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From: Glauber Costa <glommer@parallels.com>
To: leonid.moiseichuk@nokia.com
Cc: kirill@shutemov.name, rientjes@google.com,
	anton.vorontsov@linaro.org, penberg@kernel.org, mgorman@suse.de,
	kosaki.motohiro@gmail.com, minchan@kernel.org,
	b.zolnierkie@samsung.com, john.stultz@linaro.org,
	linux-mm@kvack.org, linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org,
	linaro-kernel@lists.linaro.org, patches@linaro.org,
	kernel-team@android.com, linux-man@vger.kernel.org,
	kamezawa.hiroyu@jp.fujitsu.com, mhocko@suse.cz,
	hannes@cmpxchg.org, tj@kernel.org
Subject: Re: [RFC v3 0/3] vmpressure_fd: Linux VM pressure notifications
Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2012 15:54:44 +0400	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <50ACC104.5060006@parallels.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <84FF21A720B0874AA94B46D76DB982690469CC00@008-AM1MPN1-002.mgdnok.nokia.com>

Hi,
>
> Memory notifications are quite irrelevant to partitioning and cgroups. The use-case is related to user-space handling low memory. Meaning the functionality should be accurate with specific granularity (e.g. 1 MB) and time (0.25s is OK) but better to have it as simple and battery-friendly. I prefer to have pseudo-device-based  text API because it is easy to debug and investigate. It would be nice if it will be possible to use simple scripting to point what kind of memory on which levels need to be tracked but private/shared dirty is #1 and memcg cannot handle it.
>
If that is the case, then fine.
The reason I jumped in talking about memcg, is that it was mentioned
that at some point we'd like to have those notifications on a per-group
basis.

So I'll say it again: if this is always global, there is no reason any
cgroup needs to be involved. If this turns out to be per-process, as
Anton suggested in a recent e-mail, I don't see any reason to have
cgroups involved as well.

But if this needs to be extended to be per-cgroup, then past experience
shows that we need to be really careful not to start duplicating
infrastructure, and creating inter-dependencies like it happened to
other groups in the past.

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WARNING: multiple messages have this Message-ID (diff)
From: Glauber Costa <glommer@parallels.com>
To: <leonid.moiseichuk@nokia.com>
Cc: <kirill@shutemov.name>, <rientjes@google.com>,
	<anton.vorontsov@linaro.org>, <penberg@kernel.org>,
	<mgorman@suse.de>, <kosaki.motohiro@gmail.com>,
	<minchan@kernel.org>, <b.zolnierkie@samsung.com>,
	<john.stultz@linaro.org>, <linux-mm@kvack.org>,
	<linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org>, <linaro-kernel@lists.linaro.org>,
	<patches@linaro.org>, <kernel-team@android.com>,
	<linux-man@vger.kernel.org>, <kamezawa.hiroyu@jp.fujitsu.com>,
	<mhocko@suse.cz>, <hannes@cmpxchg.org>, <tj@kernel.org>
Subject: Re: [RFC v3 0/3] vmpressure_fd: Linux VM pressure notifications
Date: Wed, 21 Nov 2012 15:54:44 +0400	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <50ACC104.5060006@parallels.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <84FF21A720B0874AA94B46D76DB982690469CC00@008-AM1MPN1-002.mgdnok.nokia.com>

Hi,
>
> Memory notifications are quite irrelevant to partitioning and cgroups. The use-case is related to user-space handling low memory. Meaning the functionality should be accurate with specific granularity (e.g. 1 MB) and time (0.25s is OK) but better to have it as simple and battery-friendly. I prefer to have pseudo-device-based  text API because it is easy to debug and investigate. It would be nice if it will be possible to use simple scripting to point what kind of memory on which levels need to be tracked but private/shared dirty is #1 and memcg cannot handle it.
>
If that is the case, then fine.
The reason I jumped in talking about memcg, is that it was mentioned
that at some point we'd like to have those notifications on a per-group
basis.

So I'll say it again: if this is always global, there is no reason any
cgroup needs to be involved. If this turns out to be per-process, as
Anton suggested in a recent e-mail, I don't see any reason to have
cgroups involved as well.

But if this needs to be extended to be per-cgroup, then past experience
shows that we need to be really careful not to start duplicating
infrastructure, and creating inter-dependencies like it happened to
other groups in the past.

  reply	other threads:[~2012-11-21 11:54 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 134+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2012-11-07 10:53 [RFC v3 0/3] vmpressure_fd: Linux VM pressure notifications Anton Vorontsov
2012-11-07 10:53 ` Anton Vorontsov
2012-11-07 10:53 ` Anton Vorontsov
2012-11-07 11:01 ` [RFC 1/3] mm: Add " Anton Vorontsov
2012-11-07 11:01   ` Anton Vorontsov
2012-11-08 17:01   ` Mel Gorman
2012-11-08 17:01     ` Mel Gorman
2012-11-08 17:01     ` Mel Gorman
     [not found]     ` <20121108170124.GB8218-l3A5Bk7waGM@public.gmane.org>
2012-11-08 17:14       ` Kirill A. Shutemov
2012-11-08 17:14         ` Kirill A. Shutemov
2012-11-08 17:14         ` Kirill A. Shutemov
2012-11-13 18:38   ` Jonathan Corbet
2012-11-13 18:38     ` Jonathan Corbet
2012-11-07 11:01 ` [RFC 2/3] tools/testing: Add vmpressure-test utility Anton Vorontsov
2012-11-07 11:01   ` Anton Vorontsov
2012-11-07 11:01 ` [RFC 3/3] man-pages: Add man page for vmpressure_fd(2) Anton Vorontsov
2012-11-07 11:01   ` Anton Vorontsov
2012-11-07 11:01   ` Anton Vorontsov
2012-11-07 14:19   ` Rik van Riel
2012-11-07 14:19     ` Rik van Riel
2012-11-20  5:52   ` Andrew Morton
2012-11-20  5:52     ` Andrew Morton
2012-11-20  5:52     ` Andrew Morton
     [not found]     ` <20121119215211.6370ac3b.akpm-de/tnXTf+JLsfHDXvbKv3WD2FQJk+8+b@public.gmane.org>
2012-11-20  6:24       ` Anton Vorontsov
2012-11-20  6:24         ` Anton Vorontsov
2012-11-20  6:24         ` Anton Vorontsov
2012-11-20 18:12         ` David Rientjes
2012-11-20 18:12           ` David Rientjes
2012-11-20 18:12           ` David Rientjes
     [not found]           ` <alpine.DEB.2.00.1211201004390.4200-X6Q0R45D7oAcqpCFd4KODRPsWskHk0ljAL8bYrjMMd8@public.gmane.org>
2012-11-21 15:01             ` Mel Gorman
2012-11-21 15:01               ` Mel Gorman
2012-11-21 15:01               ` Mel Gorman
2012-11-21 19:39               ` Andrew Morton
2012-11-21 19:39                 ` Andrew Morton
2012-11-22  8:52                 ` Pekka Enberg
2012-11-22  8:52                   ` Pekka Enberg
2012-11-07 11:21 ` [RFC v3 0/3] vmpressure_fd: Linux VM pressure notifications Kirill A. Shutemov
2012-11-07 11:21   ` Kirill A. Shutemov
     [not found]   ` <20121107112136.GA31715-oKw7cIdHH8eLwutG50LtGA@public.gmane.org>
2012-11-07 11:28     ` Pekka Enberg
2012-11-07 11:28       ` Pekka Enberg
2012-11-07 11:28       ` Pekka Enberg
     [not found]       ` <CAOJsxLHY+3ZzGuGX=4o1pLfhRqjkKaEMyhX0ejB5nVrDvOWXNA-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org>
2012-11-07 11:43         ` Kirill A. Shutemov
2012-11-07 11:43           ` Kirill A. Shutemov
2012-11-07 11:43           ` Kirill A. Shutemov
     [not found]           ` <20121107114321.GA32265-oKw7cIdHH8eLwutG50LtGA@public.gmane.org>
2012-11-15  3:21             ` David Rientjes
2012-11-15  3:21               ` David Rientjes
2012-11-15  3:21               ` David Rientjes
     [not found]               ` <alpine.DEB.2.00.1211141910050.14414-X6Q0R45D7oAcqpCFd4KODRPsWskHk0ljAL8bYrjMMd8@public.gmane.org>
2012-11-15  3:39                 ` Anton Vorontsov
2012-11-15  3:39                   ` Anton Vorontsov
2012-11-15  3:39                   ` Anton Vorontsov
2012-11-15  3:59                   ` David Rientjes
2012-11-15  3:59                     ` David Rientjes
     [not found]                     ` <alpine.DEB.2.00.1211141946370.14414-X6Q0R45D7oAcqpCFd4KODRPsWskHk0ljAL8bYrjMMd8@public.gmane.org>
2012-11-15  7:34                       ` Anton Vorontsov
2012-11-15  7:34                         ` Anton Vorontsov
2012-11-15  7:34                         ` Anton Vorontsov
     [not found]                         ` <20121115073420.GA19036-SAfYLu58TvsAzdhXFe8piDcLetGT9WKNKwcig+XE9tjR7s880joybQ@public.gmane.org>
2012-11-15  8:11                           ` David Rientjes
2012-11-15  8:11                             ` David Rientjes
2012-11-15  8:11                             ` David Rientjes
2012-11-15  8:52                             ` Anton Vorontsov
2012-11-15  8:52                               ` Anton Vorontsov
2012-11-15 21:25                               ` David Rientjes
2012-11-15 21:25                                 ` David Rientjes
     [not found]                                 ` <alpine.DEB.2.00.1211151303510.27188-X6Q0R45D7oAcqpCFd4KODRPsWskHk0ljAL8bYrjMMd8@public.gmane.org>
2012-11-16  9:33                                   ` Glauber Costa
2012-11-16  9:33                                     ` Glauber Costa
2012-11-16  9:33                                     ` Glauber Costa
     [not found]                                     ` <50A60873.3000607-bzQdu9zFT3WakBO8gow8eQ@public.gmane.org>
2012-11-16 20:04                                       ` David Rientjes
2012-11-16 20:04                                         ` David Rientjes
2012-11-16 20:04                                         ` David Rientjes
2012-11-16 21:12                                         ` Glauber Costa
2012-11-16 21:12                                           ` Glauber Costa
2012-11-16 21:57                                           ` David Rientjes
2012-11-16 21:57                                             ` David Rientjes
2012-11-17  1:21                                             ` Anton Vorontsov
2012-11-17  1:21                                               ` Anton Vorontsov
2012-11-18 22:53                                               ` David Rientjes
2012-11-18 22:53                                                 ` David Rientjes
     [not found]                                               ` <20121117012114.GA22910-SAfYLu58TvubUOgZnPAKMoC2/QZ1MJnMKwcig+XE9tjR7s880joybQ@public.gmane.org>
2012-11-19 14:00                                                 ` Glauber Costa
2012-11-19 14:00                                                   ` Glauber Costa
2012-11-19 14:00                                                   ` Glauber Costa
     [not found]                                             ` <alpine.DEB.2.00.1211161349420.17853-X6Q0R45D7oAcqpCFd4KODRPsWskHk0ljAL8bYrjMMd8@public.gmane.org>
2012-11-19 13:57                                               ` Glauber Costa
2012-11-19 13:57                                                 ` Glauber Costa
2012-11-19 13:57                                                 ` Glauber Costa
2012-11-20 18:02                                                 ` David Rientjes
2012-11-20 18:02                                                   ` David Rientjes
     [not found]                                                   ` <alpine.DEB.2.00.1211200950120.4200-X6Q0R45D7oAcqpCFd4KODRPsWskHk0ljAL8bYrjMMd8@public.gmane.org>
2012-11-21  9:30                                                     ` Kirill A. Shutemov
2012-11-21  9:30                                                       ` Kirill A. Shutemov
2012-11-21  9:30                                                       ` Kirill A. Shutemov
2012-11-21 11:32                                                       ` leonid.moiseichuk
2012-11-21 11:32                                                         ` leonid.moiseichuk
2012-11-21 11:54                                                         ` Glauber Costa [this message]
2012-11-21 11:54                                                           ` Glauber Costa
2012-11-21 13:48                                                           ` leonid.moiseichuk
2012-11-21 13:48                                                             ` leonid.moiseichuk
2012-11-26 21:35                                                   ` Michal Hocko
2012-11-26 21:35                                                     ` Michal Hocko
2012-11-19 14:19                                               ` Glauber Costa
2012-11-19 14:19                                                 ` Glauber Costa
2012-11-19 14:19                                                 ` Glauber Costa
     [not found]                                                 ` <50AA3FEF.2070100-bzQdu9zFT3WakBO8gow8eQ@public.gmane.org>
2012-11-20 18:23                                                   ` David Rientjes
2012-11-20 18:23                                                     ` David Rientjes
2012-11-20 18:23                                                     ` David Rientjes
     [not found]                                                     ` <alpine.DEB.2.00.1211201013460.4200-X6Q0R45D7oAcqpCFd4KODRPsWskHk0ljAL8bYrjMMd8@public.gmane.org>
2012-11-21  8:27                                                       ` Glauber Costa
2012-11-21  8:27                                                         ` Glauber Costa
2012-11-21  8:27                                                         ` Glauber Costa
2012-11-21  8:46                                                         ` Anton Vorontsov
2012-11-21  8:46                                                           ` Anton Vorontsov
2012-11-21  9:25                                                           ` Glauber Costa
2012-11-21  9:25                                                             ` Glauber Costa
2012-11-07 17:20     ` Greg Thelen
2012-11-07 17:20       ` Greg Thelen
2012-11-07 17:20       ` Greg Thelen
     [not found]       ` <xr93liedfhy4.fsf-aSPv4SP+Du0KgorLzL7FmE7CuiCeIGUxQQ4Iyu8u01E@public.gmane.org>
2012-11-07 20:52         ` Pekka Enberg
2012-11-07 20:52           ` Pekka Enberg
2012-11-07 20:52           ` Pekka Enberg
2012-11-07 11:43   ` Anton Vorontsov
2012-11-07 11:43     ` Anton Vorontsov
2012-11-07 12:11     ` Kirill A. Shutemov
2012-11-07 12:11       ` Kirill A. Shutemov
     [not found]       ` <20121107121110.GA32402-oKw7cIdHH8eLwutG50LtGA@public.gmane.org>
2012-11-07 12:28         ` Anton Vorontsov
2012-11-07 12:28           ` Anton Vorontsov
2012-11-07 12:28           ` Anton Vorontsov
2012-11-07 11:30 ` Pekka Enberg
2012-11-07 11:30   ` Pekka Enberg
2012-11-07 11:30   ` Pekka Enberg
     [not found]   ` <CAOJsxLFz+Zi=A0uyuNMj411ngjwpstakNY3fEWy6tW_h4whr7w-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org>
2012-11-07 11:31     ` Pekka Enberg
2012-11-07 11:31       ` Pekka Enberg
2012-11-07 11:31       ` Pekka Enberg
2012-11-07 12:06     ` Anton Vorontsov
2012-11-07 12:06       ` Anton Vorontsov
2012-11-07 12:06       ` Anton Vorontsov
2012-11-09  8:32 ` Luiz Capitulino
2012-11-09  8:32   ` Luiz Capitulino
2012-11-09  9:04   ` Anton Vorontsov
2012-11-09  9:04     ` Anton Vorontsov

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