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From: Eric Biggers <ebiggers@kernel.org>
To: Ignat Korchagin <ignat@linux.win>
Cc: Kamran Khan <kz@inspirated.com>,
	Jeff Barnes <jeffbarnes@linux.microsoft.com>,
	Andy Lutomirski <luto@amacapital.net>,
	"linux-crypto@vger.kernel.org" <linux-crypto@vger.kernel.org>,
	Herbert Xu <herbert@gondor.apana.org.au>,
	"linux-doc@vger.kernel.org" <linux-doc@vger.kernel.org>,
	"linux-api@vger.kernel.org" <linux-api@vger.kernel.org>,
	"linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org" <linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org>,
	"netdev@vger.kernel.org" <netdev@vger.kernel.org>,
	Linus Torvalds <torvalds@linux-foundation.org>
Subject: Re: [PATCH] crypto: af_alg - Document the deprecation of AF_ALG
Date: Mon, 11 May 2026 21:38:29 +0000	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <20260511213829.GA316710@google.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <3bfcf406-fdde-4303-9bd6-0d8d21ddba37@linux.win>

On Mon, May 11, 2026 at 10:03:21PM +0100, Ignat Korchagin wrote:
> I don't think fully discounting hardware offloading is beneficial here. HW
> accelerators will be produced and without a common interface vendors would
> start implementing their own "bespoke" drivers with bespoke userspace
> interfaces (we already had such proposals), which in turn may introduce more
> attack surface. Yes, AF_ALG needs substantial improvement, but at least it
> can be a standardisation point.

That isn't the best way to accelerate symmetric crypto anymore though,
if it ever was.  This has been known for a long time.

> > In any case, any hypothetical security benefit provided by AF_ALG would
> > have to be *very high* to outweigh the continuous stream of
> > vulnerabilities in it.  I understand that people using AF_ALG might not
> > be familiar with that continuous stream of vulnerabilities, but it would
> 
> 
> Is it actually that much compared to other features/subsystems, like eBPF or
> user namespaces? But we don't rush to deprecate those - instead trying to
> harden them and come up with better design.

There are plenty of other kernel features with a large attack surface,
of course.  But they tend to be much more useful than AF_ALG.  It's all
about weighing benefits vs. risks.

When we get the point where a large number of Linux users *had* to
disable AF_ALG as an emergency vulnerability response, and at the same
time their systems weren't even using AF_ALG so nothing even broke and
they could have just done that to begin with, I think we get a very
clear idea of which side is heavier for AF_ALG in the real world.

The main relevance of AF_ALG to the Linux community is that it allows
their systems to be exploited.

- Eric

      reply	other threads:[~2026-05-11 21:38 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 15+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
     [not found] <20260430011544.31823-1-ebiggers@kernel.org>
2026-05-04 14:39 ` [PATCH] crypto: af_alg - Document the deprecation of AF_ALG Jon Kohler
2026-05-04 17:39   ` Eric Biggers
2026-05-04 18:12     ` Jeff Barnes
2026-05-04 18:24       ` Eric Biggers
2026-05-04 18:27       ` Simo Sorce
2026-05-04 17:41   ` Jeff Barnes
2026-05-05  9:31 ` Herbert Xu
2026-05-05 23:17 ` Andy Lutomirski
2026-05-06  0:17   ` Eric Biggers
2026-05-06 14:42   ` Jeff Barnes
2026-05-10 15:54     ` Kamran Khan
2026-05-10 16:32       ` Eric Biggers
2026-05-10 18:06         ` Andy Lutomirski
2026-05-11 21:03         ` Ignat Korchagin
2026-05-11 21:38           ` Eric Biggers [this message]

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