Network and Apache Question

Network and Apache Question

[Jim Johnson]

Hello Everyone, 

I am still unable to access the apache web server 
http://www.kc4hw.homelinux.net via the internet.  I am able to access the 
apache web server from the lan, so the server is running.  

My configuration is Red Hat 7.2, kernel 2.4.18, Apache 1.3.24, using a 
Linksys BEFSR81 router/firewall.  The Linux box has been assigned 
address 192.168.1.114 by the Linksys device and I have enabled this 
address in the Linksys DMZ Host, which is suppose to make this machine 
visible from the internet.  

I have an amateur radio application running that is visible via telnet, 
however, I have not been able to access apache via the internet.  

Can someone help with this?




Jim Johnson, Melbourne, Florida
jim@kc4hw.net - http://www.kc4hw.net
DXCluster RF Connection: 144.97
Telnet://kc4hw.homelinux.net:8000
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Re: Network and Apache Question

[mike]

Most cable modem ISP's block access to port 80.  What you might be able to
do is have a port redirecter on www.kc4hw.homelinux.net:80 point to
yourcablemodem:8080, or just change the port to 8080 and tell people about
it with that port addition.  I tried telneting to your ip via port 80 and
"no route to host", which means its being dropped on the border routers.


Mike
----- Original Message -----
From: "Jim Johnson" <jim@kc4hw.net>
To: <linux-newbie@vger.kernel.org>
Sent: Tuesday, May 21, 2002 9:56 PM
Subject: Network and Apache Question


> Hello Everyone,
>
> I am still unable to access the apache web server
> http://www.kc4hw.homelinux.net via the internet.  I am able to access the
> apache web server from the lan, so the server is running.
>
> My configuration is Red Hat 7.2, kernel 2.4.18, Apache 1.3.24, using a
> Linksys BEFSR81 router/firewall.  The Linux box has been assigned
> address 192.168.1.114 by the Linksys device and I have enabled this
> address in the Linksys DMZ Host, which is suppose to make this machine
> visible from the internet.
>
> I have an amateur radio application running that is visible via telnet,
> however, I have not been able to access apache via the internet.
>
> Can someone help with this?
>
>
>
>
> Jim Johnson, Melbourne, Florida
> jim@kc4hw.net - http://www.kc4hw.net
> DXCluster RF Connection: 144.97
> Telnet://kc4hw.homelinux.net:8000
> -
> To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-newbie" in
> the body of a message to majordomo@vger.kernel.org
> More majordomo info at  http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html
> Please read the FAQ at http://www.linux-learn.org/faqs
>

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Re: Network and Apache Question

[Ray Olszewski]

At 09:56 PM 5/21/02 -0400, Jim Johnson wrote:
>Hello Everyone,
>
>I am still unable to access the apache web server
>http://www.kc4hw.homelinux.net via the internet.  I am able to access the
>apache web server from the lan, so the server is running.
>
>My configuration is Red Hat 7.2, kernel 2.4.18, Apache 1.3.24, using a
>Linksys BEFSR81 router/firewall.  The Linux box has been assigned
>address 192.168.1.114 by the Linksys device and I have enabled this
>address in the Linksys DMZ Host, which is suppose to make this machine
>visible from the internet.
>
>I have an amateur radio application running that is visible via telnet,
>however, I have not been able to access apache via the internet.
>
>Can someone help with this?


Maybe. First off, I also cannot connect to it. Nor can I ping it , and a 
traceroute stops here--

         25  HE6-EAST-UBRB-P10.cfl.rr.com (24.95.225.2)

So your connectivity problems appear to bigger than you seem to realize. (I 
do get the telnet prompt from port 8000, though.)

Since I see you use rr.com, the first thing you need to check is whether 
your ISP is blocking access to port 80. Some time ago, rr.com did exactly 
this (and a lot of people had to move their Web servers on non-standard 
ports, much as you run your telnet app on a non-standard port, to work 
around this new "feature" of the service provisioning). In my circles, 
rr.com is notorious for making things hard for users who want to veer even 
slightly from rr.com's very narrow model of what activities are acceptable.

If the problem is with rr.com, try running the service on a high port (8080 
is a common choice) and port-forwarding that port to apache (either port 80 
or port 8080 internally, depending on how flexible the Linksys router is 
about port forwarding).

If you check and find that the problem is not with rr.com, then you ned to 
look at your various logs to see where the problem is locally.

1. Check the apache logs to see if the connections reach apache, and 
whether apache responds to them.

2. This isn't a Linksys support list, and I've never actually worked on one 
of the things ... but surely they maintain some sort of log of DENY'd 
packets. See if the ones from either a connection attempt or a response 
attempt (from apache) are logged as blocked for some reason.


--
-----------------------------------------------"Never tell me the 
odds!"--------------
Ray Olszewski					     -- Han Solo
Palo Alto, California, USA				ray@comarre.com
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

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RE: Network and Apache Question

[Ray Olszewski]

Preliminary comment: I added the list back in. Please, let's keep 
discussions of this sort on the list.

At 11:25 AM 5/22/02 +0530, Sridhar J wrote:
>Thanks Ray for that informative post.
>
>One more question: In my registration, I have put www.somename.com for the
>DNS resolution and have widely advertised it. Now when people type the name,
>the ISP is going to block them. Is there any way of getting around this
>problem?

The DNS resolution is not a problem; that part should still work. To do 
what I described, you do need to change the URL, which I suppose means 
changing what you "advertised". The moral of this story is: don't 
"advertise" a URL until you've tested it successfully.

There may be other workarounds, involving redirection, but I believe they 
require that http://www.somename.com resolve to some other IP address (one 
without a port-80 restriction), where a server can redirect the traffic to 
(for example) http://www2.somename.com:8080 .

>BTW, why do some ISPs block port 80?

Ask them, not me. I've seen many excuses offered for this practice, some of 
which I believe, others of which I dismiss as self-serving claptrap ... but 
that's just my opinions. Some ISPs include in their Terms of Service for 
low-end plans a prohibition against running servers, and this is one way 
they enforce that policy.

>Regards
>Sridhar
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: Ray Olszewski [mailto:ray@comarre.com]
>Sent: Wednesday, May 22, 2002 11:10 AM
>To: Sridhar J
>Subject: RE: Network and Apache Question
>
>
>At 10:34 AM 5/22/02 +0530, Sridhar J wrote:
> >Hi
> >
> >How do you set up a router to forward requests from one port to another,
> >when the ISP itself is blocking all requests to port 80? I mean, the
>request
> >to port 80 on the server wouldn't even reach it, since the ISP would block
> >it before that, right?
> >
> >Since so many knowledgeable people are saying the same thing about port
> >forwarding, its obvious that I am wrong. So how how does it work?.
> >
> >Regards
> >Sridhar
>[old stuff deleted]
>
>If the ISP is blocking traffic to port 80, then the traffic has to be to a
>different port when the ISP sees it. To do thism, you change the URL so it
>reads (for example) http://www.kc4hw.homelinux.net:8080 .    This will
>cause browsers to try to connect to port 8080 instead of the normal port
>80. So the traffic will reach the router's *external* interface bound for
>port 8080, which the ISP probably does not block.
>
>  From the router, the destination has to be translated anyway, to whatever
>private IP address the actual server is using (in this instance, you say it
>is 192.168.1.114). Also translating the port from 8080 to 80 is no big
>trick; any Linux-based router can do it. Whether the Linksys you are using
>can or not ... that I don't know ... you'll have to get linksys help from
>Linksys support, not from Linux support.
>
>If the Linksys router cannot do this translation, then you just run your
>Apache server on the same non-standard port as the URL reports, probably by
>using the Port command in /etc/apache/httpd.conf (though you might have
>your system set up differently).
>
>Depending on the details of the Linksys firewall, you may have to do more
>than this. On a typical Linux router, you would also need explicitly to
>open the port to incoming traffic, and you *may* neeed to do something
>similar on the Linksys.

--
-----------------------------------------------"Never tell me the 
odds!"--------------
Ray Olszewski					     -- Han Solo
Palo Alto, California, USA				ray@comarre.com
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

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Re: Network and Apache Question

[Jim Johnson]

Thanks for the help on this problem.  I think I am beginning to understand 
why now.

A couple of more questions:

On 21 May 02, at 19:43, Ray Olszewski wrote:

> At 09:56 PM 5/21/02 -0400, Jim Johnson wrote:
> >Hello Everyone,
> >
> >I am still unable to access the apache web server
> >http://www.kc4hw.homelinux.net via the internet.  I am able to access the
> >apache web server from the lan, so the server is running.
> >
> >My configuration is Red Hat 7.2, kernel 2.4.18, Apache 1.3.24, using a
> >Linksys BEFSR81 router/firewall.  The Linux box has been assigned address
> >192.168.1.114 by the Linksys device and I have enabled this address in the
> >Linksys DMZ Host, which is suppose to make this machine visible from the
> >internet.
> >
> >I have an amateur radio application running that is visible via telnet,
> >however, I have not been able to access apache via the internet.
> >
> >Can someone help with this?
> 
> 
> Maybe. First off, I also cannot connect to it. Nor can I ping it , and a
> traceroute stops here--
> 
>          25  HE6-EAST-UBRB-P10.cfl.rr.com (24.95.225.2)
> 
> So your connectivity problems appear to bigger than you seem to realize. (I
> do get the telnet prompt from port 8000, though.)
> 
> Since I see you use rr.com, the first thing you need to check is whether
> your ISP is blocking access to port 80. Some time ago, rr.com did exactly
> this (and a lot of people had to move their Web servers on non-standard
> ports, much as you run your telnet app on a non-standard port, to work
> around this new "feature" of the service provisioning). In my circles,
> rr.com is notorious for making things hard for users who want to veer even
> slightly from rr.com's very narrow model of what activities are acceptable.

Will leave "sleeping dogs lie" on this, until I have exhausted other 
possibilities with configuration.  
> 
> If the problem is with rr.com, try running the service on a high port (8080
> is a common choice) and port-forwarding that port to apache (either port 80
> or port 8080 internally, depending on how flexible the Linksys router is
> about port forwarding). 

The Linksys allows port forwarding.  But this machine is enable as a DMZ 
Host in the router.  

So if I enabled port 8080 (or another port) in httpd.conf, then it would 
serve pages upon request to http://www.kc4hw.homelinux.net:8080?  
> 
> If you check and find that the problem is not with rr.com, then you ned to
> look at your various logs to see where the problem is locally.
> 
> 1. Check the apache logs to see if the connections reach apache, and 
> whether apache responds to them.
> 
> 2. This isn't a Linksys support list, and I've never actually worked on one
> of the things ... but surely they maintain some sort of log of DENY'd
> packets. See if the ones from either a connection attempt or a response
> attempt (from apache) are logged as blocked for some reason.

Thanks, I never thought to check the logs.  Guess this should have been 
the first thing to check....Guess that why I am a newbie!  

I suppose I should take additional questions in this area to the Apache 
list.  Thanks for the help once again.  It is nice to be able to ask 
questions about different Linux project at this list and get good intelligent 
advice (no flames).. 

Best regards!


Jim Johnson, Melbourne, Florida
jim@kc4hw.net - http://www.kc4hw.net
DXCluster RF Connection: 144.97
Telnet://kc4hw.homelinux.net:8000
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Re: Network and Apache Question

[Ray Olszewski]

At 06:21 AM 5/22/02 -0400, Jim Johnson wrote:
[...]
> > If the problem is with rr.com, try running the service on a high port (8080
> > is a common choice) and port-forwarding that port to apache (either port 80
> > or port 8080 internally, depending on how flexible the Linksys router is
> > about port forwarding).
>
>The Linksys allows port forwarding.  But this machine is enable as a DMZ
>Host in the router.
>
>So if I enabled port 8080 (or another port) in httpd.conf, then it would
>serve pages upon request to http://www.kc4hw.homelinux.net:8080?


It should, if the Linksys is not set to block port 8080 and if all the 
other Apache settings are correct. At least the requests should *reach* the 
Apache server, and if they fail, you can consult the Apache logs (and this 
list) to figure out any remaining problems.




--
-----------------------------------------------"Never tell me the 
odds!"--------------
Ray Olszewski					     -- Han Solo
Palo Alto, California, USA				ray@comarre.com
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

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Re: Network and Apache Question

[Richard Adams]

On Wednesday 22 May 2002 16:44, Ray Olszewski wrote:
> At 06:21 AM 5/22/02 -0400, Jim Johnson wrote:
> [...]
>
> > > If the problem is with rr.com, try running the service on a high port
> > > (8080 is a common choice) and port-forwarding that port to apache
> > > (either port 80 or port 8080 internally, depending on how flexible the
> > > Linksys router is about port forwarding).
> >
> >The Linksys allows port forwarding.  But this machine is enable as a DMZ
> >Host in the router.
> >
> >So if I enabled port 8080 (or another port) in httpd.conf, then it would
> >serve pages upon request to http://www.kc4hw.homelinux.net:8080?

Jim, i tryed the above URL, its working i got the standard apache "Its 
working page"..

>
> It should, if the Linksys is not set to block port 8080 and if all the
> other Apache settings are correct. At least the requests should *reach* the
> Apache server, and if they fail, you can consult the Apache logs (and this
> list) to figure out any remaining problems.
>
>
>
>
> --
> -----------------------------------------------"Never tell me the
> odds!"--------------
> Ray Olszewski					     -- Han Solo
> Palo Alto, California, USA				ray@comarre.com
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------
>----------------
>
> -
> To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-newbie" in
> the body of a message to majordomo@vger.kernel.org
> More majordomo info at  http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html
> Please read the FAQ at http://www.linux-learn.org/faqs

-- 
Regards Richard
pa3gcu@zeelandnet.nl
http://people.zeelandnet.nl/pa3gcu/

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Re: Network and Apache Question

[Jim Johnson]

Hello Everyone, 

With Ray's advise and help, I have got it working now.  I changed the 
httpd.conf for port 80 to 8080 and with the correct url 
http://www.kc4hw.homelinux.net:8080 is comes up fine.  

I would like to thank everyone for their help! 



On 22 May 02, at 18:20, Richard Adams wrote:

> On Wednesday 22 May 2002 16:44, Ray Olszewski wrote:
> > At 06:21 AM 5/22/02 -0400, Jim Johnson wrote:
> > [...]
> >
> > > > If the problem is with rr.com, try running the service on a high port
> > > > (8080 is a common choice) and port-forwarding that port to apache
> > > > (either port 80 or port 8080 internally, depending on how flexible
> > > > the Linksys router is about port forwarding).
> > >
> > >The Linksys allows port forwarding.  But this machine is enable as a DMZ
> > >Host in the router.
> > >
> > >So if I enabled port 8080 (or another port) in httpd.conf, then it would
> > >serve pages upon request to http://www.kc4hw.homelinux.net:8080?
> 
> Jim, i tryed the above URL, its working i got the standard apache "Its
> working page"..
> 
> >
> > It should, if the Linksys is not set to block port 8080 and if all the
> > other Apache settings are correct. At least the requests should *reach*
> > the Apache server, and if they fail, you can consult the Apache logs (and
> > this list) to figure out any remaining problems.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > -----------------------------------------------"Never tell me the
> > odds!"--------------
> > Ray Olszewski					     -- Han Solo
> > Palo Alto, California, USA				ray@comarre.com
> > -------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > --
> >----------------
> >
> > -
> > To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-newbie"
> > in the body of a message to majordomo@vger.kernel.org More majordomo info
> > at  http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html Please read the FAQ at
> > http://www.linux-learn.org/faqs
> 
> -- 
> Regards Richard
> pa3gcu@zeelandnet.nl
> http://people.zeelandnet.nl/pa3gcu/
> 
> 


Jim Johnson, Melbourne, Florida
jim@kc4hw.net - http://www.kc4hw.net
DXCluster RF Connection: 144.97
Telnet://kc4hw.homelinux.net:8000
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