searching a mail solution

searching a mail solution

[Mateusz Łoskot]

Hello All,

I have some idea and I have some questions:

I'm using "CABLE MODEM" internet connection, I mean I have a small box
(cable modem) which is connected with BNC cable comming from my ISP.
My ISP is a bit popular in Europe (Austria, Poland, Germany etc.).
It is called CHELLO.

So, this ISP doesn't allow to run any server services.
I know that I could run some servers (www, ftp, mail) with some tricks
;) in order to be not visible (my services) for my ISP.
Bay the way, could someone explain me, how to make services on my box
unvisible for  my ISP ?
I know that I can run, for example FTP server on different ports and
so on, but I think that my ISP can make some monitoring of SYN packets
going straigth to my server and check on which port someone try to
connect with my server.
What do you think, am I talking nonsense ?

But, as I said  on the start, I;m going to not use tricks ;)

My local home network structure looks like this:

3 machines: 1x linux (Slackware), 2x Windows.
Slackware runs as local network server: printer server, file server
(with big HDD), backup server, and masq & firewall .

So, me and my Wife works on 2 Windows machines, we have e-mail and www
accounts outside (in different ISP's).
As I said, we have'nt any server on Linux machine.

I have some idea:

I would like to treat my Linux as e-mail (pop3) server.
Linux is running 24 hours per day, so it could fetch mail from our
e-mail accounts and on windows machines, I could fetch e-mails
straight from my Linux server (it could runs POP3 server).
So, Linux may try to fetch e-mails every 15 minutes.
This solution could prevent my e-mail accounts (which I have in
different ISP's) to run out of free space, because my Linux (in my
home, fetches this e-mails).
When I'll send my e-mails, I will use SMTP servers from my ISP's
(outside my home network).
So, I have some question:

Could someone try to explain me what software should I install ?
I know that I have to install some POP3 server or/and fetchmail.

Any suggestions, piece of advice ???

Best regards,

--

Mateusz £oskot
E-mail: m.loskot@chello.pl
GG#: 792434

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Re: searching a mail solution

[Richard Adams]

On Sunday 19 May 2002 17:04, Mateusz ?oskot wrote:
> Hello All,
>
> I have some idea and I have some questions:
>
> I'm using "CABLE MODEM" internet connection, I mean I have a small box
> (cable modem) which is connected with BNC cable comming from my ISP.
> My ISP is a bit popular in Europe (Austria, Poland, Germany etc.).
> It is called CHELLO.

In Holland we have a word for "chello" but i will spare everyone that.

>
> So, this ISP doesn't allow to run any server services.

Please explain, run servers, who is chello so dictate what "they" a;;ow and 
don not allow, they provide an "internet service" which means you the end 
user are connect to the net, it does not matter what you do or what services 
you supply to others, you pay on a data basis, or is it so much different in 
your Country as it is here in Holland.?????

> I know that I could run some servers (www, ftp, mail) with some tricks
> ;) in order to be not visible (my services) for my ISP.

That is AFAIK not nessasary..

> Bay the way, could someone explain me, how to make services on my box
> unvisible for  my ISP ?

I think you need to understand that every byte of data is readable to you 
isp, every packet is readable so your isp knows on which ports you operate,
its up to you to encrypt your data so noone can read your data period, but 
you cannot stop one from seeing to which port it is sent and which port it 
came from.

> I know that I can run, for example FTP server on different ports and
> so on, but I think that my ISP can make some monitoring of SYN packets
> going straigth to my server and check on which port someone try to
> connect with my server.
> What do you think, am I talking nonsense ?

I said nothing, but your isp can see "everything" belive me, o BTW; he see's 
it only if he wants to..

>
> But, as I said  on the start, I;m going to not use tricks ;)

Why should you.???

>
> My local home network structure looks like this:
>
> 3 machines: 1x linux (Slackware), 2x Windows.
> Slackware runs as local network server: printer server, file server
> (with big HDD), backup server, and masq & firewall .
>
> So, me and my Wife works on 2 Windows machines, we have e-mail and www
> accounts outside (in different ISP's).
> As I said, we have'nt any server on Linux machine.
>
> I have some idea:
>
> I would like to treat my Linux as e-mail (pop3) server.
> Linux is running 24 hours per day, so it could fetch mail from our
> e-mail accounts and on windows machines, I could fetch e-mails
> straight from my Linux server (it could runs POP3 server).
> So, Linux may try to fetch e-mails every 15 minutes.
> This solution could prevent my e-mail accounts (which I have in
> different ISP's) to run out of free space, because my Linux (in my
> home, fetches this e-mails).
> When I'll send my e-mails, I will use SMTP servers from my ISP's
> (outside my home network).
> So, I have some question:
>
> Could someone try to explain me what software should I install ?
> I know that I have to install some POP3 server or/and fetchmail.

Simply use IP_MASQ on your linux router for you internal network,  i have had 
to read between the lines here but i think you mean, you want your internal 
machines to be able to access the net via chello right.?????

>
> Any suggestions, piece of advice ???

Yes one, please try to explain just what you want to do as here in Holland i 
know of many who use CHELLO and one can do what one wants, its a pay as you 
go basis not you may not have servers...

>
> Best regards,
>
> --
>
> Mateusz £oskot
> E-mail: m.loskot@chello.pl
> GG#: 792434
>

-- 
Regards Richard
pa3gcu@zeelandnet.nl
http://people.zeelandnet.nl/pa3gcu/

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Re: searching a mail solution

[Tom Beer]

Hi,

> So, this ISP doesn't allow to run any server services.

then, I would change my ISP, if I'm not allowed to run my on 
mail services, or whatever service.

Greets Tom

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Re[2]: searching a mail solution

[Mateusz £oskot]

Hello Tom,

Monday, May 20, 2002, 12:32:44 AM, you wrote:
>> So, this ISP doesn't allow to run any server services.
TB> then, I would change my ISP, if I'm not allowed to run my on
TB> mail services, or whatever service.

Hm, easy to say ;)
This is one of few ISP which serve a very cheap internet connection.
CHELLO is known in a few countries here in Europe.
CHELLO provides cable TV and CABLE MODEM internet connection.
So, here in Poland I pay about 20 $ per month for 512 kbps so, it is
very cheap (in Poland).
But when I'd like to change my ISP , i have to pay about 100 $ per
month, I'm a student, so I haven't a lot of money ;)

So I'm searching other ways.

Best Regards

--

Mateusz £oskot
E-mail: m.loskot@chello.pl
GG#: 792434

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Re: searching a mail solution

[Ray Olszewski]

See below.

At 07:04 PM 5/19/02 +0200, =?ISO-8859-2?B?TWF0ZXVzeiCjb3Nrb3Q=?= wrote:
>Hello All,
>
>I have some idea and I have some questions:
>
>I'm using "CABLE MODEM" internet connection, I mean I have a small box
>(cable modem) which is connected with BNC cable comming from my ISP.
>My ISP is a bit popular in Europe (Austria, Poland, Germany etc.).
>It is called CHELLO.
>
>So, this ISP doesn't allow to run any server services.
>I know that I could run some servers (www, ftp, mail) with some tricks
>;) in order to be not visible (my services) for my ISP.
>Bay the way, could someone explain me, how to make services on my box
>unvisible for  my ISP ?
>I know that I can run, for example FTP server on different ports and
>so on, but I think that my ISP can make some monitoring of SYN packets
>going straigth to my server and check on which port someone try to
>connect with my server.
>What do you think, am I talking nonsense ?

You can't really make service "invisible", since, in order to be services,
the relevant clients need to find them. So a sufficiently attentive ISP will
find pretty much any service you run.

That said ... the *usual* practice of the ISPs I'm familiar with is to pay
attention only to the well-known ports of troublesome services, like http
and ftp. (I mean "troublesome" from their point of view ... services that
would actually *use* the bandwidth they charge you for.) So the usual
solution is to make the servies not invisible but unobtrusive, by running
them on non-standard ports.

How well this works depends on the service. For some, it makes the service
useless -- easy examples are SMTP and DNS. For othere, it creates only a
tiny inconvenience -- ssh is a good example, since few people would be using
it and you can simply tell them what port to use. Others are somewhere in
berween -- URLs for http and ftp servers can include a port number.

>But, as I said  on the start, I;m going to not use tricks ;)
>
>My local home network structure looks like this:
>
>3 machines: 1x linux (Slackware), 2x Windows.
>Slackware runs as local network server: printer server, file server
>(with big HDD), backup server, and masq & firewall .
>
>So, me and my Wife works on 2 Windows machines, we have e-mail and www
>accounts outside (in different ISP's).
>As I said, we have'nt any server on Linux machine.
>
>I have some idea:
>
>I would like to treat my Linux as e-mail (pop3) server.
>Linux is running 24 hours per day, so it could fetch mail from our
>e-mail accounts and on windows machines, I could fetch e-mails
>straight from my Linux server (it could runs POP3 server).
>So, Linux may try to fetch e-mails every 15 minutes.
>This solution could prevent my e-mail accounts (which I have in
>different ISP's) to run out of free space, because my Linux (in my
>home, fetches this e-mails).
>When I'll send my e-mails, I will use SMTP servers from my ISP's
>(outside my home network).
>So, I have some question:
>
>Could someone try to explain me what software should I install ?
>I know that I have to install some POP3 server or/and fetchmail.
>
>Any suggestions, piece of advice ???

You basically are right abotu what you need to run. I haven't done this in a
long time, so my memory is hazy, but I think you want 4 components:

1. fetchmail -- the POP3 **client** that will get your mail from external
POP3 servers for local redistribution.

2. sendmail, exim, or another SMTP server -- as I say, it's been awhile, but
I *think* fetchmail uses the local SMTP server to distribute the mail it
downloads to local accounts. In any case, you may want this to relay
outgoing mail to whatever outside SMTP forwarder(s) you use.

3. procmail -- you may or may not need this, depending on the complexity of
your outside mail setups. It will let you sort mail.

4. a POP3 or IMAP *server* -- to let the individual workstations get their
mail from the local Linux server. We use popa3d here, but for on-LAN uses,
where security isn't usually much of a concern, whatever default choice your
distro makes is probably fine.


--
------------------------------------"Never tell me the odds!"---
Ray Olszewski                                        -- Han Solo
Palo Alto, CA           	 	         ray@comarre.com        
----------------------------------------------------------------

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Re[2]: searching a mail solution

[Ray Olszewski]

  A couple fo quick answers below.

At 10:44 AM 5/20/02 +0200, Mateusz £oskot wrote:
>[...]
>I think that I understand, so you are saying that I can run POP3 on other 
>that 110
>port ?
Yes, sure. But if you are running POP3 *ONLY* for access by the machines on 
the LAN, then your ISp will not care that you are running a "service". Nor 
will it notice, if you do it right ... you will set up firewall (ipchains 
or iptables) rules that allow connections to the POP3 server only from the 
LAN, not the Internet. (Unless, of course, I have misunderstood your 
intent, in which case your setup requirements may be quite a bit more 
involved than I have assumed up to now.)

>[...]
>RO> 2. sendmail, exim, or another SMTP server -- as I say, it's been 
>awhile, but
>RO> I *think* fetchmail uses the local SMTP server to distribute the mail it
>RO> downloads to local accounts. In any case, you may want this to relay
>RO> outgoing mail to whatever outside SMTP forwarder(s) you use.
>
>Oh, it means that I need some SMTP server for dispatching mails to
>destination accounts ?
>I use for a small purpose, for example for sending logs or warnings, a
>very small SMTP server called sSMTP. I think that it could runs in
>place exim or sendmail.

As I said, I'm not sure if you need this or not. It depends on details of 
your setup that you have not described.

>[...]
>I use Slackware, but it doesn't matter what kind of POP3 server comes
>with my distro.
>I would like to install the most secure ;)) (Am I paranoid ;)))
>You say that popa3d is a good choice ?


Well. it;s what we actually use, but only for on-LAN redistribution of 
e-mail. We've neverf encountered a security problem with it, and I seem to 
recall that one announced vulnerability was patched quickly. You will need 
to watch that ... as I recall, Slackware's system for alereting security 
updatres isn't all that good (compared to, say, Debian or Red Hat), so you 
may want to join and monitor a general-purpose security list like bugtraq.



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