIP support in ELKS? 8-bit ISA ethernet cards
> (with RJ-45 connector) are very rare (I have only one of them, work nicely
> under FreeDOS and in theory it should be supported by ELKS's ne2k driver,
> but it isn't). Within my one more XT machine to play with ELKS, serial
> port is the only means of external communication. PPP/IP or SLIP is
> something ELKS should definitely have IMHO.
>
> Cheers,
> Paul
>
> On Sat, 15 Feb 2020, Derek Johansen wrote:
>
>> Does elks/Documentation/text/networking_guide.txt make
>> elks/Documentation/text/networking.txt obsolete?  The latter in
>> Section 2 says ELKS only supports SLIP connections.  I don't think
>> this is still true?
>> 

Re: Obsolete documentation?

[Paul Osmialowski]

[-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 2098 bytes --]

Hi Georg,

Will it connect to SLIP/CSLIP interface as implemented in normal Linux 
kernel (CONFIG_SLIP)?

Thanksm
Paul

On Sun, 16 Feb 2020, Georg Potthast wrote:

> I wrote a SLIP documentation which shows how to setup a SLIP connection
> between an ELKS system running in QEMU und the host where QEMU is running. You
> could send data from the host to the ELKS system and vice versa. This is this
> document:
> elks/Documentation/html/user/setup_slip.html
> To me this seemed easier to set up instead of two ELKS systems connected with
> a cross-over serial cable.
> 
> Georg
> 
> -----Ursprüngliche Nachricht----- From: Marc-F. Lucca-Daniau
> Sent: Sunday, February 16, 2020 6:05 PM
> To: Paul Osmialowski ; Derek Johansen
> Cc: ELKS
> Subject: Re: Obsolete documentation?
> 
> Hello Derek and Paul,
> 
> ELKS is indeed still SLIP capable :
> https://github.com/elks-org/elks/issues/304
> 
> One has just to change the command line of 'ktcp' to remove Ethernet and
> put back SLIP.
> 
> Documentation is quite outdated. Georges made an effort to document
> Ethernet and some other things while debugging networking features, but
> there are still many legacy documents that need to be reorderer and updated.
> 
> Thanks,
> 
> MFLD
> 
> 
> Le 16/02/2020 ? 12:08, Paul Osmialowski a écrit :
> > So what happened to SLIP support in ELKS? 8-bit ISA ethernet cards
> > (with RJ-45 connector) are very rare (I have only one of them, work nicely
> > under FreeDOS and in theory it should be supported by ELKS's ne2k driver,
> > but it isn't). Within my one more XT machine to play with ELKS, serial
> > port is the only means of external communication. PPP/IP or SLIP is
> > something ELKS should definitely have IMHO.
> > 
> > Cheers,
> > Paul
> > 
> > On Sat, 15 Feb 2020, Derek Johansen wrote:
> > 
> > > Does elks/Documentation/text/networking_guide.txt make
> > > elks/Documentation/text/networking.txt obsolete?  The latter in
> > > Section 2 says ELKS only supports SLIP connections.  I don't think
> > > this is still true?
> > > 
> 

Re: Obsolete documentation?

[Georg Potthast]

ELKS does NOT have a special version of SLIP. Therefore you can communicate 
with any Linux host provided you manage to configure this. I would recommend 
to follow my instructions first to get an understanding how to set this up. 
Then make a serial cross over connection cable and test that using two 
terminal programs on each side. Getting the wires linked correctly and 
providing the hardware signals is not trivial for someone who has not done 
that before. If you can send across what you type you can start configuring 
SLIP over this line.

Georg

-----Ursprüngliche Nachricht----- 
From: Paul Osmialowski
Sent: Sunday, February 16, 2020 7:37 PM
To: Georg Potthast
Cc: Paul Osmialowski ; Derek Johansen ; Marc-F. Lucca-Daniau ; ELKS
Subject: Re: Obsolete documentation?

Hi Georg,

Will it connect to SLIP/CSLIP interface as implemented in normal Linux
kernel (CONFIG_SLIP)?

Thanksm
Paul

On Sun, 16 Feb 2020, Georg Potthast wrote:

> I wrote a SLIP documentation which shows how to setup a SLIP connection
> between an ELKS system running in QEMU und the host where QEMU is running. 
> You
> could send data from the host to the ELKS system and vice versa. This is 
> this
> document:
> elks/Documentation/html/user/setup_slip.html
> To me this seemed easier to set up instead of two ELKS systems connected 
> with
> a cross-over serial cable.
>
> Georg
>
> -----Ursprüngliche Nachricht----- From: Marc-F. Lucca-Daniau
> Sent: Sunday, February 16, 2020 6:05 PM
> To: Paul Osmialowski ; Derek Johansen
> Cc: ELKS
> Subject: Re: Obsolete documentation?
>
> Hello Derek and Paul,
>
> ELKS is indeed still SLIP capable :
> https://github.com/elks-org/elks/issues/304
>
> One has just to change the command line of 'ktcp' to remove Ethernet and
> put back SLIP.
>
> Documentation is quite outdated. Georges made an effort to document
> Ethernet and some other things while debugging networking features, but
> there are still many legacy documents that need to be reorderer and 
> updated.
>
> Thanks,
>
> MFLD
>
>
> Le 16/02/2020 ? 12:08, Paul Osmialowski a écrit :
> > So what happened to SLIP support in ELKS? 8-bit ISA ethernet cards
> > (with RJ-45 connector) are very rare (I have only one of them, work 
> > nicely
> > under FreeDOS and in theory it should be supported by ELKS's ne2k 
> > driver,
> > but it isn't). Within my one more XT machine to play with ELKS, serial
> > port is the only means of external communication. PPP/IP or SLIP is
> > something ELKS should definitely have IMHO.
> >
> > Cheers,
> > Paul
> >
> > On Sat, 15 Feb 2020, Derek Johansen wrote:
> >
> > > Does elks/Documentation/text/networking_guide.txt make
> > > elks/Documentation/text/networking.txt obsolete?  The latter in
> > > Section 2 says ELKS only supports SLIP connections.  I don't think
> > > this is still true?
> > >
> 

Re: Obsolete documentation?

[Paul Osmialowski]

[-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 4909 bytes --]

Hi Georg,

I'm using null-modem cable I've made myself and been using it for years 
(it corsses-over Rx/Tx and hardware control lines). It works nicely with 
Telix running under FreeDOS on my XT and minicom on 'big' Linux, at speed 
115200, which is the top speed for 8250 chip on the XT side.

With ELKS it's not that nice. I've managed to configure getty in 
/etc/inittab to use /dev/ttyS0 at the default speed (9600bps), and it 
kinda worked, except it was losing bits from time to time. I'd removed 
getty line from /etc/inittab for other experiments, then I've tried to 
'cat' some text files between ELKS and Linux (and vice versa), and 
although a text sent from ELKS to Linux looked good, the other way round 
it was disaster. I've tried different speeds (using 'stty' on both sides). 
Finally, it looked almost OK at 1200bps, but still I had an impression, 
bit-banging serial port on my old ZX Spectrum +3 offered better 
communication stability at 4800bps than this!

Eventually, I've managed to establish SLIP connection between ELKS and 
Linux, with telnetd running on ELKS, and I could open telnet connection 
that worked for a while... not too long though. I guess, serial connection 
support must be looked upon in ELKS before doing experiments with SLIP.

Trying to follow your instructions, I've encountered some problems with 
the 'ifconfig' line:

- there's no 'up' param in your example; usually I'm adding it after the 
interface name (e.g. 'ifconfig sl0 up ....'),

- the destination address option is different in various versions of 
ifconfig; in your example it was 'pointtopoint', but my 'ifconfig' didn't 
like it; turned out, in my case it should be 'dstaddr' (which some googled 
pages listed as obsolete).

Thanks,
Paul

On Sun, 16 Feb 2020, Georg Potthast wrote:

> ELKS does NOT have a special version of SLIP. Therefore you can communicate
> with any Linux host provided you manage to configure this. I would recommend
> to follow my instructions first to get an understanding how to set this up.
> Then make a serial cross over connection cable and test that using two
> terminal programs on each side. Getting the wires linked correctly and
> providing the hardware signals is not trivial for someone who has not done
> that before. If you can send across what you type you can start configuring
> SLIP over this line.
> 
> Georg
> 
> -----Ursprüngliche Nachricht----- From: Paul Osmialowski
> Sent: Sunday, February 16, 2020 7:37 PM
> To: Georg Potthast
> Cc: Paul Osmialowski ; Derek Johansen ; Marc-F. Lucca-Daniau ; ELKS
> Subject: Re: Obsolete documentation?
> 
> Hi Georg,
> 
> Will it connect to SLIP/CSLIP interface as implemented in normal Linux
> kernel (CONFIG_SLIP)?
> 
> Thanksm
> Paul
> 
> On Sun, 16 Feb 2020, Georg Potthast wrote:
> 
> > I wrote a SLIP documentation which shows how to setup a SLIP connection
> > between an ELKS system running in QEMU und the host where QEMU is running.
> > You
> > could send data from the host to the ELKS system and vice versa. This is
> > this
> > document:
> > elks/Documentation/html/user/setup_slip.html
> > To me this seemed easier to set up instead of two ELKS systems connected
> > with
> > a cross-over serial cable.
> > 
> > Georg
> > 
> > -----Ursprüngliche Nachricht----- From: Marc-F. Lucca-Daniau
> > Sent: Sunday, February 16, 2020 6:05 PM
> > To: Paul Osmialowski ; Derek Johansen
> > Cc: ELKS
> > Subject: Re: Obsolete documentation?
> > 
> > Hello Derek and Paul,
> > 
> > ELKS is indeed still SLIP capable :
> > https://github.com/elks-org/elks/issues/304
> > 
> > One has just to change the command line of 'ktcp' to remove Ethernet and
> > put back SLIP.
> > 
> > Documentation is quite outdated. Georges made an effort to document
> > Ethernet and some other things while debugging networking features, but
> > there are still many legacy documents that need to be reorderer and updated.
> > 
> > Thanks,
> > 
> > MFLD
> > 
> > 
> > Le 16/02/2020 ? 12:08, Paul Osmialowski a écrit :
> > > So what happened to SLIP support in ELKS? 8-bit ISA ethernet cards
> > > (with RJ-45 connector) are very rare (I have only one of them, work >
> > nicely
> > > under FreeDOS and in theory it should be supported by ELKS's ne2k >
> > driver,
> > > but it isn't). Within my one more XT machine to play with ELKS, serial
> > > port is the only means of external communication. PPP/IP or SLIP is
> > > something ELKS should definitely have IMHO.
> > >
> > > Cheers,
> > > Paul
> > >
> > > On Sat, 15 Feb 2020, Derek Johansen wrote:
> > >
> > > > Does elks/Documentation/text/networking_guide.txt make
> > > > elks/Documentation/text/networking.txt obsolete?  The latter in
> > > > Section 2 says ELKS only supports SLIP connections.  I don't think
> > > > this is still true?
> > > >
> > 
> 

Re: Obsolete documentation?

[Paul Osmialowski]

[-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 1594 bytes --]



On Mon, 17 Feb 2020, David Given wrote:

> On Mon, 17 Feb 2020 at 00:30, Paul Osmialowski <pawelo@king.net.pl> wrote:
>       I'm using null-modem cable I've made myself and been using it for years
>       (it corsses-over Rx/Tx and hardware control lines). It works nicely with
>       Telix running under FreeDOS on my XT and minicom on 'big' Linux, at speed
>       115200, which is the top speed for 8250 chip on the XT side.
> 
> 
> Exactly which 8250 is it? Some versions had major bugs which needed non-backwards-compatible workarounds in the BIOS. If the ELKS driver doesn't have these workarounds, which is likely if it's been targeted at later versions of the 8250 which didn't have the bugs,
> then it's likely not to work very well. I also believe (heard from Random Person On The Internet) that driving an 8250 at high speed is difficult due to the very small buffer, and you need very good interrupt performance, which I don't know if ELKS has.
> 
> Information on the different 8250s is here: https://www.freebsd.org/doc/en_US.ISO8859-1/articles/serial-uart/index.html
> 
In this particular case (Amstrad PC 2086) it's on-board Amstrad 40049 UART 
(the same chip as used for a serial port in Amstrad Portable PC models), I 
don't know any more details, except that all DOS programs (e.g. Norton SI) 
report it as 8250. Yet at my old home I have Turbo XT with old, long 8-bit 
ISA I/O card having two regular 8250's on it and as far as I remember, it 
was the first time I experienced losing bits while communicating ELKS and 
Linux running on a bigger PC.

Re: Obsolete documentation?

[Georg Potthast 2]

Hi Paul,
I recall that DOS used the BIOS to send and receive data via the serial port. This resulted in a usable speed of 1200 baud max. Lower speeds were more reliable. Therefore all communication programs used interrupt driven data input and no DOS or BIOS calls. I assume ELKS also uses the BIOS and therefore you are limited to 1200 baud in case of a 8086 processor and have to expect missing data then.

Georg

> Paul Osmialowski <pawelo@king.net.pl> hat am 17. Februar 2020 um 00:26 geschrieben:
> 
> 
> Hi Georg,
> 
> I'm using null-modem cable I've made myself and been using it for years 
> (it corsses-over Rx/Tx and hardware control lines). It works nicely with 
> Telix running under FreeDOS on my XT and minicom on 'big' Linux, at speed 
> 115200, which is the top speed for 8250 chip on the XT side.
> 
> With ELKS it's not that nice. I've managed to configure getty in 
> /etc/inittab to use /dev/ttyS0 at the default speed (9600bps), and it 
> kinda worked, except it was losing bits from time to time. I'd removed 
> getty line from /etc/inittab for other experiments, then I've tried to 
> 'cat' some text files between ELKS and Linux (and vice versa), and 
> although a text sent from ELKS to Linux looked good, the other way round 
> it was disaster. I've tried different speeds (using 'stty' on both sides). 
> Finally, it looked almost OK at 1200bps, but still I had an impression, 
> bit-banging serial port on my old ZX Spectrum +3 offered better 
> communication stability at 4800bps than this!
> 
> Eventually, I've managed to establish SLIP connection between ELKS and 
> Linux, with telnetd running on ELKS, and I could open telnet connection 
> that worked for a while... not too long though. I guess, serial connection 
> support must be looked upon in ELKS before doing experiments with SLIP.
> 
> Trying to follow your instructions, I've encountered some problems with 
> the 'ifconfig' line:
> 
> - there's no 'up' param in your example; usually I'm adding it after the 
> interface name (e.g. 'ifconfig sl0 up ....'),
> 
> - the destination address option is different in various versions of 
> ifconfig; in your example it was 'pointtopoint', but my 'ifconfig' didn't 
> like it; turned out, in my case it should be 'dstaddr' (which some googled 
> pages listed as obsolete).
> 
> Thanks,
> Paul
> 
> On Sun, 16 Feb 2020, Georg Potthast wrote:
> 
> > ELKS does NOT have a special version of SLIP. Therefore you can communicate
> > with any Linux host provided you manage to configure this. I would recommend
> > to follow my instructions first to get an understanding how to set this up.
> > Then make a serial cross over connection cable and test that using two
> > terminal programs on each side. Getting the wires linked correctly and
> > providing the hardware signals is not trivial for someone who has not done
> > that before. If you can send across what you type you can start configuring
> > SLIP over this line.
> > 
> > Georg
> > 
> > -----Ursprüngliche Nachricht----- From: Paul Osmialowski
> > Sent: Sunday, February 16, 2020 7:37 PM
> > To: Georg Potthast
> > Cc: Paul Osmialowski ; Derek Johansen ; Marc-F. Lucca-Daniau ; ELKS
> > Subject: Re: Obsolete documentation?
> > 
> > Hi Georg,
> > 
> > Will it connect to SLIP/CSLIP interface as implemented in normal Linux
> > kernel (CONFIG_SLIP)?
> > 
> > Thanksm
> > Paul
> > 
> > On Sun, 16 Feb 2020, Georg Potthast wrote:
> > 
> > > I wrote a SLIP documentation which shows how to setup a SLIP connection
> > > between an ELKS system running in QEMU und the host where QEMU is running.
> > > You
> > > could send data from the host to the ELKS system and vice versa. This is
> > > this
> > > document:
> > > elks/Documentation/html/user/setup_slip.html
> > > To me this seemed easier to set up instead of two ELKS systems connected
> > > with
> > > a cross-over serial cable.
> > > 
> > > Georg
> > > 
> > > -----Ursprüngliche Nachricht----- From: Marc-F. Lucca-Daniau
> > > Sent: Sunday, February 16, 2020 6:05 PM
> > > To: Paul Osmialowski ; Derek Johansen
> > > Cc: ELKS
> > > Subject: Re: Obsolete documentation?
> > > 
> > > Hello Derek and Paul,
> > > 
> > > ELKS is indeed still SLIP capable :
> > > https://github.com/elks-org/elks/issues/304
> > > 
> > > One has just to change the command line of 'ktcp' to remove Ethernet and
> > > put back SLIP.
> > > 
> > > Documentation is quite outdated. Georges made an effort to document
> > > Ethernet and some other things while debugging networking features, but
> > > there are still many legacy documents that need to be reorderer and updated.
> > > 
> > > Thanks,
> > > 
> > > MFLD
> > > 
> > > 
> > > Le 16/02/2020 ? 12:08, Paul Osmialowski a écrit :
> > > > So what happened to SLIP support in ELKS? 8-bit ISA ethernet cards
> > > > (with RJ-45 connector) are very rare (I have only one of them, work >
> > > nicely
> > > > under FreeDOS and in theory it should be supported by ELKS's ne2k >
> > > driver,
> > > > but it isn't). Within my one more XT machine to play with ELKS, serial
> > > > port is the only means of external communication. PPP/IP or SLIP is
> > > > something ELKS should definitely have IMHO.
> > > >
> > > > Cheers,
> > > > Paul
> > > >
> > > > On Sat, 15 Feb 2020, Derek Johansen wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > Does elks/Documentation/text/networking_guide.txt make
> > > > > elks/Documentation/text/networking.txt obsolete?  The latter in
> > > > > Section 2 says ELKS only supports SLIP connections.  I don't think
> > > > > this is still true?
> > > > >
> > > 
> >

Re: Obsolete documentation?

[Paul Osmialowski]

[-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 6785 bytes --]

Umh... To configure Telix under DOS you need to provide the first I/O port 
and IRQ, so I guess it talks to the hardware directly. Also the other side 
(minicom under Linux) works according to selected communication speed with 
Telix on the XT side. Also, ELKS has I/O ports hardcoded, so I doubt it 
communicates with BIOS for serial I/O, see in 
elks/arch/i86/drivers/char/serial.c:

static struct serial_info ports[NR_SERIAL] = {
    {(char *)0x3f8, 4, 0, DEFAULT_LCR, DEFAULT_MCR, NULL},
    {(char *)0x2f8, 3, 0, DEFAULT_LCR, DEFAULT_MCR, NULL},
    {(char *)0x3e8, 5, 0, DEFAULT_LCR, DEFAULT_MCR, NULL},
    {(char *)0x2e8, 2, 0, DEFAULT_LCR, DEFAULT_MCR, NULL},
};

static char irq_port[NR_SERIAL] = { 3, 1, 0, 2 };

Port 3f8 is the one I entered in Telix under FreeDOS.

On Mon, 17 Feb 2020, Georg Potthast 2 wrote:

> Hi Paul,
> I recall that DOS used the BIOS to send and receive data via the serial port. This resulted in a usable speed of 1200 baud max. Lower speeds were more reliable. Therefore all communication programs used interrupt driven data input and no DOS or BIOS calls. I assume ELKS also uses the BIOS and therefore you are limited to 1200 baud in case of a 8086 processor and have to expect missing data then.
> 
> Georg
> 
> > Paul Osmialowski <pawelo@king.net.pl> hat am 17. Februar 2020 um 00:26 geschrieben:
> > 
> > 
> > Hi Georg,
> > 
> > I'm using null-modem cable I've made myself and been using it for years 
> > (it corsses-over Rx/Tx and hardware control lines). It works nicely with 
> > Telix running under FreeDOS on my XT and minicom on 'big' Linux, at speed 
> > 115200, which is the top speed for 8250 chip on the XT side.
> > 
> > With ELKS it's not that nice. I've managed to configure getty in 
> > /etc/inittab to use /dev/ttyS0 at the default speed (9600bps), and it 
> > kinda worked, except it was losing bits from time to time. I'd removed 
> > getty line from /etc/inittab for other experiments, then I've tried to 
> > 'cat' some text files between ELKS and Linux (and vice versa), and 
> > although a text sent from ELKS to Linux looked good, the other way round 
> > it was disaster. I've tried different speeds (using 'stty' on both sides). 
> > Finally, it looked almost OK at 1200bps, but still I had an impression, 
> > bit-banging serial port on my old ZX Spectrum +3 offered better 
> > communication stability at 4800bps than this!
> > 
> > Eventually, I've managed to establish SLIP connection between ELKS and 
> > Linux, with telnetd running on ELKS, and I could open telnet connection 
> > that worked for a while... not too long though. I guess, serial connection 
> > support must be looked upon in ELKS before doing experiments with SLIP.
> > 
> > Trying to follow your instructions, I've encountered some problems with 
> > the 'ifconfig' line:
> > 
> > - there's no 'up' param in your example; usually I'm adding it after the 
> > interface name (e.g. 'ifconfig sl0 up ....'),
> > 
> > - the destination address option is different in various versions of 
> > ifconfig; in your example it was 'pointtopoint', but my 'ifconfig' didn't 
> > like it; turned out, in my case it should be 'dstaddr' (which some googled 
> > pages listed as obsolete).
> > 
> > Thanks,
> > Paul
> > 
> > On Sun, 16 Feb 2020, Georg Potthast wrote:
> > 
> > > ELKS does NOT have a special version of SLIP. Therefore you can communicate
> > > with any Linux host provided you manage to configure this. I would recommend
> > > to follow my instructions first to get an understanding how to set this up.
> > > Then make a serial cross over connection cable and test that using two
> > > terminal programs on each side. Getting the wires linked correctly and
> > > providing the hardware signals is not trivial for someone who has not done
> > > that before. If you can send across what you type you can start configuring
> > > SLIP over this line.
> > > 
> > > Georg
> > > 
> > > -----Ursprüngliche Nachricht----- From: Paul Osmialowski
> > > Sent: Sunday, February 16, 2020 7:37 PM
> > > To: Georg Potthast
> > > Cc: Paul Osmialowski ; Derek Johansen ; Marc-F. Lucca-Daniau ; ELKS
> > > Subject: Re: Obsolete documentation?
> > > 
> > > Hi Georg,
> > > 
> > > Will it connect to SLIP/CSLIP interface as implemented in normal Linux
> > > kernel (CONFIG_SLIP)?
> > > 
> > > Thanksm
> > > Paul
> > > 
> > > On Sun, 16 Feb 2020, Georg Potthast wrote:
> > > 
> > > > I wrote a SLIP documentation which shows how to setup a SLIP connection
> > > > between an ELKS system running in QEMU und the host where QEMU is running.
> > > > You
> > > > could send data from the host to the ELKS system and vice versa. This is
> > > > this
> > > > document:
> > > > elks/Documentation/html/user/setup_slip.html
> > > > To me this seemed easier to set up instead of two ELKS systems connected
> > > > with
> > > > a cross-over serial cable.
> > > > 
> > > > Georg
> > > > 
> > > > -----Ursprüngliche Nachricht----- From: Marc-F. Lucca-Daniau
> > > > Sent: Sunday, February 16, 2020 6:05 PM
> > > > To: Paul Osmialowski ; Derek Johansen
> > > > Cc: ELKS
> > > > Subject: Re: Obsolete documentation?
> > > > 
> > > > Hello Derek and Paul,
> > > > 
> > > > ELKS is indeed still SLIP capable :
> > > > https://github.com/elks-org/elks/issues/304
> > > > 
> > > > One has just to change the command line of 'ktcp' to remove Ethernet and
> > > > put back SLIP.
> > > > 
> > > > Documentation is quite outdated. Georges made an effort to document
> > > > Ethernet and some other things while debugging networking features, but
> > > > there are still many legacy documents that need to be reorderer and updated.
> > > > 
> > > > Thanks,
> > > > 
> > > > MFLD
> > > > 
> > > > 
> > > > Le 16/02/2020 ? 12:08, Paul Osmialowski a écrit :
> > > > > So what happened to SLIP support in ELKS? 8-bit ISA ethernet cards
> > > > > (with RJ-45 connector) are very rare (I have only one of them, work >
> > > > nicely
> > > > > under FreeDOS and in theory it should be supported by ELKS's ne2k >
> > > > driver,
> > > > > but it isn't). Within my one more XT machine to play with ELKS, serial
> > > > > port is the only means of external communication. PPP/IP or SLIP is
> > > > > something ELKS should definitely have IMHO.
> > > > >
> > > > > Cheers,
> > > > > Paul
> > > > >
> > > > > On Sat, 15 Feb 2020, Derek Johansen wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > > Does elks/Documentation/text/networking_guide.txt make
> > > > > > elks/Documentation/text/networking.txt obsolete?  The latter in
> > > > > > Section 2 says ELKS only supports SLIP connections.  I don't think
> > > > > > this is still true?
> > > > > >
> > > > 
> > >
>