how to stop broadcasts using iptables

how to stop broadcasts using iptables

[sschlesi]

hi, 

I'm trying to stop broadcasts getting forwarded, but I'm  not sure how to do 
this. i read that *.255 - which are afaik broadcast addresses - doesnt 
guarantie that its a broadcast. then i read that its possible by matching the 
mac address, because broadcast will have ff:ff:ff:ff:ff:ff . but I'm not sure 
if that's all  nonsense.

maybe someone here could help me.

~sts

Re: how to stop broadcasts using iptables

[David Cannings]

On Tuesday 27 April 2004 13:35, sschlesi@chello.at wrote:
> I'm trying to stop broadcasts getting forwarded, but I'm  not sure how
> to do this. i read that *.255 - which are afaik broadcast addresses -

My first question is why are broadcasts getting forwarded anyway?  Neither 
ethernet or IP broadcasts should leave your subnet.  How and where 
exactly are broadcasts being forwarded?

IP addresses ending in .255 are not always broadcast addresses.  Any 
subnet larger than class C (/24) can span more than one "block" of 256 IP 
addresses.

> doesnt guarantie that its a broadcast. then i read that its possible by
> matching the mac address, because broadcast will have ff:ff:ff:ff:ff:ff
> . but I'm not sure if that's all  nonsense.

There is the difference here between an IP broadcast and an ethernet 
broadcast.  IP broadcasts are sent to the ethernet broadcast address [1], 
so you may be able to do a MAC match.

According to the manual page I have here, the module "mac" only offers a 
--mac-source option but there are more options in PoM I believe, you may 
want to check the mailing list archives.

David

1- A ping to the broadcast address on a LAN:
13:44:59.765871 0:10:XX:XX:XX:XX Broadcast ip 98: 192.168.0.100 > 
192.168.0.255: icmp: echo request (DF)

Re: how to stop broadcasts using iptables

[Alexander Samad]

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On Tue, Apr 27, 2004 at 01:50:11PM +0100, David Cannings wrote:
> On Tuesday 27 April 2004 13:35, sschlesi@chello.at wrote:
> > I'm trying to stop broadcasts getting forwarded, but I'm  not sure how
> > to do this. i read that *.255 - which are afaik broadcast addresses -
> 
> My first question is why are broadcasts getting forwarded anyway?  Neither 
> ethernet or IP broadcasts should leave your subnet.  How and where 
> exactly are broadcasts being forwarded?

maybe he is bridging ?

> 
> IP addresses ending in .255 are not always broadcast addresses.  Any 
> subnet larger than class C (/24) can span more than one "block" of 256 IP 
> addresses.
> 
> > doesnt guarantie that its a broadcast. then i read that its possible by
> > matching the mac address, because broadcast will have ff:ff:ff:ff:ff:ff
> > . but I'm not sure if that's all  nonsense.
> 
> There is the difference here between an IP broadcast and an ethernet 
> broadcast.  IP broadcasts are sent to the ethernet broadcast address [1], 
> so you may be able to do a MAC match.
> 
> According to the manual page I have here, the module "mac" only offers a 
> --mac-source option but there are more options in PoM I believe, you may 
> want to check the mailing list archives.
> 
> David
> 
> 1- A ping to the broadcast address on a LAN:
> 13:44:59.765871 0:10:XX:XX:XX:XX Broadcast ip 98: 192.168.0.100 > 
> 192.168.0.255: icmp: echo request (DF)
> 
> 

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Re: how to stop broadcasts using iptables

[Aleksandar Milivojevic]

sschlesi@chello.at wrote:
> hi, 
> 
> I'm trying to stop broadcasts getting forwarded, but I'm  not sure how to do 
> this. i read that *.255 - which are afaik broadcast addresses - doesnt 
> guarantie that its a broadcast. then i read that its possible by matching the 
> mac address, because broadcast will have ff:ff:ff:ff:ff:ff . but I'm not sure 
> if that's all  nonsense.

IP broadcast address does not need to end with 255.  It is convention on 
C class subnets to give it address of 255 (all ones), however 
theoretically it can be any address, as long as you define it as 
broadcast address on all of your machines.  If you subnet C class to 
even smaller subnets and use "all ones" convetion for broadcast address, 
broadcast address will not end in 255 (for example, using "all ones" 
convetion, broadcast address of 192.168.1.0/25 would be 192.168.1.127). 
  Same goes for A or B class subnets (If your network is defined as 
192.168.0.0/16, broadcast address (using convention) would be 
192.168.255.255, so in this case 192.168.12.255 is not broadcast 
address, it's just a host in 192.168.0.0/16).

However, do note that 255.255.255.255 is always valid broadcast address!

The answer to your second question is, yes, on Ethernet 
ff:ff:ff:ff:ff:ff is always an (Ethernet) broadcast.  Ethernet 
broadcasts are not the same as IP broadcast.  However, IP broadcasts 
packets will be encapsulated into Ethernet broadcast packets (unless you 
have something really wrong in your configuraion).  Do note that I saw 
at least one broken higher level protocol implementation (no, it wasn't 
IP) that spit out everything using Ethernet broadcasts.

As David already told you, broadcasts should not be routed (if you want 
them to be routed, you usually need to read tips-and-tricks section in 
your router configuration, and do something to make it work).  So the 
router is the place to have them blocked.

-- 
Aleksandar Milivojevic <amilivojevic@pbl.ca>    Pollard Banknote Limited
Systems Administrator                           1499 Buffalo Place
Tel: (204) 474-2323 ext 276                     Winnipeg, MB  R3T 1L7

Re: how to stop broadcasts using iptables

[Angel j Alvarez]

try pkttype match

El Martes, 27 de Abril de 2004 16:46, Aleksandar Milivojevic escribió:
> sschlesi@chello.at wrote:
> > hi,
> >
> > I'm trying to stop broadcasts getting forwarded, but I'm  not sure how to
> > do this. i read that *.255 - which are afaik broadcast addresses - doesnt
> > guarantie that its a broadcast. then i read that its possible by matching
> > the mac address, because broadcast will have ff:ff:ff:ff:ff:ff . but I'm
> > not sure if that's all  nonsense.
>
> IP broadcast address does not need to end with 255.  It is convention on
> C class subnets to give it address of 255 (all ones), however
> theoretically it can be any address, as long as you define it as
> broadcast address on all of your machines.  If you subnet C class to
> even smaller subnets and use "all ones" convetion for broadcast address,
> broadcast address will not end in 255 (for example, using "all ones"
> convetion, broadcast address of 192.168.1.0/25 would be 192.168.1.127).
>   Same goes for A or B class subnets (If your network is defined as
> 192.168.0.0/16, broadcast address (using convention) would be
> 192.168.255.255, so in this case 192.168.12.255 is not broadcast
> address, it's just a host in 192.168.0.0/16).
>
> However, do note that 255.255.255.255 is always valid broadcast address!
>
> The answer to your second question is, yes, on Ethernet
> ff:ff:ff:ff:ff:ff is always an (Ethernet) broadcast.  Ethernet
> broadcasts are not the same as IP broadcast.  However, IP broadcasts
> packets will be encapsulated into Ethernet broadcast packets (unless you
> have something really wrong in your configuraion).  Do note that I saw
> at least one broken higher level protocol implementation (no, it wasn't
> IP) that spit out everything using Ethernet broadcasts.
>
> As David already told you, broadcasts should not be routed (if you want
> them to be routed, you usually need to read tips-and-tricks section in
> your router configuration, and do something to make it work).  So the
> router is the place to have them blocked.

Re: how to stop broadcasts using iptables

[sschlesi]

David Cannings wrote:


>>On Tuesday 27 April 2004 13:35, sschlesi@chello.at wrote:
>>
>
>>>>I'm trying to stop broadcasts getting forwarded, but I'm  not sure how
>>>>to do this. i read that *.255 - which are afaik broadcast addresses -
>
>>
>>
>>My first question is why are broadcasts getting forwarded anyway?  Neither 
>>ethernet or IP broadcasts should leave your subnet.  How and where 
>>exactly are broadcasts being forwarded?
>>

my policies are set to -P FORWARD ACCEPT because its just an simple ethernet router, w/o nat and stuff.
so i thought iptables'll also forward broadcasts from one net to the other.


>>
>>IP addresses ending in .255 are not always broadcast addresses.  Any 
>>subnet larger than class C (/24) can span more than one "block" of 256 IP 
>>addresses.
>>
>
>>>>doesnt guarantie that its a broadcast. then i read that its possible by
>>>>matching the mac address, because broadcast will have ff:ff:ff:ff:ff:ff
>>>>. but I'm not sure if that's all  nonsense.
>
>>
>>
>>There is the difference here between an IP broadcast and an ethernet 
>>broadcast.  IP broadcasts are sent to the ethernet broadcast address [1], 
>>so you may be able to do a MAC match.
>>
>>According to the manual page I have here, the module "mac" only offers a 
>>--mac-source option but there are more options in PoM I believe, you may 
>>want to check the mailing list archives.
>>
>>David
>>
>>1- A ping to the broadcast address on a LAN:
>>13:44:59.765871 0:10:XX:XX:XX:XX Broadcast ip 98: 192.168.0.100 > 
>>192.168.0.255: icmp: echo request (DF)
>>

Re: how to stop broadcasts using iptables

[Aleksandar Milivojevic]

sschlesi@chello.at wrote:
> my policies are set to -P FORWARD ACCEPT because its just an simple ethernet router, w/o nat and stuff.
> so i thought iptables'll also forward broadcasts from one net to the other.

No.  Netfilter is not going to forward them all-by-itself.  The packet 
will end up in FORWARD chain only if the kernel decides it needs to 
route it from one interface to another.  So, if your kernel is not 
routing broadcast packets (it shouldn't by default), you will not see 
them in FORWARD chain.

-- 
Aleksandar Milivojevic <amilivojevic@pbl.ca>    Pollard Banknote Limited
Systems Administrator                           1499 Buffalo Place
Tel: (204) 474-2323 ext 276                     Winnipeg, MB  R3T 1L7