Re: Node.js and it's future in debian

[Ray Wells <vk2tv@exemail.com.au>]

All,

Although not currently running a node (although I do run aprs with 
kernel ax25), I started using kernel ax25 back around 1994 (ish) with a 
floppy that booted into ramdisk and provided two ports, one kiss and the 
other baycom. I used node back then but moved on. The disk still works 
but I can't for the life of me remember the logon password :-( Back then 
(kernel 2.0.29) it was ax25-utils-<version> that provided kernel ax25 
apps and tools, in the days prior to ax25-apps and ax25-tools being 
released as separate packages.

When I last ran a node, along with a bbs, I didn't use the node package. 
Instead, I used fpac which provided the facilities I needed - ax25, rose 
and netrom. For many, many years, right up to just last week, I compile 
libax25, ax25-apps & ax25-tools from sources to try to keep as up to 
date as possible with fixes, etc. Although not a user of the packages I 
still appreciate the efforts of the maintainers who produce packages for 
the benefit of users/potential users who don't care to compile from sources.

As for a name change for node, it seems strange that such a long-running 
application should be forced to change simply because of some 
Johnny-come-lately. I think Debian policy in this regard should be 
reviewed to prevent repetition of the current stalemate in the years to 
come. FWIW, I've only ever used Debian or a Debian derivative.

Ray vk2tv

On 04/05/12 14:09, David Ranch wrote:
>
> Me again..
>
> AX.25 in Linux has been around for a long time so I can excuse it's 
> overly generic "node" name purely based upon it's age but..
>
>
>> The working title of Node.js was "server" for a few weeks, before
>> anyone was using it.
>
> Wow.. that's horrible!  Obviously we don't want stuff like that to 
> happen.  Please also consider that all this ISN'T just a *Debian* 
> problem.  Its a Linux distro-wide problem.  It's groups like this that 
> form and guide aspects of all Linux distributions consistency and 
> considering Debian's wide influence, changes here will surely trickle 
> into other distributions over time.
>
> It's also worth touching on that I personally appreciate the work that
> Patrick Ouellette has done on maintaining the HAM packages for Debian. 
> Like always, there are never enough appreciative people in this world 
> but once removed / renamed /etc, I'm SURE a lot of people will come 
> out of the woodwork to bitch about it.  A *lot* of people use Debian 
> and Debian-related distributions with Packet radio.
>
>
>>   1. Which package should use the name "node" in the long term?  What
>>      can we do to ensure that happens eventually?
>>
>>      (My answer is that I hope that neither uses the name "node" in
>>      the long term.)
>
> I personally think that some of it SHOULD be a first come, first 
> served thing.  I previously mentioned in the previous email that all 
> of the various scripts that people run could/would break.  Probably no 
> big deal to many of us on *this* list but trust me, I know a few Linux 
> packet people who would be seriously lost because of these changes.
>
> Also consider the tons of documentation, notably the AX.25 HOWTO that 
> would be impacted and I highly doubt it would get updated (hasn't been 
> since 2001) to reflect these changes.  It's not like things have 
> needed to change all that much - http://tldp.org/HOWTO/AX25-HOWTO/
>
>
>>   2. What should be the state in Debian's upcoming "wheezy" release to
>>      provide a smooth upgrade path and not surprise users too much?
>
> Is Node.js a new addition to Debian?  Again, I side with first come 
> first served.
>
>
>>      I also would hope that wheezy can include a /usr/sbin/node file
>>      that prints a message to help people notice they are still using
>>      it and calls /usr/sbin/axnode, but that is still under discussion.
>>
>>      Likewise, the Node.js needs some migration to ensure scripts
>>      installed by Debian packages and from outside use the new name.
>>      I would hope that wheezy can include a /usr/bin/node synonym for
>>      compatibility until usage of it fades away, but that is still
>>      under discussion.)
>
> If for some reason Debian feels that longstanding packages and their 
> well known binary names can be renamed at any given time (I seriously 
> disagree with that mentality btw), I'd say then ALSO force the change 
> of the "node" in Node.JS name to something more sane.  Don't remove 
> one poorly named file for a new poorly named one just because it's new 
> and shiny.
>
> --David
> -- 
> To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-hams" in
> the body of a message to majordomo@vger.kernel.org
> More majordomo info at  http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html
>