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From: Oren Laadan <orenl-eQaUEPhvms7ENvBUuze7eA@public.gmane.org>
To: Tejun Heo <tj-DgEjT+Ai2ygdnm+yROfE0A@public.gmane.org>
Cc: Kapil Arya <kapil-1vnkWVZi4QaVc3sceRu5cw@public.gmane.org>,
	Gene Cooperman <gene-1vnkWVZi4QaVc3sceRu5cw@public.gmane.org>,
	linux-kernel-u79uwXL29TY76Z2rM5mHXA@public.gmane.org,
	xemul-3ImXcnM4P+0@public.gmane.org,
	"Eric W. Biederman"
	<ebiederm-aS9lmoZGLiVWk0Htik3J/w@public.gmane.org>,
	Linux Containers
	<containers-qjLDD68F18O7TbgM5vRIOg@public.gmane.org>
Subject: Re: [Ksummit-2010-discuss] checkpoint-restart: naked patch
Date: Sat, 20 Nov 2010 13:08:13 -0500 (EST)	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <4CE69B93.3050904@cs.columbia.edu> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <4CE683E1.6010500-DgEjT+Ai2ygdnm+yROfE0A@public.gmane.org>


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499:takamine[~]$ pine
  PINE 4.64   COMPOSE MESSAGE                                                                     
Folder: Drafts  8 Messages  +

To      : Tejun Heo <tj-DgEjT+Ai2ygdnm+yROfE0A@public.gmane.org>
Cc      : Serge Hallyn <serge.hallyn-Z7WLFzj8eWMS+FvcfC7Uqw@public.gmane.org>,
          Kapil Arya <kapil-1vnkWVZi4QaVc3sceRu5cw@public.gmane.org>,
          Gene Cooperman <gene-1vnkWVZi4QaVc3sceRu5cw@public.gmane.org>,
          linux-kernel-u79uwXL29TY76Z2rM5mHXA@public.gmane.org,
          xemul-3ImXcnM4P+0@public.gmane.org,
          "Eric W. Biederman" <ebiederm-aS9lmoZGLiVWk0Htik3J/w@public.gmane.org>,
          Linux Containers <containers-qjLDD68F18O7TbgM5vRIOg@public.gmane.org>
Attchmnt:
Subject : Re: [Ksummit-2010-discuss] checkpoint-restart: naked patch
----- Message Text -----
Hi,

[continuation of posting regarding kernel vs userspace approach]

part I: perpsectice about the types of scopes of c/r in discussion
part II: linux-cr design adn objectives
part III: comparison kernel/userspace approaches


PART II:  ==PHILOSOPHY==

Linux-cr is a _generic_ c/r-engine with multiple capabilities. It can
checkpoint a full container, a process hierarchy, or a single process,
For containers, it provides guarantees like restart-ability; For the
others, it provides the flexibility so that c/r-aware applications,
libraries, helpers, and wrappers can glue what they wish to glue.

1) Transparent - completely transparent for container-c/r, and largely
  so for standalone-cr ("largely" - as in except for the glue which is
  needed due to loss of eco-system, not due to restarting).
2) Reliable - if checkpoint succeeds that it is guaranteed for
  to succeed too (for container-c/r).
3) Preemtptive - works without requiring that checkpointed processes
  be scheduled to run (and thus "collaborate")
4) Complete - covers all visible and hidden state in the kernel
  about processes (even if not directly visible to userspace)
5) Efficient - can be optimized along multiple axes: _zero_ impact on
  runtime, low downtime during checkpoint, partial and incremental
  checkpoint, live-migration, etc.
6) Flexible - can integrate nicely with different userspace "glueing"
  methods.
7) Maintainable - small part of the code is to refactor kernel code
  so that it can be reused in restart; the rest is new code that in
  our experience rarely changes. Same hods for the image format.

What linux-cr _does not_ do in the kernel, nor plans to support is:

1) Hardware devices: their state is per-device/vendor. Instead one
   should use virtual devices (VNC for dislpay, pulseaudio for sound,
   screen for ttys), or have a userspace glue to restore the state of
   the device. That said, in the future vendors may opt to provide
   logic for c/r in drivers, e.g. ->checkpoint, ->restart methods.
2) Userspace glue: (as defined for standalone-c/r above) the kernel
   knows about processes and their state, not about their intentions.
   We leave that for userspace.
3) External dependencies: (outside of the local host) the kernel does
   not control what's outside the host. That is the responsibility of
   userspace. (Even with live-migration, the linux-cr only restores
   the local state of the TCP connections).

Oren.

WARNING: multiple messages have this Message-ID (diff)
From: Oren Laadan <orenl@cs.columbia.edu>
To: Tejun Heo <tj@kernel.org>
Cc: Serge Hallyn <serge.hallyn@canonical.com>,
	Kapil Arya <kapil@ccs.neu.edu>, Gene Cooperman <gene@ccs.neu.edu>,
	linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org, xemul@sw.ru,
	"Eric W. Biederman" <ebiederm@xmission.com>,
	Linux Containers <containers@lists.osdl.org>
Subject: Re: [Ksummit-2010-discuss] checkpoint-restart: naked patch
Date: Sat, 20 Nov 2010 13:08:13 -0500 (EST)	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <4CE69B93.3050904@cs.columbia.edu> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <4CE683E1.6010500@kernel.org>


login as: orenl
Using keyboard-interactive authentication.
Password:
Access denied
Using keyboard-interactive authentication.
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Last login: Fri Nov 19 10:17:21 2010 from 192.117.42.81.static.012.net.il
499:takamine[~]$ pine
  PINE 4.64   COMPOSE MESSAGE                                                                     
Folder: Drafts  8 Messages  +

To      : Tejun Heo <tj@kernel.org>
Cc      : Serge Hallyn <serge.hallyn@canonical.com>,
          Kapil Arya <kapil@ccs.neu.edu>,
          Gene Cooperman <gene@ccs.neu.edu>,
          linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org,
          xemul@sw.ru,
          "Eric W. Biederman" <ebiederm@xmission.com>,
          Linux Containers <containers@lists.osdl.org>
Attchmnt:
Subject : Re: [Ksummit-2010-discuss] checkpoint-restart: naked patch
----- Message Text -----
Hi,

[continuation of posting regarding kernel vs userspace approach]

part I: perpsectice about the types of scopes of c/r in discussion
part II: linux-cr design adn objectives
part III: comparison kernel/userspace approaches


PART II:  ==PHILOSOPHY==

Linux-cr is a _generic_ c/r-engine with multiple capabilities. It can
checkpoint a full container, a process hierarchy, or a single process,
For containers, it provides guarantees like restart-ability; For the
others, it provides the flexibility so that c/r-aware applications,
libraries, helpers, and wrappers can glue what they wish to glue.

1) Transparent - completely transparent for container-c/r, and largely
  so for standalone-cr ("largely" - as in except for the glue which is
  needed due to loss of eco-system, not due to restarting).
2) Reliable - if checkpoint succeeds that it is guaranteed for
  to succeed too (for container-c/r).
3) Preemtptive - works without requiring that checkpointed processes
  be scheduled to run (and thus "collaborate")
4) Complete - covers all visible and hidden state in the kernel
  about processes (even if not directly visible to userspace)
5) Efficient - can be optimized along multiple axes: _zero_ impact on
  runtime, low downtime during checkpoint, partial and incremental
  checkpoint, live-migration, etc.
6) Flexible - can integrate nicely with different userspace "glueing"
  methods.
7) Maintainable - small part of the code is to refactor kernel code
  so that it can be reused in restart; the rest is new code that in
  our experience rarely changes. Same hods for the image format.

What linux-cr _does not_ do in the kernel, nor plans to support is:

1) Hardware devices: their state is per-device/vendor. Instead one
   should use virtual devices (VNC for dislpay, pulseaudio for sound,
   screen for ttys), or have a userspace glue to restore the state of
   the device. That said, in the future vendors may opt to provide
   logic for c/r in drivers, e.g. ->checkpoint, ->restart methods.
2) Userspace glue: (as defined for standalone-c/r above) the kernel
   knows about processes and their state, not about their intentions.
   We leave that for userspace.
3) External dependencies: (outside of the local host) the kernel does
   not control what's outside the host. That is the responsibility of
   userspace. (Even with live-migration, the linux-cr only restores
   the local state of the TCP connections).

Oren.


  parent reply	other threads:[~2010-11-20 18:08 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 123+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
     [not found] <Pine.LNX.4.64.1011021530470.12128@takamine.ncl.cs.columbia.edu>
2010-11-02 21:35 ` [Ksummit-2010-discuss] checkpoint-restart: naked patch Tejun Heo
2010-11-02 21:47   ` Christoph Hellwig
2010-11-04  1:47     ` Nathan Lynch
2010-11-04  7:36       ` Tejun Heo
2010-11-04 16:04         ` Gene Cooperman
2010-11-04 20:45         ` Nathan Lynch
2010-11-06  6:48           ` Matt Helsley
2010-11-04  4:34     ` Oren Laadan
2010-11-04 14:25       ` Christoph Hellwig
2010-11-04  3:40   ` Kapil Arya
2010-11-04  8:05     ` Tejun Heo
2010-11-04 16:44       ` Gene Cooperman
2010-11-05  9:28         ` Tejun Heo
2010-11-05 23:18           ` Oren Laadan
2010-11-06 10:13             ` Tejun Heo
2010-11-06  0:36           ` Kapil Arya
2010-11-06 22:55             ` Oren Laadan
2010-11-07 19:42               ` Gene Cooperman
2010-11-07 21:30                 ` Oren Laadan
2010-11-07 23:05                   ` Gene Cooperman
2010-11-08  3:55                     ` Oren Laadan
2010-11-08 16:26                       ` Gene Cooperman
2010-11-08 18:14                         ` Oren Laadan
2010-11-08 18:37                           ` Gene Cooperman
2010-11-08 19:34                             ` Oren Laadan
2010-11-08 19:05                         ` Dan Smith
2010-11-17 11:14                           ` Tejun Heo
2010-11-17 15:33                             ` Dan Smith
2010-11-17 15:40                               ` Tejun Heo
2010-11-17 17:04                                 ` Alexey Dobriyan
2010-11-17 10:45             ` Tejun Heo
2010-11-17 12:12               ` Tejun Heo
2010-11-06  5:32           ` Matt Helsley
2010-11-06 15:01             ` Oren Laadan
2010-11-06 20:40             ` Gene Cooperman
2010-11-06 22:41               ` Oren Laadan
2010-11-07 18:49                 ` Gene Cooperman
     [not found]                   ` <20101107184927.GF31077-Rl5vdzG4YPwx/1z6v04GWfZ8FUJU4vz8@public.gmane.org>
2010-11-07 21:59                     ` Oren Laadan
2010-11-07 21:59                       ` Oren Laadan
2010-11-17 11:57                       ` Tejun Heo
2010-11-17 15:39                         ` Serge E. Hallyn
2010-11-17 15:46                           ` Tejun Heo
2010-11-18  9:13                             ` Pavel Emelyanov
     [not found]                               ` <4CE4EE21.6050305-bzQdu9zFT3WakBO8gow8eQ@public.gmane.org>
2010-11-18  9:48                                 ` Tejun Heo
2010-11-18  9:48                                   ` Tejun Heo
2010-11-18 20:13                                   ` Jose R. Santos
2010-11-19  3:54                                   ` Serge Hallyn
2010-11-18 19:53                             ` Oren Laadan
2010-11-19  4:10                             ` Serge Hallyn
2010-11-19 14:04                               ` Tejun Heo
2010-11-20 18:05                                 ` Oren Laadan
     [not found]                                 ` <4CE683E1.6010500-DgEjT+Ai2ygdnm+yROfE0A@public.gmane.org>
2010-11-19 14:36                                   ` Kirill Korotaev
2010-11-19 14:36                                     ` Kirill Korotaev
     [not found]                                     ` <04F4899E-B5C7-4BAF-8F2F-05D507A91408-bzQdu9zFT3WakBO8gow8eQ@public.gmane.org>
2010-11-19 15:33                                       ` Tejun Heo
2010-11-19 15:33                                         ` Tejun Heo
2010-11-19 16:00                                         ` Alexey Dobriyan
2010-11-19 16:01                                           ` Alexey Dobriyan
2010-11-19 16:10                                             ` Tejun Heo
2010-11-19 16:25                                               ` Alexey Dobriyan
2010-11-19 16:06                                           ` Tejun Heo
2010-11-19 16:16                                             ` Alexey Dobriyan
2010-11-19 16:19                                               ` Tejun Heo
2010-11-19 16:27                                                 ` Alexey Dobriyan
     [not found]                                                   ` <AANLkTin7kd3crS+fTLLea5PhAii7B3dz=n7p7YtQ6d4g-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org>
2010-11-19 16:32                                                     ` Tejun Heo
2010-11-19 16:32                                                       ` Tejun Heo
2010-11-19 16:38                                                       ` Alexey Dobriyan
2010-11-19 16:50                                                         ` Tejun Heo
2010-11-19 16:50                                                           ` Tejun Heo
2010-11-19 16:55                                                           ` Alexey Dobriyan
2010-11-20 17:58                                         ` Oren Laadan
2010-11-20 18:08                                   ` Oren Laadan [this message]
2010-11-20 18:08                                     ` Oren Laadan
2010-11-20 18:11                                   ` Oren Laadan
2010-11-20 18:11                                     ` Oren Laadan
     [not found]                                     ` <4CE69B8C.6050606-eQaUEPhvms7ENvBUuze7eA@public.gmane.org>
2010-11-20 18:15                                       ` Oren Laadan
2010-11-20 18:15                                         ` Oren Laadan
2010-11-20 19:33                                         ` Tejun Heo
2010-11-21  8:18                                           ` Gene Cooperman
2010-11-21  8:18                                             ` Gene Cooperman
2010-11-21  8:21                                             ` Gene Cooperman
2010-11-22 18:02                                               ` Sukadev Bhattiprolu
2010-11-23 17:53                                               ` Oren Laadan
2010-11-24  3:50                                                 ` Kapil Arya
2010-11-25 16:04                                                   ` Oren Laadan
2010-11-29  4:09                                                     ` Gene Cooperman
2010-11-21 22:41                                             ` Grant Likely
2010-11-22 17:34                                             ` Oren Laadan
2010-11-22 17:18                                           ` Oren Laadan
2010-11-17 22:17                         ` Matt Helsley
     [not found]                           ` <20101117221713.GA27736-52DBMbEzqgQ/wnmkkaCWp/UQ3DHhIser@public.gmane.org>
2010-11-18 10:06                             ` Tejun Heo
2010-11-18 10:06                               ` Tejun Heo
2010-11-18 20:25                             ` Oren Laadan
2010-11-18 20:25                               ` Oren Laadan
2010-11-07 21:44               ` Oren Laadan
2010-11-07 23:31                 ` Gene Cooperman
2010-11-05 22:24       ` Oren Laadan
2010-11-04  4:03   ` Oren Laadan
2010-11-04  9:43     ` Tejun Heo
2010-11-04 12:48       ` Luck, Tony
2010-11-04 13:06         ` Tejun Heo
2010-11-06 10:12       ` Matt Helsley
2010-11-06 11:03         ` Tejun Heo
2010-11-07 22:59         ` Davide Libenzi
2010-11-08  2:32           ` david
2010-11-18 20:41             ` Oren Laadan
2010-11-05  3:55     ` Kapil Arya
2010-11-05 11:57       ` Luck, Tony
2010-11-05 17:17         ` Gene Cooperman
2010-11-06  1:16           ` Matt Helsley
2010-11-06  4:06             ` Oren Laadan
2010-11-06  5:18               ` Matt Helsley
2010-11-06 21:00           ` Oren Laadan
2010-11-05 17:31       ` Sukadev Bhattiprolu
2010-11-06 21:05       ` Oren Laadan
2010-11-08 16:55 ` Grant Likely
2010-11-08 21:01   ` Nathan Lynch
2010-11-11  6:27   ` Nathan Lynch
2010-11-17  5:29   ` Anton Blanchard
2010-11-17 11:08     ` Tejun Heo
2010-11-18  9:53     ` Alan Cox
2010-11-18 12:27       ` Alexey Dobriyan
2010-11-19  6:33     ` Gene Cooperman
2010-11-21 23:20     ` Grant Likely

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