From: Peter Zijlstra <peterz-wEGCiKHe2LqWVfeAwA7xHQ@public.gmane.org>
To: Nathan Lynch <ntl-e+AXbWqSrlAAvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org>
Cc: Andrew Morton
<akpm-de/tnXTf+JLsfHDXvbKv3WD2FQJk+8+b@public.gmane.org>,
containers-cunTk1MwBs9QetFLy7KEm3xJsTq8ys+cHZ5vskTnxNA@public.gmane.org,
LKML <linux-kernel-u79uwXL29TY76Z2rM5mHXA@public.gmane.org>,
stable-DgEjT+Ai2ygdnm+yROfE0A@public.gmane.org,
Rafael Wysocki <rjw-KKrjLPT3xs0@public.gmane.org>,
Nigel Cunningham <nigel-jrkICu/7yk3k1uMJSBkQmQ@public.gmane.org>,
linux-pm-cunTk1MwBs9QetFLy7KEm3xJsTq8ys+cHZ5vskTnxNA@public.gmane.org,
Thomas Gleixner <tglx-hfZtesqFncYOwBW4kG4KsQ@public.gmane.org>,
Ingo Molnar <mingo-X9Un+BFzKDI@public.gmane.org>
Subject: Re: [patch 2/2] sched: fix nr_uninterruptible accounting of frozen tasks really
Date: Sat, 18 Jul 2009 14:56:31 +0200 [thread overview]
Message-ID: <1247921791.6597.5.camel@laptop> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <1247864134.17553.30.camel-bi+AKbBUZKY6gyzm1THtWbp2dZbC/Bob@public.gmane.org>
On Fri, 2009-07-17 at 15:55 -0500, Nathan Lynch wrote:
> On Fri, 2009-07-17 at 18:47 +0200, Peter Zijlstra wrote:
> > On Fri, 2009-07-17 at 08:22 -0700, Matt Helsley wrote:
> >
> > > The job scheduler in question does not use FROZEN as a transient state and
> > > does not use checkpoint/restart at all since c/r is still a work in progress.
>
> Right, the job scheduler uses the cgroup freezer as a mechanism to
> preempt a low priority job for a higher priority job. (It had used
> SIGSTOP in the past.) So in this scenario a frozen cgroup may remain in
> that state for a while. Load average is consulted as a measure of
> system utilization.
I think that this is an utterly broken use for it, if you want something
like that make a signal cgroup or something and deliver SIGSTOP to all
of them.
In other words, why is the freezer any better than the SIGSTOP approach?
> > > Even when used for power management it seems wrong to count frozen tasks
> > > towards the loadavg since they aren't using CPU time or waiting for IO.
> >
> > You're abusing it for _WHAT_?
>
> I think Matt was referring to system-wide suspend/resume/hibernate, not
> a behavior of the job scheduler, if that's your concern.
I understood he referred to the crazy use-case you mentioned above, IMHO
frozen should be a temporary state used for things like
snapshot/migrate.
I'm still very tempted to plain simply revert that original patch.
WARNING: multiple messages have this Message-ID (diff)
From: Peter Zijlstra <peterz@infradead.org>
To: Nathan Lynch <ntl@pobox.com>
Cc: Matt Helsley <matthltc@us.ibm.com>,
Thomas Gleixner <tglx@linutronix.de>,
LKML <linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org>,
Andrew Morton <akpm@linux-foundation.org>,
Rafael Wysocki <rjw@sisk.pl>, Ingo Molnar <mingo@elte.hu>,
Nigel Cunningham <nigel@tuxonice.net>,
stable@kernel.org, containers@lists.linux-foundation.org,
linux-pm@lists.linux-foundation.org
Subject: Re: [patch 2/2] sched: fix nr_uninterruptible accounting of frozen tasks really
Date: Sat, 18 Jul 2009 14:56:31 +0200 [thread overview]
Message-ID: <1247921791.6597.5.camel@laptop> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <1247864134.17553.30.camel@localhost.localdomain>
On Fri, 2009-07-17 at 15:55 -0500, Nathan Lynch wrote:
> On Fri, 2009-07-17 at 18:47 +0200, Peter Zijlstra wrote:
> > On Fri, 2009-07-17 at 08:22 -0700, Matt Helsley wrote:
> >
> > > The job scheduler in question does not use FROZEN as a transient state and
> > > does not use checkpoint/restart at all since c/r is still a work in progress.
>
> Right, the job scheduler uses the cgroup freezer as a mechanism to
> preempt a low priority job for a higher priority job. (It had used
> SIGSTOP in the past.) So in this scenario a frozen cgroup may remain in
> that state for a while. Load average is consulted as a measure of
> system utilization.
I think that this is an utterly broken use for it, if you want something
like that make a signal cgroup or something and deliver SIGSTOP to all
of them.
In other words, why is the freezer any better than the SIGSTOP approach?
> > > Even when used for power management it seems wrong to count frozen tasks
> > > towards the loadavg since they aren't using CPU time or waiting for IO.
> >
> > You're abusing it for _WHAT_?
>
> I think Matt was referring to system-wide suspend/resume/hibernate, not
> a behavior of the job scheduler, if that's your concern.
I understood he referred to the crazy use-case you mentioned above, IMHO
frozen should be a temporary state used for things like
snapshot/migrate.
I'm still very tempted to plain simply revert that original patch.
next prev parent reply other threads:[~2009-07-18 12:56 UTC|newest]
Thread overview: 41+ messages / expand[flat|nested] mbox.gz Atom feed top
2009-07-17 12:24 [patch 0/2] fix load average accounting Thomas Gleixner
2009-07-17 12:24 ` [patch 1/2] sched: fix load average accounting vs. cpu hotplug Thomas Gleixner
2009-07-17 12:25 ` [patch 2/2] sched: fix nr_uninterruptible accounting of frozen tasks really Thomas Gleixner
2009-07-17 12:25 ` Thomas Gleixner
2009-07-17 12:25 ` Thomas Gleixner
2009-07-17 12:31 ` Peter Zijlstra
2009-07-17 12:48 ` Thomas Gleixner
2009-07-17 12:48 ` Thomas Gleixner
2009-07-17 12:48 ` Thomas Gleixner
[not found] ` <alpine.LFD.2.00.0907171441020.11571-bi+AKbBUZKY6gyzm1THtWbp2dZbC/Bob@public.gmane.org>
2009-07-17 22:26 ` Nigel Cunningham
2009-07-17 22:26 ` Nigel Cunningham
2009-07-17 22:26 ` Nigel Cunningham
2009-07-17 15:22 ` Matt Helsley
2009-07-17 15:22 ` Matt Helsley
2009-07-17 15:22 ` Matt Helsley
[not found] ` <20090717152235.GA5878-52DBMbEzqgQ/wnmkkaCWp/UQ3DHhIser@public.gmane.org>
2009-07-17 16:47 ` Peter Zijlstra
2009-07-17 16:47 ` Peter Zijlstra
2009-07-17 20:55 ` Nathan Lynch
2009-07-17 20:55 ` Nathan Lynch
2009-07-17 20:55 ` Nathan Lynch
[not found] ` <1247864134.17553.30.camel-bi+AKbBUZKY6gyzm1THtWbp2dZbC/Bob@public.gmane.org>
2009-07-18 12:56 ` Peter Zijlstra [this message]
2009-07-18 12:56 ` Peter Zijlstra
2009-07-18 23:59 ` Nathan Lynch
2009-07-18 23:59 ` Nathan Lynch
2009-07-18 23:59 ` Nathan Lynch
2009-07-18 12:56 ` Peter Zijlstra
2009-07-17 16:47 ` Peter Zijlstra
2009-07-17 12:31 ` Peter Zijlstra
2009-07-17 15:51 ` Matt Helsley
2009-07-17 15:55 ` Peter Zijlstra
2009-07-17 15:55 ` Peter Zijlstra
2009-07-17 16:20 ` Matt Helsley
2009-07-17 16:20 ` Matt Helsley
2009-07-17 16:20 ` Matt Helsley
[not found] ` <20090717155116.GB5878-52DBMbEzqgQ/wnmkkaCWp/UQ3DHhIser@public.gmane.org>
2009-07-17 15:55 ` Peter Zijlstra
2009-07-17 15:51 ` Matt Helsley
2009-07-17 20:54 ` Nathan Lynch
[not found] ` <20090717122103.225652146-hfZtesqFncYOwBW4kG4KsQ@public.gmane.org>
2009-07-17 12:31 ` Peter Zijlstra
2009-07-17 15:51 ` Matt Helsley
2009-07-17 20:54 ` Nathan Lynch
2009-07-17 20:54 ` Nathan Lynch
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