[mlmmj] Any use case for subscribing to multiple versions

[mlmmj] Any use case for subscribing to multiple versions

[Ben Schmidt]

Hi, team,

Is there any use case for being subscribed to multiple versions of the same list? 
I can't think of a useful one.

I'm thinking of changing unsubscribe so it unsubscribes the user for any/all 
versions they are subscribed to, and subscribe so that if you are already 
subscribed to a different version, you 'switch' to the version you request the 
subscription for, in line with this enhancement request:

http://mlmmj.org/bugs/bug.php?id#

Is there any reason not to change this?

Ben.

Re: [mlmmj] Any use case for subscribing to multiple versions

[Ben Schmidt]

On 11/03/11 5:04 AM, Marco S Hyman wrote:
> On Mar 10, 2011, at 3:26 AM, Ben Schmidt wrote:
>
>> Is there any use case for being subscribed to multiple versions of
>> the same list? I can't think of a useful one.
>
> I subscribe to both normal and digest versions of the lists I manage.
> It's the easiest way to see if I'm having digest issues.  The cost is
> a daily hit of the delete key.

I guess this is something only the list owner would ever want. How about
we make this available only from the commandline (via a switch to
mlmmj-sub), but make the standard behaviour that subs unsub you from
other versions of the list?

Ben.

Re: [mlmmj] Any use case for subscribing to multiple versions

[Mark Alan]

On Fri, 11 Mar 2011 09:10:45 +1100, Ben Schmidt
<mail_ben_schmidt@yahoo.com.au> wrote:

> I guess this is something only the list owner would ever want. How
> about we make this available only from the commandline (via a switch
> to mlmmj-sub), but make the standard behaviour that subs unsub you
> from other versions of the list?

+1

JA

Re: [mlmmj] Any use case for subscribing to multiple versions

[Robin H. Johnson]

On Thu, Mar 10, 2011 at 10:26:37PM +1100, Ben Schmidt wrote:
> Is there any use case for being subscribed to multiple versions of the
> same list?  I can't think of a useful one.
Some of my lists, I subscribe to both the digest and the full version,
and select items from the full version to read immediately using
procmail, and otherwise I read the digests.

-- 
Robin Hugh Johnson
Gentoo Linux: Developer, Trustee & Infrastructure Lead
E-Mail     : robbat2@gentoo.org
GnuPG FP   : 11AC BA4F 4778 E3F6 E4ED  F38E B27B 944E 3488 4E85

Re: [mlmmj] Any use case for subscribing to multiple versions

[Ben Schmidt]

>> Is there any use case for being subscribed to multiple versions of the
>> same list?  I can't think of a useful one.
>
> Some of my lists, I subscribe to both the digest and the full version,
> and select items from the full version to read immediately using
> procmail, and otherwise I read the digests.

OK. I guess there's a use case here for regular list subscribers, though
I doubt it's a common one.

Third suggestion!:

How about a single +unsubscribe to get you off the list (any and all
delivery modes/versions), and +subscribe-nomail, +subscribe(-normal),
+subscribe-digest and +subscribe-both (normal and digest), which switch
you to that delivery mode if already subscribed (removing you from other
versions)?

Ben.

Re: [mlmmj] Any use case for subscribing to multiple versions

[Moritz Wilhelmy]

Hi,

On Sun, Mar 13, 2011 at 12:07:53AM +1100, Ben Schmidt wrote:
> Third suggestion!:
> 
> How about a single +unsubscribe to get you off the list (any and all
> delivery modes/versions), and +subscribe-nomail, +subscribe(-normal),
> +subscribe-digest and +subscribe-both (normal and digest), which switch
> you to that delivery mode if already subscribed (removing you from other
> versions)?

This sounds confusing and overcomplicated, to be honest.

Best regards,

Moritz

Re: [mlmmj] Any use case for subscribing to multiple versions

[Mark Alan]

On Sat, 12 Mar 2011 18:23:56 +0100, Moritz Wilhelmy <ml+mmj@wzff.de>
wrote:
> > How about a single +unsubscribe to get you off the list (any and all
> > delivery modes/versions), and +subscribe-nomail,
> > +subscribe(-normal), +subscribe-digest and +subscribe-both (normal
> > and digest), which switch you to that delivery mode if already
> > subscribed (removing you from other versions)?
> 
> This sounds confusing and overcomplicated, to be honest.

At least I would not call it a priority.

Another completely different and really powerful (and
administrator friendly) move would be to have the possibility to
subscribe and unsubscribe users from the email interface,
i.e., any email sent from an address listed in control/submod
(and possibly control/owner) with the following syntax
listname+subscribe-some.user=example.com@domain.tld
would start the chain of events as if it were the email
listname+subscribe@domain.tld sent by the user (envelope)
some.user@example.com

This option, when applied to the usual subscribe, unsubscribe,
subscribe-nomail, subscribe-digest, etc., would greatly reduce the need
to keep logging to the server and go to the command line just to manage
a busy mailing list of not very IT savvy users (and users are most of
the time not very IT savvy).

r.

M.

Re: [mlmmj] Any use case for subscribing to multiple versions

[Ben Schmidt]

Hi, everyone, and sorry for the LONG delays. A bunch of things have
unfortunately got in the way of my Mlmmj work. I can't promise that I'll
make good progress now, but I certainly hope to.

So, following up some loose ends before I do a final implementation
sprint and push out a beta or release candidate.

>> I'm thinking of changing unsubscribe so it unsubscribes the user for
>> any/all versions they are subscribed to, and subscribe so that if you
>> are already subscribed to a different version, you 'switch' to the
>> version you request the subscription for, ...

>>>> Is there any use case for being subscribed to multiple versions of
>>>> the same list? I can't think of a useful one.

>>> I subscribe to both normal and digest versions of the lists I
>>> manage. It's the easiest way to see if I'm having digest issues.
>>> The cost is a daily hit of the delete key.

>> I guess this is something only the list owner would ever want. How
>> about we make this available only from the commandline (via a switch
>> to mlmmj-sub), but make the standard behaviour that subs unsub you
>> from other versions of the list?

> +1

OK. I am going to use this approach.

I may implement the ability to do a subscribe-both via email, but this
will not be documented in the default list texts. The default list texts
will use the model described above.

One question for mail experts and sysadmins out there: Should
'switching' (i.e. changing an existing subscription to a different
version) require moderation or confirmation? I think not. Does anyone
disagree?

Cheers,

Ben.

Re: [mlmmj] Any use case for subscribing to multiple versions

[Ben Schmidt]

On 26/06/11 10:01 PM, Ben Schmidt wrote:
> Hi, everyone, and sorry for the LONG delays. A bunch of things have
> unfortunately got in the way of my Mlmmj work. I can't promise that I'll
> make good progress now, but I certainly hope to.
>
> So, following up some loose ends before I do a final implementation
> sprint and push out a beta or release candidate.
>
>>> I'm thinking of changing unsubscribe so it unsubscribes the user for
>>> any/all versions they are subscribed to, and subscribe so that if you
>>> are already subscribed to a different version, you 'switch' to the
>>> version you request the subscription for, ...
>
>>>>> Is there any use case for being subscribed to multiple versions of
>>>>> the same list? I can't think of a useful one.
>
>>>> I subscribe to both normal and digest versions of the lists I
>>>> manage. It's the easiest way to see if I'm having digest issues.
>>>> The cost is a daily hit of the delete key.
>
>>> I guess this is something only the list owner would ever want. How
>>> about we make this available only from the commandline (via a switch
>>> to mlmmj-sub), but make the standard behaviour that subs unsub you
>>> from other versions of the list?
>
>> +1
>
> OK. I am going to use this approach.
>
> I may implement the ability to do a subscribe-both via email, but this
> will not be documented in the default list texts. The default list texts
> will use the model described above.
>
> One question for mail experts and sysadmins out there: Should
> 'switching' (i.e. changing an existing subscription to a different
> version) require moderation or confirmation? I think not. Does anyone
> disagree?

And a third aspect: notification.

So, when a person switches from one version to another, should it
trigger:

- confirmation
- gatekeeping (subscription moderation)
- notification to the list owner

?

I think no to all three. Any disagreement?

Ben.

Re: [mlmmj] Any use case for subscribing to multiple versions

[Florian Effenberger]

Hi,

2011/6/26 Ben Schmidt <mail_ben_schmidt@yahoo.com.au>:
> Hi, everyone, and sorry for the LONG delays. A bunch of things have
> unfortunately got in the way of my Mlmmj work. I can't promise that I'll
> make good progress now, but I certainly hope to.

hope all is ok - thanks for all your hard work! :-)

>>> I guess this is something only the list owner would ever want. How
>>> about we make this available only from the commandline (via a switch
>>> to mlmmj-sub), but make the standard behaviour that subs unsub you
>>> from other versions of the list?
>
>> +1
>
> OK. I am going to use this approach.

+1 from my side as well, sounds good.

> I may implement the ability to do a subscribe-both via email, but this
> will not be documented in the default list texts. The default list texts
> will use the model described above.

+1, that's the best and less-confusing solution for end users.

> One question for mail experts and sysadmins out there: Should
> 'switching' (i.e. changing an existing subscription to a different
> version) require moderation or confirmation? I think not. Does anyone
> disagree?

I don't think it's needed. Confirmation only is required when the
address is subscribed the first time, but changing the subscription
type, using the same address, doesn't need further confirmation.

Florian

Re: [mlmmj] Any use case for subscribing to multiple versions

[Florian Effenberger]

Hi,

> And a third aspect: notification.
>
> So, when a person switches from one version to another, should it
> trigger:
>
> - confirmation
> - gatekeeping (subscription moderation)
> - notification to the list owner
>
> ?
>
> I think no to all three. Any disagreement?

I share your view - no to all of them.

Florian

Re: [mlmmj] Any use case for subscribing to multiple versions

[Mark Alan]

On Mon, 27 Jun 2011 02:43:08 +1000, Ben Schmidt
<mail_ben_schmidt@yahoo.com.au> wrote:

> - confirmation
> - gatekeeping (subscription moderation)
> - notification to the list owner
> I think no to all three. Any disagreement?

+1 for 'no to all three'.

M.