[linux-lvm] Red Hat upgrade over existing LVM

[linux-lvm] Red Hat upgrade over existing LVM

[Nick Urbanik]

Dear team,

We have a number of servers with /usr and /var on LVM.  The difficulty
arises when upgrading from one version of Red Hat to another; the
installation disks do not recognise the logical volumes.

Do any of you have any reasonable approach to solving this?  Do I need
to create a new network installation boot disk with a small kernel with
support for LVM and scripts to turn on LVM groups?

--
Nick Urbanik   RHCE                                  nicku@vtc.edu.hk
Dept. of Information & Communications Technology
Hong Kong Institute of Vocational Education (Tsing Yi)
Tel:   (852) 2436 8576, (852) 2436 8579          Fax: (852) 2436 8526
PGP: 53 B6 6D 73 52 EE 1F EE EC F8 21 98 45 1C 23 7B     ID: 7529555D
GPG: 7FFA CDC7 5A77 0558 DC7A 790A 16DF EC5B BB9D 2C24   ID: BB9D2C24

Re: [linux-lvm] Red Hat upgrade over existing LVM

[Terje Kvernes]

Nick Urbanik <nicku@vtc.edu.hk> writes:

> We have a number of servers with /usr and /var on LVM. The
> difficulty arises when upgrading from one version of Red Hat to
> another; the installation disks do not recognise the logical
> volumes.

  a well known issue.
 
> Do any of you have any reasonable approach to solving this?  

  if you want to do the "normal" thing with a CD-boot-upgrade, no,
  you're fscked.

> Do I need to create a new network installation boot disk with a
> small kernel with support for LVM and scripts to turn on LVM groups?

  that's one way, the easier way is to either use apt or red-carpet to
  upgrade your distro.  with red-carpet, fiddle with
  /etc/redhat-release, apt has dist-upgrade, I think.  I've upgraded
  two machines from 7.0 -> 7.2 with red-carpet, but I'd advice you to
  set off a day with this, even if you get the rpms from somewhere
  besides ximian.

  I did it as follows: grab the rpms from RH7.2, with the updates,
  from a local mirror, and dump them to /var/cache/redcarpet, then
  fiddle with /etc/redhat-release (feel free to install the rpm
  "redhat-release"), then run red-carpet.  things will break and fail
  now and then, fiddle.

  these days I have a RH7.2-box that has an uptime of about 240 days.
  :)

-- 
Terje

RE: [linux-lvm] Red Hat upgrade over existing LVM

[Steve Wray]

One other thing to consider is;
what exactly is it that you want to upgrade/update,
and what is it that you want to preserve?

What I am about to suggest is merely that; a suggestion.
The initial question was about upgrading from one redhat
version to another, so I dont *exactly* address that!

If you are not too deeply committed to redhat as such,
there is always mandrake; that supports LVM
at install or upgrade time.

If you install mandrake on top of your existing 
redhat/LVM system, the mandrake installer will
see the existing volume groups and allow you to
allocate them to mount points etc; thereby not 
*necessarily* losing data. 

You could even create temporary volumes to
install mandrake on then migrate data from the old
volumes to the new ones.

Its rpm based and mostly compatible with redhat rpms.

Actually, since mandrake have been supporting this
for a few versions now, I am surprised that redhat
are lagging behind on this issue!

Warning tho; deleting volumes in the mandrake installer
doesnt work so well.

> -----Original Message-----
> From: linux-lvm-admin@sistina.com 
> [mailto:linux-lvm-admin@sistina.com] On Behalf Of Terje Kvernes
> Sent: Saturday, 6 April 2002 8:29 p.m.
> To: linux-lvm@sistina.com
> Subject: Re: [linux-lvm] Red Hat upgrade over existing LVM
> 
> 
> Nick Urbanik <nicku@vtc.edu.hk> writes:
> 
> > We have a number of servers with /usr and /var on LVM. The 
> difficulty 
> > arises when upgrading from one version of Red Hat to another; the 
> > installation disks do not recognise the logical volumes.
> 
>   a well known issue.
>  
> > Do any of you have any reasonable approach to solving this?
> 
>   if you want to do the "normal" thing with a CD-boot-upgrade, no,
>   you're fscked.
> 
> > Do I need to create a new network installation boot disk 
> with a small 
> > kernel with support for LVM and scripts to turn on LVM groups?
> 
>   that's one way, the easier way is to either use apt or red-carpet to
>   upgrade your distro.  with red-carpet, fiddle with
>   /etc/redhat-release, apt has dist-upgrade, I think.  I've upgraded
>   two machines from 7.0 -> 7.2 with red-carpet, but I'd advice you to
>   set off a day with this, even if you get the rpms from somewhere
>   besides ximian.
> 
>   I did it as follows: grab the rpms from RH7.2, with the updates,
>   from a local mirror, and dump them to /var/cache/redcarpet, then
>   fiddle with /etc/redhat-release (feel free to install the rpm
>   "redhat-release"), then run red-carpet.  things will break and fail
>   now and then, fiddle.
> 
>   these days I have a RH7.2-box that has an uptime of about 240 days.
>   :)
> 
> -- 
> Terje
> 
> _______________________________________________
> linux-lvm mailing list
> linux-lvm@sistina.com 
> http://lists.sistina.com/mailman/listinfo/l> inux-lvm
> read the 
> LVM HOW-TO at 
> http://www.sistina.com/lvm/Pages/howto.html
> 

Re: [linux-lvm] Red Hat upgrade over existing LVM

[Terje Kvernes]

"Steve Wray" <steve.wray@paradise.net.nz> writes:

  [ ... ]

> Actually, since mandrake have been supporting this for a few
> versions now, I am surprised that redhat are lagging behind on this
> issue!

  as far as I know LVM hasn't passed RedHat's testing grounds yet
  (I've muttered complaints about this a few times to them).  on the
  other hand, if you want a neat distro that has LVM support I'd have
  a peek at Gentoo.

-- 
Terje

Re: [linux-lvm] Red Hat upgrade over existing LVM

[Remco Post]

> 
>   as far as I know LVM hasn't passed RedHat's testing grounds yet
>   (I've muttered complaints about this a few times to them).  on the
>   other hand, if you want a neat distro that has LVM support I'd have
>   a peek at Gentoo.
> 
I use lvm (verion 0.9 something) that comes with mandrake linux and am very happy with it. I guess the new 8.2 distro will come with a mode up-to-date lvm, and Mandrake does support a wide range of filesystems as well...


-- 
Met vriendelijke groeten,

Remco Post

SARA - Stichting Academisch Rekencentrum Amsterdam    http://www.sara.nl
High Performance Computing  Tel. +31 20 592 8008    Fax. +31 20 668 3167

"I really didn't foresee the Internet. But then, neither did the computer
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didn't even foresee that the century was going to end." -- Douglas Adams

Re: [linux-lvm] Red Hat upgrade over existing LVM

[Nick Urbanik]

Steve Wray wrote:

> If you are not too deeply committed to redhat as such,
> there is always mandrake; that supports LVM
> at install or upgrade time.
>
> If you install mandrake on top of your existing
> redhat/LVM system, the mandrake installer will
> see the existing volume groups and allow you to
> allocate them to mount points etc; thereby not
> *necessarily* losing data.

How is the Mandrake installation CD as a rescue disk?  Does it support RAID
1 and 5, reiserfs, ext3 as well as LVM?  (in terms of being able to mount
it all and read it).

This could be the great rescue disk we need!

--
Nick Urbanik   RHCE                                  nicku@vtc.edu.hk
Dept. of Information & Communications Technology
Hong Kong Institute of Vocational Education (Tsing Yi)
Tel:   (852) 2436 8576, (852) 2436 8579          Fax: (852) 2436 8526
PGP: 53 B6 6D 73 52 EE 1F EE EC F8 21 98 45 1C 23 7B     ID: 7529555D
GPG: 7FFA CDC7 5A77 0558 DC7A 790A 16DF EC5B BB9D 2C24   ID: BB9D2C24

RE: [linux-lvm] Red Hat upgrade over existing LVM

[Steve Wray]

The mandrake cd1 is the best rescue disk environment
that I've yet found.

I dont know about raid, but it does support LVM, reiser,
XFS, ext3 and probably others too.


> -----Original Message-----
> From: linux-lvm-admin@sistina.com 
> [mailto:linux-lvm-admin@sistina.com] On Behalf Of Nick Urbanik
> Sent: Sunday, 7 April 2002 4:48 p.m.
> To: linux-lvm@sistina.com
> Subject: Re: [linux-lvm] Red Hat upgrade over existing LVM
> 
> 
> Steve Wray wrote:
> 
> > If you are not too deeply committed to redhat as such,
> > there is always mandrake; that supports LVM
> > at install or upgrade time.
> >
> > If you install mandrake on top of your existing
> > redhat/LVM system, the mandrake installer will
> > see the existing volume groups and allow you to
> > allocate them to mount points etc; thereby not
> > *necessarily* losing data.
> 
> How is the Mandrake installation CD as a rescue disk?  Does 
> it support RAID 1 and 5, reiserfs, ext3 as well as LVM?  (in 
> terms of being able to mount it all and read it).
> 
> This could be the great rescue disk we need!
> 
> --
> Nick Urbanik   RHCE                                  nicku@vtc.edu.hk
> Dept. of Information & Communications Technology
> Hong Kong Institute of Vocational Education (Tsing Yi)
> Tel:   (852) 2436 8576, (852) 2436 8579          Fax: (852) 2436 8526
> PGP: 53 B6 6D 73 52 EE 1F EE EC F8 21 98 45 1C 23 7B     ID: 7529555D
> GPG: 7FFA CDC7 5A77 0558 DC7A 790A 16DF EC5B BB9D 2C24   ID: BB9D2C24
> 
> 
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> linux-lvm mailing list
> linux-lvm@sistina.com 
> http://lists.sistina.com/mailman/listinfo/l> inux-lvm
> read the 
> LVM HOW-TO at 
> http://www.sistina.com/lvm/Pages/howto.html
> 

Re: [linux-lvm] Red Hat upgrade over existing LVM

[Eduard Bloch]

#include <hallo.h>
Steve Wray wrote on Sun Apr 07, 2002 um 05:44:39PM:
> The mandrake cd1 is the best rescue disk environment
> that I've yet found.

Try KNOPPIX to change your mind.
http://download.linuxtag.org/knoppix/KNOPPIX_V2.2-BETA-08-04-2002-EN.iso

Gruss/Regards,
Eduard.
-- 
   If Bill Gates had a dime for every time a Windows box crashed...
                ...Oh, wait a minute, he already does.

Re: [linux-lvm] Red Hat upgrade over existing LVM

[Nick Urbanik]

Terje Kvernes wrote:

> Nick Urbanik <nicku@vtc.edu.hk> writes:
>
> > We have a number of servers with /usr and /var on LVM. The
> > difficulty arises when upgrading from one version of Red Hat to
> > another; the installation disks do not recognise the logical
> > volumes.
>
>   a well known issue.
>
> > Do any of you have any reasonable approach to solving this?
>
>   if you want to do the "normal" thing with a CD-boot-upgrade, no,
>   you're fscked.
>
> > Do I need to create a new network installation boot disk with a
> > small kernel with support for LVM and scripts to turn on LVM groups?
>
>   that's one way, the easier way is to either use apt

Does apt work with Red Hat in a usable way?  I tried it a long time ago,
and deleted it.

> or red-carpet to
>   upgrade your distro.  with red-carpet, fiddle with
>   /etc/redhat-release, apt has dist-upgrade, I think.  I've upgraded
>   two machines from 7.0 -> 7.2 with red-carpet, but I'd advice you to
>   set off a day with this, even if you get the rpms from somewhere
>   besides ximian.
>
>   I did it as follows: grab the rpms from RH7.2, with the updates,
>   from a local mirror, and dump them to /var/cache/redcarpet, then
>   fiddle with /etc/redhat-release (feel free to install the rpm
>   "redhat-release"), then run red-carpet.  things will break and fail
>   now and then, fiddle.

I have used rpmfind --autoupgrade
to upgrade from 7.1 to 7.2, and that required not a huge amount of manual
intervention, but more than I want.

I tried using rpmfind to upgrade this machine from 7.2 to 7.2.93, but it
changed my /lib/ld-linux.so and everything ground to a halt.

I had to reboot with init=/sbin/sash to fix it.  Now I have created a
directory
/static, containing lots of statically compiled tools, including the LVM
tools.

We really need a rescue disk that supports LVM, RAID, reiserfs and ext3.
Anyone seen such a beast, or do I have to make it myself?

>   these days I have a RH7.2-box that has an uptime of about 240 days.
>   :)

So you are not yet running a recent kernel?

--
Nick Urbanik   RHCE                                  nicku@vtc.edu.hk
Dept. of Information & Communications Technology
Hong Kong Institute of Vocational Education (Tsing Yi)
Tel:   (852) 2436 8576, (852) 2436 8579          Fax: (852) 2436 8526
PGP: 53 B6 6D 73 52 EE 1F EE EC F8 21 98 45 1C 23 7B     ID: 7529555D
GPG: 7FFA CDC7 5A77 0558 DC7A 790A 16DF EC5B BB9D 2C24   ID: BB9D2C24

Re: [linux-lvm] Red Hat upgrade over existing LVM

[Terje Kvernes]

Nick Urbanik <nicku@vtc.edu.hk> writes:

> Terje Kvernes wrote:
> 
> > that's one way, the easier way is to either use apt
> 
> Does apt work with Red Hat in a usable way?  I tried it a long time
> ago, and deleted it.

  sort of, just mask out ximian-packages and other stuff you can't
  make dependencies for.  otherwise it supposedly works well.  I have
  to admit to using red-carpet mostly myself.
 
> > or red-carpet to upgrade your distro.  with red-carpet, fiddle
> > with /etc/redhat-release, apt has dist-upgrade, I think.  I've
> > upgraded two machines from 7.0 -> 7.2 with red-carpet, but I'd
> > advice you to set off a day with this, even if you get the rpms
> > from somewhere besides ximian.
> >
> > I did it as follows: grab the rpms from RH7.2, with the updates,
> > from a local mirror, and dump them to /var/cache/redcarpet, then
> > fiddle with /etc/redhat-release (feel free to install the rpm
> > "redhat-release"), then run red-carpet.  things will break and
> > fail now and then, fiddle.
> 
> I have used rpmfind --autoupgrade to upgrade from 7.1 to 7.2, and
> that required not a huge amount of manual intervention, but more
> than I want.

  hm, haven't tried that.
 
> I tried using rpmfind to upgrade this machine from 7.2 to 7.2.93,
> but it changed my /lib/ld-linux.so and everything ground to a halt.
  
  ouch.  someone[tm] didn't think when they handed you the rpms.
 
> I had to reboot with init=/sbin/sash to fix it.  Now I have created
> a directory /static, containing lots of statically compiled tools,
> including the LVM tools.

  I've by habit compiled all the tools statically for a long while
  now.
 
> We really need a rescue disk that supports LVM, RAID, reiserfs and
> ext3.  Anyone seen such a beast, or do I have to make it myself?

  Gentoo's default kernel supports this, as well as XFS, out of the
  box. 
 
> > these days I have a RH7.2-box that has an uptime of about 240
> > days.  :)
> 
> So you are not yet running a recent kernel?

  correct.  but only me and my girlfriend can log into it, so
  security-wise it doesn't really matter.  although I do miss certain
  parts of 2.4.18 these days.  :)

  oh, and yes, the box runs 0.9.1_beta7.  which has worked flawlessly
  as long as I've kept _far_ away from known bugs.  :)

-- 
Terje

Re: [linux-lvm] Red Hat upgrade over existing LVM

[Luca Berra]

to various points in the thread
upgrading by hand might be a choice
	rpm -Fvh /mnt/cdrom/RedHat/RPMS/*.rpm
	note the missing dependencies
	rpm -Uvh /all/the/dependencies/you/found.rpm
	rpm -Fvh /mnt/cdrom/RedHat/RPMS/*.rpm

i was able to upgrade from rh6.1 to 6.2 once upon a time by fiddling with up2date

mandrake has good lvm support, albeit they stubbornly refused to add lvm-root support
to 8.2

redhat has lvm support in rawhide, it also has lvm-root support with mkinitrd, dunno
about the installer

mandrake cd1 is a nice rescue disk it has support for about every filesystem on earth
(even if i would have liked ntfs r/w support).
It does not support raid or LVM, on 8.1 it also had the tendencxy to mount one of the mirrors
of your root partition, instead of the whole mirror
i found easier to recover from problems with raid/lvm by booting the mandrake cd in install
mode and switching to a shell as soon as possible.

regards
L.

-- 
Luca Berra -- bluca@comedia.it
        Communication Media & Services S.r.l.
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Re: [linux-lvm] Red Hat upgrade over existing LVM

[Dirk Heinrichs]

On Sat, 6 Apr 2002, Nick Urbanik wrote:

> Dear team,
>
> We have a number of servers with /usr and /var on LVM.  The difficulty
> arises when upgrading from one version of Red Hat to another; the
> installation disks do not recognise the logical volumes.
>
> Do any of you have any reasonable approach to solving this?  Do I need
> to create a new network installation boot disk with a small kernel with
> support for LVM and scripts to turn on LVM groups?
Why do all people think they need to reboot the maschine to upgrade
software? This is not NT :-)

Switch to runlevel 1 (may be optional), mount the CD and use rpm -F (or
-U).

Bye...

	Dirk
-- 
Dirk Heinrichs          | Tel:  +49 (0)241 413 260
Configuration Manager   | Fax:  +49 (0)241 413 2640
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