ax25ipd

ax25ipd

[N1UAN Bob]

Hi
I am trying to run the  ax25ipd and each time i do i get
config not found or could not be open the config file is in
/etc/ax25 dir  so wonder why it wont load any ideas!
thanks
Bob N1UAN

Re: ax25ipd

[Steve Fraser]

Bob wrote,

> I am trying to run the  ax25ipd and each time i do i get
> config not found or could not be open the config file is in
> /etc/ax25 dir  so wonder why it wont load any ideas!

This was an area that changed somewhere in ax25ipd. I'm not sure which
versions, but at least one version DOESN'T default the config file
location/name. Try using the command option (-c I think) to tell it where
the config file is.

e.g.

ax25ipd -c /etc/ax25/ax25ipd.conf

cheers
Steve

Re: ax25ipd

[N1UAN Bob]

Hi Steve
thanks and that does work
but now it see that i can get it to connect anywhere
i do have the kissattach up etc
funny i only can get the kissattach to work with cetrian tty or pty
the only tty is S1 and the ptyb2  but i am not sure what i am suppose to
use here to get this to work and  it saids one end of the pipe where is
the other end what place
maye you can give me some ideas in that area!
thanks
Bob


On Mon, 26 Aug 2002, Steve Fraser wrote:

> Bob wrote,
>
> > I am trying to run the  ax25ipd and each time i do i get
> > config not found or could not be open the config file is in
> > /etc/ax25 dir  so wonder why it wont load any ideas!
>
> This was an area that changed somewhere in ax25ipd. I'm not sure which
> versions, but at least one version DOESN'T default the config file
> location/name. Try using the command option (-c I think) to tell it where
> the config file is.
>
> e.g.
>
> ax25ipd -c /etc/ax25/ax25ipd.conf
>
> cheers
> Steve
>
>
> -
> To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-hams" in
> the body of a message to majordomo@vger.kernel.org
> More majordomo info at  http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html
>

Re: ax25ipd

[pa3gcu]

On Monday 26 August 2002 03:13, N1UAN Bob wrote:
> >
> > > I am trying to run the  ax25ipd and each time i do i get
> > > config not found or could not be open the config file is in
> > > /etc/ax25 dir  so wonder why it wont load any ideas!
> >
> > This was an area that changed somewhere in ax25ipd. I'm not sure which
> > versions, but at least one version DOESN'T default the config file
> > location/name. Try using the command option (-c I think) to tell it where
> > the config file is.
> >
> > e.g.
> >
> > ax25ipd -c /etc/ax25/ax25ipd.conf
> >
> > cheers
> > Steve

Use the otherside of the tty/pty pair is what is meant, the opening side is 
defined in ax25ipd.conf an example would be;


device /dev/ttyqa

You then use kissattach to attach the other side as;
kissattach -l  /dev/ptyqa axip 44.56.26.4

Take a look at my home page it has examples..

-- 
Regards Richard
pa3gcu@zeelandnet.nl
http://people.zeelandnet.nl/pa3gcu/

ax25

[Michael Hart]

Hi everyone,

I have RedHat 7.3 and the kernel version is 2.4.18

Could someone tell me what version of the ax25 tools/utilities and libs will
compile and install successfully on this system.  I have 006 tools and they
will not compile.

Given that I am unable to download stuff from sourceforge for some reason I
would also appreciate an offer to email me the latest version.

I know this is not the first time I have requested this information.

I would appreciate help getting onto packet!

Michael Hart
VK2JXI

Re: ax25

[pa3gcu]

On Monday 26 August 2002 07:43, Michael Hart wrote:
> Hi everyone,
>
> I have RedHat 7.3 and the kernel version is 2.4.18
>
> Could someone tell me what version of the ax25 tools/utilities and libs
> will compile and install successfully on this system.  I have 006 tools and
> they will not compile.

Some has told you which files you need, i will add a somewhat important note 
about kernel 2.4.18.
Basicly the advice is dont use it with ax25 as it will hang your machine if 
you try and down interfaces which use 'mkiss'.
Upgrade to 2.4.19 where i belive that problem has been solved.

Now kernel 2.4.19 is far to big to send you in a mail, patch-2.4.19.bz2 is 
4591 Kb IMHO also too large for a mail.

>
> Given that I am unable to download stuff from sourceforge for some reason I
> would also appreciate an offer to email me the latest version.
>
> I know this is not the first time I have requested this information.
>
> I would appreciate help getting onto packet!
>
> Michael Hart
> VK2JXI
>

-- 
Regards Richard
pa3gcu@zeelandnet.nl
http://people.zeelandnet.nl/pa3gcu/

Re: ax25

[M Taylor]

On Mon, Aug 26, 2002 at 01:12:55PM +0000, pa3gcu wrote:
> On Monday 26 August 2002 07:43, Michael Hart wrote:
> > Hi everyone,
> >
> > I have RedHat 7.3 and the kernel version is 2.4.18
> >
> > Could someone tell me what version of the ax25 tools/utilities and libs
> 
> Some has told you which files you need, i will add a somewhat important note 
> about kernel 2.4.18.
> Basicly the advice is dont use it with ax25 as it will hang your machine if 
> you try and down interfaces which use 'mkiss'.
> Upgrade to 2.4.19 where i belive that problem has been solved.
> 
> Now kernel 2.4.19 is far to big to send you in a mail, patch-2.4.19.bz2 is 
> 4591 Kb IMHO also too large for a mail.

Agreed, 2.4.19 is what linux hams should be using.

Kernels are available from many local mirrors, try your country code in place
of 'xx' (us for USA, uk for UK, au for Australia, etc.):
  http://www.xx.kernel.org/pub/linux/kernel/v2.4/

e.g. http://www.au.kernel.org/pub/linux/kernel/v2.4/linux-2.4.19.tar.bz2
For "down under" hams. The bz2 file is handled by bunzip2, and is 5MB smaller
than the gzip file.


Also build the libax25 first, before trying to build the tools and utilities.

Re: ax25

[Michael Hart]

----- Original Message -----
From: Michael Hart <mhart@terrigal.net.au>
To: <linux-hams@vger.kernel.org>
Sent: Monday, August 26, 2002 5:43 PM
Subject: ax25


> Hi everyone,
>
> I have RedHat 7.3 and the kernel version is 2.4.18

Well I have now managed to get the ax25 tools utils and libs to compile.

My trouble is now I cannot find any of the devices that are described in the
ax25 howto.

my /proc/sys/net does not include an ax25 subdirectory (i.e. ax25 is not
running) and ifconfig confirms this.  I have compiled it into the kernel but
it doesn't seem to start.  I have edited my /etc/modules.conf file as
described in the howto but still cannot find /dev/bc0 (even though I have
selected it in the kernel compile)

I cannot set anything up if they are not there.

I don't know where to start.

michael
vk2jxi

Re: ax25

[pa3gcu]

On Sunday 22 September 2002 11:07, Michael Hart wrote:
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Michael Hart <mhart@terrigal.net.au>
> To: <linux-hams@vger.kernel.org>
> Sent: Monday, August 26, 2002 5:43 PM
> Subject: ax25
>
> > Hi everyone,
> >
> > I have RedHat 7.3 and the kernel version is 2.4.18
>
> Well I have now managed to get the ax25 tools utils and libs to compile.
>
> My trouble is now I cannot find any of the devices that are described in
> the ax25 howto.
>
> my /proc/sys/net does not include an ax25 subdirectory (i.e. ax25 is not
> running) and ifconfig confirms this.  I have compiled it into the kernel
> but it doesn't seem to start.  I have edited my /etc/modules.conf file as
> described in the howto but still cannot find /dev/bc0 (even though I have
> selected it in the kernel compile)
>
> I cannot set anything up if they are not there.

They will not be there untill you configure an interface.

I have never used a baycom style modem so i cant help you, however the one 
thing i do (think) i know is that the use of "bcX" is now depreciated, they 
now have another name.

>
> I don't know where to start.
>
> michael
> vk2jxi
>
>
>
> -
> To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-hams" in
> the body of a message to majordomo@vger.kernel.org
> More majordomo info at  http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html

-- 
Regards Richard
pa3gcu@zeelandnet.nl
http://people.zeelandnet.nl/pa3gcu/

Re: ax25

[Michael Hart]

----- Original Message -----
From: pa3gcu <pa3gcu@zeelandnet.nl>
To: Michael Hart <mhart@terrigal.net.au>; <linux-hams@vger.kernel.org>
Sent: Sunday, September 22, 2002 10:21 PM
Subject: Re: ax25


> On Sunday 22 September 2002 11:07, Michael Hart wrote:
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: Michael Hart <mhart@terrigal.net.au>
> > To: <linux-hams@vger.kernel.org>
> > Sent: Monday, August 26, 2002 5:43 PM
> > Subject: ax25
> >
> > > Hi everyone,
> > >
> > > I have RedHat 7.3 and the kernel version is 2.4.18
> >
> > Well I have now managed to get the ax25 tools utils and libs to compile.
> >
> > My trouble is now I cannot find any of the devices that are described in
> > the ax25 howto.
> >
> > my /proc/sys/net does not include an ax25 subdirectory (i.e. ax25 is not
> > running) and ifconfig confirms this.  I have compiled it into the kernel
> > but it doesn't seem to start.  I have edited my /etc/modules.conf file
as
> > described in the howto but still cannot find /dev/bc0 (even though I
have
> > selected it in the kernel compile)
> >
> > I cannot set anything up if they are not there.
>
> They will not be there untill you configure an interface.
>
> I have never used a baycom style modem so i cant help you, however the one
> thing i do (think) i know is that the use of "bcX" is now depreciated,
they
> now have another name.
>
> >
> > I don't know where to start.
> >
> > michael
> > vk2jxi
> >
> --
> Regards Richard
> pa3gcu@zeelandnet.nl
> http://people.zeelandnet.nl/pa3gcu/
>

Thanks Richard,

I guess if /dev/bcX is no longer used then I have an old AX25-HowTo.  What I
need is a pointer to the latest AX25howto I guess

michael (vk2jxi)

Re: ax25

[Tomi Manninen]

On Mon, 23 Sep 2002, Michael Hart wrote:

> I guess if /dev/bcX is no longer used then I have an old AX25-HowTo.  What I
> need is a pointer to the latest AX25howto I guess

What we need is someone writing a new AX25-HOWTO... The one you have is 
probably the latest there is.

Anyway about the baycom driver. The baycom devices are network devices so 
they don't (anymore) have an entry in /dev. Network drivers don't 
generally have one.

Furthermore the names have changed. What you want is probably bcsfN
which stands for BayCom Serial Full-duplex. FOr more information read the 
baycom kernel document:

 /usr/src/linux/Documentation/networking/baycom.txt

-- 
Tomi Manninen           Internet:  oh2bns@sral.fi
OH2BNS                  AX.25:     oh2bns@oh2rbi.fin.eu
KP20ME04                Amprnet:   oh2bns@oh2rbi.ampr.org

Re: ax25

[M Taylor]

On Sun, Sep 22, 2002 at 06:37:07PM +0300, Tomi Manninen wrote:
> On Mon, 23 Sep 2002, Michael Hart wrote:
> 
> > I guess if /dev/bcX is no longer used then I have an old AX25-HowTo.  What I
> > need is a pointer to the latest AX25howto I guess
> 
> What we need is someone writing a new AX25-HOWTO... The one you have is 
> probably the latest there is.

The latest copy is from Sept 2001, and is located at
 http://www.tldp.org/HOWTO/AX25-HOWTO/

One point that was not clear to me, was whether Michael Hart was trying
to use a RedHat distribution kernel (e.g. uname -r returns 2.4.18-5) or a 
custom kernel (recommend getting 2.4.19 from www.au.kernel.org) built 
with AX.25 and Baycom modules enabled. 

Trying to use the RedHat kernel will not work. AFAIK the RedHat kernel has 
no amateur radio device drivers just the ax.25 net/rom and rose protocol 
support.

Re: ax25

[Michael Hart]

Thanks to everyone for helping me get the AX25 network interface up and
running.

ifconfig now shows an inerface labelled bcsf0 with an IP of 44.138.16.46
(whcih is the packet radio ip address I was told to use by our packet ip
co-ordinator).

now all I have to do is configure a program to use it.

The rest of our radio club is using JNOS which has built in pop mail etc.
Apparently we have a pop server station somewhere where our packet mail is
stored and also supports news groups like the internet.

I have been trying to set up this program (and also have has a play with its
big brother TNOS) but can't seem to get the configuration right.  I don't
know what a lot of the packet terms are and how it comes together with the
linux system - what the difference is between the packet ip and the host ip
(for example) in the configuration file.

All of the local club users are using DOS (only the sysadmin[s] are using
linux and they don't like redhat - they are using debian - so don't want to
touch my machine) so the distributed autoexec.nos file is set up for control
of the hardware.

I do not know how to set up the autoexec.nos file to input/output to the
bcsf0 interface rather than trying to grab the hardware itself

(I also do not know a lot of the other things in the autoexec.nos file)

Michael Hart
VK2JXI


----- Original Message -----
From: M Taylor <mctylr@privacy.nb.ca>
To: <linux-hams@vger.kernel.org>
Cc: Michael Hart <mhart@terrigal.net.au>
Sent: Monday, September 23, 2002 3:54 AM
Subject: Re: ax25


> On Sun, Sep 22, 2002 at 06:37:07PM +0300, Tomi Manninen wrote:
> > On Mon, 23 Sep 2002, Michael Hart wrote:
> >
> The latest copy is from Sept 2001, and is located at
>  http://www.tldp.org/HOWTO/AX25-HOWTO/
>
> One point that was not clear to me, was whether Michael Hart was trying
> to use a RedHat distribution kernel (e.g. uname -r returns 2.4.18-5) or a
> custom kernel (recommend getting 2.4.19 from www.au.kernel.org) built
> with AX.25 and Baycom modules enabled.
>
> Trying to use the RedHat kernel will not work. AFAIK the RedHat kernel has
> no amateur radio device drivers just the ax.25 net/rom and rose protocol
> support.
>
>

Re: ax25

[Bob Nielsen]

JNOS acts as if it were actually a separate computer with a
pseudo-network connection and needs its own IP address separately from
the Linux host.

If you want to use JNOS, take a look at the linuxnos.tip file in the
documentation package (cleverly hidden inside linux.zip, which is
contained in the config.zip file).  It has some good examples, however
none of these address your situation where you are using a bcfs0
interface.  That would require routing everything back to the Linux
host.  For those with a TNC on a serial port, JNOS offers a way to set
things up without configuring kernel AX25 support (it was actually
written for DOS and later ported to Linux).
 
However, you don't need to run JNOS in order to interact with the other
stations.  If you already have the AX.25 network stuff running, you can
just use the normal Linux tools for getting mail via POP and reading
news.  Take a look at fetchmail and slrn for example.  Use call for
connecting to another station, listen to monitor the frequency, mheard
to show calls which have been heard.  

Sending mail via SMTP can be interesting if you have your MTA set up to
forward everything to a smart host, however.  Some MUAs have the
capability of setting the smart host separately from the MTA and I have
used this feature in Pine to send packet email via another station in
the local packet network (using a separate user account).  If you are
running a mail server and send the mail directly, your routing will
keep things straight.

73,
Bob Nielsen, N7XY

On Sun, Sep 29, 2002 at 10:43:48AM +1000, Michael Hart wrote:
> Thanks to everyone for helping me get the AX25 network interface up and
> running.
> 
> ifconfig now shows an inerface labelled bcsf0 with an IP of 44.138.16.46
> (whcih is the packet radio ip address I was told to use by our packet ip
> co-ordinator).
> 
> now all I have to do is configure a program to use it.
> 
> The rest of our radio club is using JNOS which has built in pop mail etc.
> Apparently we have a pop server station somewhere where our packet mail is
> stored and also supports news groups like the internet.
> 
> I have been trying to set up this program (and also have has a play with its
> big brother TNOS) but can't seem to get the configuration right.  I don't
> know what a lot of the packet terms are and how it comes together with the
> linux system - what the difference is between the packet ip and the host ip
> (for example) in the configuration file.
> 
> All of the local club users are using DOS (only the sysadmin[s] are using
> linux and they don't like redhat - they are using debian - so don't want to
> touch my machine) so the distributed autoexec.nos file is set up for control
> of the hardware.
> 
> I do not know how to set up the autoexec.nos file to input/output to the
> bcsf0 interface rather than trying to grab the hardware itself
> 
> (I also do not know a lot of the other things in the autoexec.nos file)
> 
> Michael Hart
> VK2JXI
> 
> 
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: M Taylor <mctylr@privacy.nb.ca>
> To: <linux-hams@vger.kernel.org>
> Cc: Michael Hart <mhart@terrigal.net.au>
> Sent: Monday, September 23, 2002 3:54 AM
> Subject: Re: ax25
> 
> 
> > On Sun, Sep 22, 2002 at 06:37:07PM +0300, Tomi Manninen wrote:
> > > On Mon, 23 Sep 2002, Michael Hart wrote:
> > >
> > The latest copy is from Sept 2001, and is located at
> >  http://www.tldp.org/HOWTO/AX25-HOWTO/
> >
> > One point that was not clear to me, was whether Michael Hart was trying
> > to use a RedHat distribution kernel (e.g. uname -r returns 2.4.18-5) or a
> > custom kernel (recommend getting 2.4.19 from www.au.kernel.org) built
> > with AX.25 and Baycom modules enabled.
> >
> > Trying to use the RedHat kernel will not work. AFAIK the RedHat kernel has
> > no amateur radio device drivers just the ax.25 net/rom and rose protocol
> > support.
> >
> >
> 
> 

Re: ax25ipd

[Andrew B.]

Hello Bop,

use -c option with ax25ipd command line  - point to
/etc/ax25/ax25ipd.conf directly...

Hint: Search old linux-ham mailing list archive


Monday, August 26, 2002, 6:25:19 AM, you wrote:
NB> Hi
NB> I am trying to run the  ax25ipd and each time i do i get
NB> config not found or could not be open the config file is in
NB> /etc/ax25 dir  so wonder why it wont load any ideas!
NB> thanks
NB> Bob N1UAN

Best regards,
 Andrew                            mailto:ua1cam@sma.spb.ru

Re: ax25ipd

[pa3gcu]

On Monday 26 August 2002 20:08, Andrew B. wrote:
> Hello Bop,
>
> use -c option with ax25ipd command line  - point to
> /etc/ax25/ax25ipd.conf directly...
>
> Hint: Search old linux-ham mailing list archive
>
>
> Monday, August 26, 2002, 6:25:19 AM, you wrote:
> NB> Hi
> NB> I am trying to run the  ax25ipd and each time i do i get
> NB> config not found or could not be open the config file is in
> NB> /etc/ax25 dir  so wonder why it wont load any ideas!
> NB> thanks
> NB> Bob N1UAN
>
> Best regards,
>  Andrew                            mailto:ua1cam@sma.spb.ru

The search engine in the linux hams archive is broken and has been for a long 
time, i used www.google.com to find the following.

From, http://www.febo.com/packet/linux-ax25/ax25-config.html

There is one thing to watch out for with the new ax25 packages. 
If you install the ax25 stuff from Debian or RedHat packages, they will be 
installed in /usr/sbin with the config files in /etc/ax25. But... if you 
obtain the sources and build them yourself, the programs will be installed in 
/usr/local/sbin with the config files in /usr/local/etc/ax25. That can cause 
problems if the home-built programs need to read, for example, the axports 
file and are looking for it in /usr/local/etc/ax25 when it really lives in 
/etc/ax25. 

The workaround is simple, though it's not The Right Thing according to the 
filesystem standards: make /usr/local/etc/ax25 a symbolic link to /etc/ax25. 
That way, no matter which directory a program looks in for its configuration 
files, it will find the same ones.
To do that, issue this command: ln -s /etc/ax25 /usr/local/etc/ax25

Now that is a good workaround, however if one reads documentation before 
installing the ax25lib, apps and tools then one see's in the INSTALL file the 
following;

To build it you type:
        ./configure
        make
        make install
 
By default, it will install the files in /usr/local.  To change this
so that binaries go in  /usr and the conf files go in /etc
        ./configure --prefix=/usr --sysconfdir=/etc --localstatedir=/var
        make
        make install

It should have made more impression on, USE the ./configure option to get the 
things installed in the correct place. (If correct place is the right word).
This is really a FAQ, it has been discussed many times, but it still has NOT 
been altered to get things defaulty installed where they really belong.

Having said that, it has always been a disscussion about where the default 
directorys really should be.
There seems to be some small descrepancy when a program looks into /etc/ax25 
when it has been installed into /usr/local, but we are hams are we not... 

-- 
Regards Richard
pa3gcu@zeelandnet.nl
http://people.zeelandnet.nl/pa3gcu/

Re: ax25ipd

[w9ya]

As far as I can tell, /usr/local has been "depreciated" into the "old-timers" 
pile. It is not a useful directory for this according to the FHS and LSB.

The source based distro I use (NOT Gentoo btw) places nothing into /usr/local, 
but rather issues the configure options suggested below OR edits source 
appropriately as the binary distros mentioned obviously do.

Bob
w9ya


On Monday 26 August 2002 08:53 pm, pa3gcu wrote:
> On Monday 26 August 2002 20:08, Andrew B. wrote:
> > Hello Bop,
> >
> > use -c option with ax25ipd command line  - point to
> > /etc/ax25/ax25ipd.conf directly...
> >
> > Hint: Search old linux-ham mailing list archive
> >
> >
> > Monday, August 26, 2002, 6:25:19 AM, you wrote:
> > NB> Hi
> > NB> I am trying to run the  ax25ipd and each time i do i get
> > NB> config not found or could not be open the config file is in
> > NB> /etc/ax25 dir  so wonder why it wont load any ideas!
> > NB> thanks
> > NB> Bob N1UAN
> >
> > Best regards,
> >  Andrew                            mailto:ua1cam@sma.spb.ru
>
> The search engine in the linux hams archive is broken and has been for a
> long time, i used www.google.com to find the following.
>
> From, http://www.febo.com/packet/linux-ax25/ax25-config.html
>
> There is one thing to watch out for with the new ax25 packages.
> If you install the ax25 stuff from Debian or RedHat packages, they will be
> installed in /usr/sbin with the config files in /etc/ax25. But... if you
> obtain the sources and build them yourself, the programs will be installed
> in /usr/local/sbin with the config files in /usr/local/etc/ax25. That can
> cause problems if the home-built programs need to read, for example, the
> axports file and are looking for it in /usr/local/etc/ax25 when it really
> lives in /etc/ax25.
>
> The workaround is simple, though it's not The Right Thing according to the
> filesystem standards: make /usr/local/etc/ax25 a symbolic link to
> /etc/ax25. That way, no matter which directory a program looks in for its
> configuration files, it will find the same ones.
> To do that, issue this command: ln -s /etc/ax25 /usr/local/etc/ax25
>
> Now that is a good workaround, however if one reads documentation before
> installing the ax25lib, apps and tools then one see's in the INSTALL file
> the following;
>
> To build it you type:
>         ./configure
>         make
>         make install
>
> By default, it will install the files in /usr/local.  To change this
> so that binaries go in  /usr and the conf files go in /etc
>         ./configure --prefix=/usr --sysconfdir=/etc --localstatedir=/var
>         make
>         make install
>
> It should have made more impression on, USE the ./configure option to get
> the things installed in the correct place. (If correct place is the right
> word). This is really a FAQ, it has been discussed many times, but it still
> has NOT been altered to get things defaulty installed where they really
> belong.
>
> Having said that, it has always been a disscussion about where the default
> directorys really should be.
> There seems to be some small descrepancy when a program looks into
> /etc/ax25 when it has been installed into /usr/local, but we are hams are
> we not...

Re: ax25ipd

[Hamish Moffatt]

On Mon, Aug 26, 2002 at 09:47:08PM +0000, w9ya wrote:
> As far as I can tell, /usr/local has been "depreciated" into the "old-timers" 
> pile. It is not a useful directory for this according to the FHS and LSB.

The distributions (Red Hat, Debian, SuSE, Mandrake etc) shouldn't put
anything in /usr/local, but if you are installing something outside of
the packaging system then /usr/local is the recommended place.

Hamish
-- 
Hamish Moffatt VK3SB <hamish@debian.org> <hamish@cloud.net.au>

Re: ax25ipd

[w9ya]

On Tuesday 27 August 2002 12:05 pm, Hamish Moffatt wrote:
> On Mon, Aug 26, 2002 at 09:47:08PM +0000, w9ya wrote:
> > As far as I can tell, /usr/local has been "depreciated" into the
> > "old-timers" pile. It is not a useful directory for this according to the
> > FHS and LSB.
>
> The distributions (Red Hat, Debian, SuSE, Mandrake etc) shouldn't put
> anything in /usr/local, but if you are installing something outside of
> the packaging system then /usr/local is the recommended place.
>
> Hamish

Yes, and no. If your packaging system installs source, then it shouldn't go 
into ./usr/local. The quote above was followed by another paragraph in the 
original message that specifically indicated this.

Historically /usr/local was a way for Sun to not have user installed software 
conflict with the "authorized" software and upgrades that Sun was 
distributing with their *nix boxes. It solved a problem for them in that 
Sun's files weren't being overwitten (or worse) any longer and allowed their 
users to continue installing software. HP had a somehwt similar convention in 
the way they used /opt.

Curiously, the FHS document;
http://www.pathname.com/fhs/2.2/fhs-4.9.html#FN23
mentions that the purpose of /usr/local is to protect the "locally installed" 
software "from being overwritten". (The document uses the word "safe".)

Bob
w9ya

Re: ax25ipd

[Hamish Moffatt]

On Tue, Aug 27, 2002 at 09:50:31AM +0000, w9ya wrote:
> On Tuesday 27 August 2002 12:05 pm, Hamish Moffatt wrote:
> > The distributions (Red Hat, Debian, SuSE, Mandrake etc) shouldn't put
> > anything in /usr/local, but if you are installing something outside of
> > the packaging system then /usr/local is the recommended place.
> 
> Yes, and no. If your packaging system installs source, then it shouldn't go 
> into ./usr/local. The quote above was followed by another paragraph in the 
> original message that specifically indicated this.

That's right - I don't think what I said conflicts with this. Anything
you install yourself should go into /usr/local. The vendor (Sun, Red
Hat, Debian etc) can overwrite anything except /usr/local. Debian also
leaves all of /opt for the local administrator.

Hamish
-- 
Hamish Moffatt VK3SB <hamish@debian.org> <hamish@cloud.net.au>

Re: ax25ipd

[w9ya]

On Tuesday 27 August 2002 10:36 pm, Hamish Moffatt wrote:
> On Tue, Aug 27, 2002 at 09:50:31AM +0000, w9ya wrote:
> > On Tuesday 27 August 2002 12:05 pm, Hamish Moffatt wrote:
> > > The distributions (Red Hat, Debian, SuSE, Mandrake etc) shouldn't put
> > > anything in /usr/local, but if you are installing something outside of
> > > the packaging system then /usr/local is the recommended place.
> >
> > Yes, and no. If your packaging system installs source, then it shouldn't
> > go into ./usr/local. The quote above was followed by another paragraph in
> > the original message that specifically indicated this.
>
> That's right - I don't think what I said conflicts with this. Anything
> you install yourself should go into /usr/local. The vendor (Sun, Red
> Hat, Debian etc) can overwrite anything except /usr/local. Debian also
> leaves all of /opt for the local administrator.
>
> Hamish

Well , if "install youself" means from a tarball AND un-tracked by the package 
manager, then EITHER /opt OR /usr/local is advised. I would almost NEVER pick 
/usr/local though as there are NO rules for that heirarchy and there ARE 
rules in the FHS for programs installing in /opt. The rules for /opt allow 
for un-problematic removals and upgrades for what is installed there. The 
same cannot be said for the /usr/local, which is why almost everyone regards 
it as "depreciated".

Bob
w9ya

Re: ax25ipd

[pa3gcu]

On Tuesday 27 August 2002 18:22, w9ya wrote:
> On Tuesday 27 August 2002 10:36 pm, Hamish Moffatt wrote:
> > On Tue, Aug 27, 2002 at 09:50:31AM +0000, w9ya wrote:
> > > On Tuesday 27 August 2002 12:05 pm, Hamish Moffatt wrote:
> > > > The distributions (Red Hat, Debian, SuSE, Mandrake etc) shouldn't put
> > > > anything in /usr/local, but if you are installing something outside
> > > > of the packaging system then /usr/local is the recommended place.
> > >
> > > Yes, and no. If your packaging system installs source, then it
> > > shouldn't go into ./usr/local. The quote above was followed by another
> > > paragraph in the original message that specifically indicated this.
> >
> > That's right - I don't think what I said conflicts with this. Anything
> > you install yourself should go into /usr/local. The vendor (Sun, Red
> > Hat, Debian etc) can overwrite anything except /usr/local. Debian also
> > leaves all of /opt for the local administrator.
> >
> > Hamish
>
> Well , if "install youself" means from a tarball AND un-tracked by the
> package manager, then EITHER /opt OR /usr/local is advised. I would almost
> NEVER pick /usr/local though as there are NO rules for that heirarchy and
> there ARE rules in the FHS for programs installing in /opt. The rules for
> /opt allow for un-problematic removals and upgrades for what is installed
> there. The same cannot be said for the /usr/local, which is why almost
> everyone regards it as "depreciated".

Looks like i started this thread, what i mean was, why do the ax25lib/apps/ 
and tools default to /usr/local and place binarys in /usr/local when some 
programs will "still" look in /etc/ax25 for thier config files instead of 
/usr/local/etc thats what i mean, seems like a funny way of doing things to 
me.
Yes the program concernd has the -C option, yes there is the 
./configure --prefix=/usr --sysconfdir=/etc --localstatedir=/var
But folks dont read documentation do they and we constanly see this question 
poping up here on this list simply because one did not read the docs 
beforehand.

>
> Bob
> w9ya

-- 
Regards Richard
pa3gcu@zeelandnet.nl
http://people.zeelandnet.nl/pa3gcu/

Re: ax25ipd

[Hamish Moffatt]

On Wed, Aug 28, 2002 at 05:48:33AM +0000, pa3gcu wrote:
> Looks like i started this thread, what i mean was, why do the ax25lib/apps/ 
> and tools default to /usr/local and place binarys in /usr/local when some 
> programs will "still" look in /etc/ax25 for thier config files instead of 
> /usr/local/etc thats what i mean, seems like a funny way of doing things to 
> me.

/usr/local/etc is unnecessary (and ugly), as the admin is allowed to edit 
/etc directly.

Hamish
-- 
Hamish Moffatt VK3SB <hamish@debian.org> <hamish@cloud.net.au>

Re: ax25ipd

[w9ya]

On Wednesday 28 August 2002 10:42 am, Hamish Moffatt wrote:
> On Wed, Aug 28, 2002 at 05:48:33AM +0000, pa3gcu wrote:
> > Looks like i started this thread, what i mean was, why do the
> > ax25lib/apps/ and tools default to /usr/local and place binarys in
> > /usr/local when some programs will "still" look in /etc/ax25 for thier
> > config files instead of /usr/local/etc thats what i mean, seems like a
> > funny way of doing things to me.
>
> /usr/local/etc is unnecessary (and ugly), as the admin is allowed to edit
> /etc directly.
>
> Hamish

We are in absolute agreement here !

Bob 
w9ya

Re: ax25ipd

[Craig Small]

On Wed, Aug 28, 2002 at 05:48:33AM +0000, pa3gcu wrote:
> Looks like i started this thread, what i mean was, why do the ax25lib/apps/ 
> and tools default to /usr/local and place binarys in /usr/local when some 
> programs will "still" look in /etc/ax25 for thier config files instead of 
> /usr/local/etc thats what i mean, seems like a funny way of doing things to 
> me.
Because people build the programs inconsistently.  More specifically
they build the libraries with one set of options and the binaries with
another.

> Yes the program concernd has the -C option, yes there is the 
> ./configure --prefix=/usr --sysconfdir=/etc --localstatedir=/var
> But folks dont read documentation do they and we constanly see this question 
> poping up here on this list simply because one did not read the docs 
> beforehand.
Well, the must be reading it once then forgetting it.  If they do the
same thing then there is no problem.

The ax25 stuff uses standard auto* tools folks, its pretty common out
there and probably the most common sort of build set.

People don't read documentation, I get plenty of emails that are FAQs;
not just in ax25 stuff.

Part of the problem has been dumb error messages that don't say where
they are looking.  I believe that is being fixed now.

  - Craig
-- 
Craig Small VK2XLZ  GnuPG:1C1B D893 1418 2AF4 45EE  95CB C76C E5AC 12CA DFA5
Eye-Net Consulting http://www.eye-net.com.au/        <csmall@eye-net.com.au>
MIEEE <csmall@ieee.org>                 Debian developer <csmall@debian.org>