[Bluez-devel] a2dpd and mplayer - any chance to get it working?

[Bluez-devel] a2dpd and mplayer - any chance to get it working?

[Robert Huitl]

Hi,

I was wondering whether it is possible to make the a2dp alsa plugin supply 
correct audio timing to applications like MPlayer. Right now, MPlayer does 
not work with a2dpd because it relies on the audio driver to report accurate 
audio timing information (or something like that).

If a2dpd could measure the delay introduced on the wireless transport, it 
might be possible to supply timing information to media players. The player 
could then sync the video to the audio data, so there should be no delay at 
all between audio and video playback.

Is there something I am missing?
What changes to the alsa plugin would be necessary?

Even if the delay can't be determined exactly, we could just fake that 
information MPlayer is missing, so that a2dpd at least worked together with 
MPlayer (with a small delay, maybe)?

Regards,
  Robert

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[Bluez-devel] RE : a2dpd and mplayer - any chance to get it working?

[Frederic Dalleau]

[-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 2480 bytes --]

Robert,
The sound is ok in mplayer! But the movie is a bit slow :D ...
If you plugin is the pcm.!default, then you can workaround the problem by outputting audio to esound instead of alsa (see mplayer preferences).
Not the best, but worked for me. +/- helped having perfect synchronisation with movie.


Brad,
 I was wondering about alsa plugins :
xmms relies on alsa timing to play, so in the plugin, there is a sleep() call, this will wait a little bit until it is time to retievre new data.
But it seems some players (like mplayer) wants to do their own timing or at least don't want to sleep. They need to use that time to do some decoding instead. If you sleep too long, the decoding will be defered and the sound or movie will be broken.

Is there a rule to distinguish? Or some magic value to sleep?

Frédéric


-------- Message d'origine--------
De: bluez-devel-bounces@lists.sourceforge.net de la part de Robert Huitl
Date: lun. 15/01/2007 03:26
À: bluez-devel@lists.sourceforge.net
Objet : [Bluez-devel] a2dpd and mplayer - any chance to get it working?
 
Hi,

I was wondering whether it is possible to make the a2dp alsa plugin supply 
correct audio timing to applications like MPlayer. Right now, MPlayer does 
not work with a2dpd because it relies on the audio driver to report accurate 
audio timing information (or something like that).

If a2dpd could measure the delay introduced on the wireless transport, it 
might be possible to supply timing information to media players. The player 
could then sync the video to the audio data, so there should be no delay at 
all between audio and video playback.

Is there something I am missing?
What changes to the alsa plugin would be necessary?

Even if the delay can't be determined exactly, we could just fake that 
information MPlayer is missing, so that a2dpd at least worked together with 
MPlayer (with a small delay, maybe)?

Regards,
  Robert

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Re: [Bluez-devel] a2dpd and mplayer - any chance to get it working?

[Robert Huitl]

On Wednesday 17 January 2007 08:03, Frederic Dalleau wrote:
> Robert,
> The sound is ok in mplayer! But the movie is a bit slow :D ...

Yes exactly :)
And then it prints that message about slow CPU, buggy sound drivers, etc.

> If you plugin is the pcm.!default, then you can workaround the problem by
> outputting audio to esound instead of alsa (see mplayer preferences). Not
> the best, but worked for me. +/- helped having perfect synchronisation with
> movie.

Nice. I will try this, but actually I'd rather not have another sound daemon 
(artsd is causing enough problems...)

> Brad,
>  I was wondering about alsa plugins :
> xmms relies on alsa timing to play, so in the plugin, there is a sleep()
> call, this will wait a little bit until it is time to retievre new data.
> But it seems some players (like mplayer) wants to do their own timing or at
> least don't want to sleep. They need to use that time to do some decoding
> instead. If you sleep too long, the decoding will be defered and the sound
> or movie will be broken.

You are talking about this code, aren't you?

static snd_pcm_sframes_t a2dp_transfer2(snd_pcm_ioplug_t * io, char *buf, 
int32_t datatoread)
[...]
  // The data are sent to the daemon that act as a proxy thus we double 
transfer delay to compensate latency
  a2dp_timer_notifyframe(&a2dp->TimerInfos);
  delay = a2dp_timer_sleep(&a2dp->TimerInfos, 4*A2DPTIMERPREDELAY);

Without really knowing what I was doing, I removed the a2dp_timer_sleep call. 
The result: mplayer plays the video as fast as possible (sound was broken, of 
course).

So maybe this delay is too long (however decreasing the delay did not improve 
things) or should not be there at all.

> Is there a rule to distinguish? Or some magic value to sleep?

I had a look at the io->nonblock variable and compared its value while playing 
with mplayer and play (part of sox), but it's 0 for both.

However, mplayer audio output devices implement a function
/* delay in seconds between first and last sample in buffer */
static float get_delay(void)

This function basically calls snd_pcm_delay(), which can be implemented in the 
a2dp io plugin. Mplayer calls this function quite frequently, maybe this is 
how it knows when to write new audio samples.

Robert

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Re: [Bluez-devel] RE : a2dpd and mplayer - any chance to get it working?

[Fabien Chevalier]

Hi Frederic, i think can help you for the second part:

>  I was wondering about alsa plugins :
> xmms relies on alsa timing to play, so in the plugin, there is a sleep() call, this will wait a little bit until it is time to retievre new data.
> But it seems some players (like mplayer) wants to do their own timing or at least don't want to sleep. They need to use that time to do some decoding instead. If you sleep too long, the decoding will be defered and the sound or movie will be broken.
> 
> Is there a rule to distinguish? Or some magic value to sleep?

The key idea is that ALSA applications expect ALSA to run on a hardware 
device that implements a ring buffer as a mean of transferring data from 
  ALSA to the device.
This ring buffer is divided into small chunks, called 'periods'.
ALSA API is expected to block the caller when the ring buffer is full, 
and unblock it when some room is freed. The size of the buffer, as well 
as the period size is up to the application to select so that it best 
fits its needs.

What you've done in the a2dp pcm plugin(if i understood well) is to 
throttle the application using sleep. But that does not emulate the ring 
buffer behaviour well enough, so it breaks MPlayer. :-(

Some more details can be found here : 
http://www.alsa-project.org/alsa-doc/alsa-lib/pcm.html

Cheers,

Fabien

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Re: [Bluez-devel] RE : a2dpd and mplayer - any chance to get it working?

[Brad Midgley]

Guys

> What you've done in the a2dp pcm plugin(if i understood well) is to 
> throttle the application using sleep. But that does not emulate the ring 
> buffer behaviour well enough, so it breaks MPlayer. :-(

although vlc works, maybe it is using the same execution thread for both 
audio and video and getting i/o blocked. when I switch it to a2dp on an 
older machine, full-motion video goes from smooth to very choppy. this 
is using the 32-bit codec so it shouldn't take that much cpu.

is this just a design problem with alsa that should be worked around in 
players?

Brad

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Re: [Bluez-devel] RE : a2dpd and mplayer - any chance to get it working?

[Fabien Chevalier]

Brad Midgley wrote:
> Guys
> 
>> What you've done in the a2dp pcm plugin(if i understood well) is to 
>> throttle the application using sleep. But that does not emulate the ring 
>> buffer behaviour well enough, so it breaks MPlayer. :-(
> 
> although vlc works, maybe it is using the same execution thread for both 
> audio and video and getting i/o blocked. when I switch it to a2dp on an 
> older machine, full-motion video goes from smooth to very choppy. this 
> is using the 32-bit codec so it shouldn't take that much cpu.
> 
> is this just a design problem with alsa that should be worked around in 
> players?


I would rather vote for a bug in a2dp plugin. ;-)
Btw, did you try with sco plugin ? Is it better ?

Cheers,

Fabien

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Re: [Bluez-devel] a2dpd and mplayer - any chance to get it working?

[Robert Huitl]

Hi again,

On Wednesday 17 January 2007 08:03, Frederic Dalleau wrote:
>  I was wondering about alsa plugins :
> xmms relies on alsa timing to play, so in the plugin, there is a sleep()
> call, this will wait a little bit until it is time to retievre new data.
> But it seems some players (like mplayer) wants to do their own timing or at
> least don't want to sleep. They need to use that time to do some decoding
> instead. If you sleep too long, the decoding will be defered and the sound
> or movie will be broken.
>
> Is there a rule to distinguish? Or some magic value to sleep?

I had a look at MPlayer to see what it's doing. It sleeps whenever needed, and 
it finds out how long to sleep by looking at the PCM status. I posted the 
following message to alsa-devel, but unfortunately so far nobody answered. 
Maybe someone on this list knows an answer.

Robert

----------  Forwarded Message  ----------

Subject: snd_pcm_status_get_avail() and external I/O plugins
Date: Thursday 18 January 2007 14:51
From: Robert Huitl <alsa-devel@huitl.de>
To: alsa-devel@lists.sourceforge.net

Hello,

I have some trouble to get mplayer working with an external pcm I/O plugin
(a2dp from bluez). The problem is that mplayer needs to know how much space
is left in the ring buffer:

  snd_pcm_status(alsa_handler, status)
  ret = snd_pcm_status_get_avail(status) * bytes_per_sample;

Now with the ALSA kernel driver, ret will vary, depending on how much data
 was written to the device, and how much time passed.

However, with the I/O plugin, snd_pcm_status_get_avail() always returns the
maximum value (causing mplayer to think that all samples have been played). I
can't find a callback function for the status in snd_pcm_ioplug_callback_t
where I could adjust the avail value.

I'd appreciate any hints.

Robert

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Re: [Bluez-devel] a2dpd and mplayer - any chance to get it working?

[Brad Midgley]

Robert

Frederic is the one who is writing this. He has had some trouble getting
xmms to play without the sleep() call and it may be related to the pcm
status.

Frederic may have been changing things, but at least in what's there I
don't see any status reporting.

Brad

> On Wednesday 17 January 2007 08:03, Frederic Dalleau wrote:
>>  I was wondering about alsa plugins :
>> xmms relies on alsa timing to play, so in the plugin, there is a sleep()
>> call, this will wait a little bit until it is time to retievre new data.
>> But it seems some players (like mplayer) wants to do their own timing or at
>> least don't want to sleep. They need to use that time to do some decoding
>> instead. If you sleep too long, the decoding will be defered and the sound
>> or movie will be broken.
>>
>> Is there a rule to distinguish? Or some magic value to sleep?
> 
> I had a look at MPlayer to see what it's doing. It sleeps whenever needed, and 
> it finds out how long to sleep by looking at the PCM status. I posted the 
> following message to alsa-devel, but unfortunately so far nobody answered. 
> Maybe someone on this list knows an answer.
> 
> Robert
> 
> ----------  Forwarded Message  ----------
> 
> Subject: snd_pcm_status_get_avail() and external I/O plugins
> Date: Thursday 18 January 2007 14:51
> From: Robert Huitl <alsa-devel@huitl.de>
> To: alsa-devel@lists.sourceforge.net
> 
> Hello,
> 
> I have some trouble to get mplayer working with an external pcm I/O plugin
> (a2dp from bluez). The problem is that mplayer needs to know how much space
> is left in the ring buffer:
> 
>   snd_pcm_status(alsa_handler, status)
>   ret = snd_pcm_status_get_avail(status) * bytes_per_sample;
> 
> Now with the ALSA kernel driver, ret will vary, depending on how much data
>  was written to the device, and how much time passed.
> 
> However, with the I/O plugin, snd_pcm_status_get_avail() always returns the
> maximum value (causing mplayer to think that all samples have been played). I
> can't find a callback function for the status in snd_pcm_ioplug_callback_t
> where I could adjust the avail value.
> 
> I'd appreciate any hints.
> 
> Robert
> 
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Re: [Bluez-devel] a2dpd and mplayer - any chance to get it working?

[Frédéric DALLEAU]

Hi,

I've been trying some things and just uploaded an *a2dpd2* plugin.
Tested the plugin with =

aplay,xmms,amarok,vlc,mocp,kaffeine,mplayer,beep-media-player.
This gave good sound on all except mplayer :( but at least the movie =

speed is now correct. This may be worth a try on another computer.
Not had time to try any gst based player.

reports appreciated.

Fr=E9d=E9ric
PS: Note the type plug/slave.pcm trick is not well supported by =

vlc,mocp,bmp. I used alsa-libs 1.0.13 but this should not be required.

> Frederic is the one who is writing this. He has had some trouble getting
> xmms to play without the sleep() call and it may be related to the pcm
> status.
>   =

>>>  I was wondering about alsa plugins :
>>> xmms relies on alsa timing to play, so in the plugin, there is a sleep()
>>> call, this will wait a little bit until it is time to retievre new data.
>>> But it seems some players (like mplayer) wants to do their own timing o=
r at
>>> least don't want to sleep. They need to use that time to do some decodi=
ng
>>> instead. If you sleep too long, the decoding will be defered and the so=
und
>>> or movie will be broken.
>>>
>>> Is there a rule to distinguish? Or some magic value to sleep?
-- =

Frederic

Without the wind, the grass does not move.


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Re: [Bluez-devel] a2dpd and mplayer - any chance to get it working?

[Michael Frey]

I have been successful in using the latest cvs code.  I can watch a  =

movie/listen to music using mplayer.  The audio is a bit choppy, and  =

I get the following error from mplayer.

alsa-play: write error: Operation not permitted
alsa-play: trying to reset sound card

One other problem is sometimes when I start a movie via Mplayer,  it  =

pauses until a fast forward the movie a bit.  Then it continues.

Good progress!!

Michael



On Feb 2, 2007, at 11:55 AM, Fr=E9d=E9ric DALLEAU wrote:

> Hi,
>
> I've been trying some things and just uploaded an *a2dpd2* plugin.
> Tested the plugin with
> aplay,xmms,amarok,vlc,mocp,kaffeine,mplayer,beep-media-player.
> This gave good sound on all except mplayer :( but at least the movie
> speed is now correct. This may be worth a try on another computer.
> Not had time to try any gst based player.
>
> reports appreciated.
>
> Fr=E9d=E9ric
> PS: Note the type plug/slave.pcm trick is not well supported by
> vlc,mocp,bmp. I used alsa-libs 1.0.13 but this should not be required.
>
>> Frederic is the one who is writing this. He has had some trouble  =

>> getting
>> xmms to play without the sleep() call and it may be related to the  =

>> pcm
>> status.
>>
>>>>  I was wondering about alsa plugins :
>>>> xmms relies on alsa timing to play, so in the plugin, there is a  =

>>>> sleep()
>>>> call, this will wait a little bit until it is time to retievre  =

>>>> new data.
>>>> But it seems some players (like mplayer) wants to do their own  =

>>>> timing or at
>>>> least don't want to sleep. They need to use that time to do some  =

>>>> decoding
>>>> instead. If you sleep too long, the decoding will be defered and  =

>>>> the sound
>>>> or movie will be broken.
>>>>
>>>> Is there a rule to distinguish? Or some magic value to sleep?
> -- =

> Frederic
>
> Without the wind, the grass does not move.
>
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------- =

> ---
> Using Tomcat but need to do more? Need to support web services,  =

> security?
> Get stuff done quickly with pre-integrated technology to make your  =

> job easier.
> Download IBM WebSphere Application Server v.1.0.1 based on Apache  =

> Geronimo
> http://sel.as-us.falkag.net/sel? =

> cmd=3Dlnk&kid=3D120709&bid=3D263057&dat=3D121642
> _______________________________________________
> Bluez-devel mailing list
> Bluez-devel@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/bluez-devel


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Re: [Bluez-devel] a2dpd and mplayer - any chance to get it working?

[Tim Chick]

On Friday 02 February 2007 16:55, Fr=E9d=E9ric DALLEAU wrote:
> Hi,
>
> I've been trying some things and just uploaded an *a2dpd2* plugin.
> Tested the plugin with
> aplay,xmms,amarok,vlc,mocp,kaffeine,mplayer,beep-media-player.
> This gave good sound on all except mplayer :( but at least the movie
> speed is now correct. This may be worth a try on another computer.
> Not had time to try any gst based player.
>
> reports appreciated.
>

It looks like this stuff is in flux at the moment?

I am using CVS from last night, and I see basically 100% CPU usage from =

a2dpd, with mpg321 and mplayer whilst it is streaming.

On an old version, from a few months ago, I did not see this problem.

This is running on a 400MHz ARM based system, so there should be plenty =

of CPU available.

Thanks,
Tim

-- =

Tim Chick, Applications Engineer - Convergence SBU
CSR, Cambridge, UK - http://www.csr.com



To access the latest news from CSR copy this link into a web browser:  http=
://www.csr.com/email_sig.php

To get further information regarding CSR, please visit our Investor Relatio=
ns page at http://ir.csr.com/csr/about/overview

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Re: [Bluez-devel] a2dpd and mplayer - any chance to get it working?

[Frederic Dalleau]

> It looks like this stuff is in flux at the moment?
>   
Well, some people reported it works, some said it don't, but to me, it 
works.
> I am using CVS from last night, and I see basically 100% CPU usage from 
> a2dpd, with mpg321 and mplayer whilst it is streaming.
>   
> This is running on a 400MHz ARM based system, so there should be plenty 
> of CPU available.
>   
Try a2dpd -g to get traces, to see possible errors.
Is the sound ok ? Does it do 100% when there is no stream?
Could you try it on pc?

Frederic

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Re: [Bluez-devel] a2dpd and mplayer - any chance to get it working?

[Tim Chick]

On Tuesday 27 March 2007 14:33, Frederic Dalleau wrote:
> > It looks like this stuff is in flux at the moment?
>
> Well, some people reported it works, some said it don't, but to me,
> it works.
>
> > I am using CVS from last night, and I see basically 100% CPU usage
> > from a2dpd, with mpg321 and mplayer whilst it is streaming.
> >
> > This is running on a 400MHz ARM based system, so there should be
> > plenty of CPU available.
>
I also tried a2dpd2, and this "only" took 50% of the CPU.

> Try a2dpd -g to get traces, to see possible errors.
> Is the sound ok ? 


Yes.

> Does it do 100% when there is no stream?
No.

> Could you try it on pc?
>
Yes, but I don't see how that helps :-)

Cheers,
Tim


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[Bluez-devel] Question about poll() - was Re: a2dpd and mplayer - any chance to get it working?

[Frederic Dalleau]

Hi,
I'm investigating the problem tim talked about :
>>> I am using CVS from last night, and I see basically 100% CPU usage
>>> from a2dpd, with mpg321 and mplayer whilst it is streaming.
>>>       =

While I don't get 100% on arm I got a significant cpu usage which the =

previous btsco was not doing.
When streaming a2dpd is calling poll with small timeouts (like 1 ms) to =

ensure packets get sent at right time.
If poll(x,y,1) is replaced by usleep(1); poll(x,y,0) then cpu usage fall =

back to 0.

This means the poll call itself is burning cpu. Mmmm, I think this is =

strange.
Any ideas? What's the best place to find information for question like this?

Fr=E9d=E9ric


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Re: [Bluez-devel] Question about poll() - was Re: a2dpd and mplayer - any chance to get it working?

[Brad Midgley]

Frederic

> If poll(x,y,1) is replaced by usleep(1); poll(x,y,0) then cpu usage fall 
> back to 0.

poll is returning immediately either with an error or with one of your
conditions met. what is in revents after the return? what conditions are
you interested in?

brad

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Re: [Bluez-devel] a2dpd and mplayer - any chance to get it working?

[Frederic Dalleau]

Tim,

>>> I am using CVS from last night, and I see basically 100% CPU usage
>>> from a2dpd, with mpg321 and mplayer whilst it is streaming.
>>>       
Could you try latest cvs? What version of alsa are you using?

Frederic


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