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From: cov@codeaurora.org (Christopher Covington)
To: linux-arm-kernel@lists.infradead.org
Subject: [RFC] ARM VM System Sepcification
Date: Wed, 26 Feb 2014 18:13:27 -0500	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <530E7517.2010806@codeaurora.org> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <CAL_Jsq+3jBdca9zVnxHG+7pxy2_316emsP=PB3WkTMQP0JYBYQ@mail.gmail.com>

On 02/26/2014 05:49 PM, Rob Herring wrote:
> On Wed, Feb 26, 2014 at 1:55 PM, Arnd Bergmann <arnd@arndb.de> wrote:
>> On Wednesday 26 February 2014 10:34:54 Christoffer Dall wrote:
>>> ARM VM System Specification
>>> ===========================
>>>
>>> Goal
>>> ----
>>> The goal of this spec is to allow suitably-built OS images to run on
>>> all ARM virtualization solutions, such as KVM or Xen.
>>>
>>> Recommendations in this spec are valid for aarch32 and aarch64 alike, and
>>> they aim to be hypervisor agnostic.
>>>
>>> Note that simply adhering to the SBSA [2] is not a valid approach,
>>> for example because the SBSA mandates EL2, which will not be available
>>> for VMs.  Further, the SBSA mandates peripherals like the pl011, which
>>> may be controversial for some ARM VM implementations to support.
>>> This spec also covers the aarch32 execution mode, not covered in the
>>> SBSA.
>>
>> I would prefer if we can stay as close as possible to SBSA for individual
>> hardware components, and only stray from it when there is a strong reason.
>> pl011-subset doesn't sound like a significant problem to implement,
>> especially as SBSA makes the DMA part of that optional. Can you
>> elaborate on what hypervisor would have a problem with that?
> 
> The SBSA only spec's a very minimal pl011 subset which is only
> suitable for early serial output. Not only is there no DMA, but there
> are no interrupts and maybe no input. I think it also assumes the uart
> is enabled and configured already by firmware. It is all somewhat
> pointless because the location is still not known or discoverable by
> early code. Just mandating a real pl011 would have been better, but I
> guess uart IP is value add for some. There is a downside to the pl011
> which is the tty name is different from x86 uarts which gets exposed
> to users and things like libvirt.

Can you just use /dev/console? That's what I use in my init scripts for
portability from PL011 to DCC.

Christopher

-- 
Employee of Qualcomm Innovation Center, Inc.
Qualcomm Innovation Center, Inc. is a member of Code Aurora Forum,
hosted by the Linux Foundation.

WARNING: multiple messages have this Message-ID (diff)
From: Christopher Covington <cov@codeaurora.org>
To: Rob Herring <robherring2@gmail.com>
Cc: Arnd Bergmann <arnd@arndb.de>,
	cross-distro@lists.linaro.org,
	Ian Campbell <ian.campbell@citrix.com>,
	"kvm@vger.kernel.org" <kvm@vger.kernel.org>,
	Rob Herring <rob.herring@linaro.org>,
	Michael Casadevall <Michael.casadevall@linaro.org>,
	"xen-devel@lists.xen.org" <xen-devel@lists.xen.org>,
	Stefano Stabellini <stefano.stabellini@citrix.com>,
	Grant Likely <grant.likely@linaro.org>,
	"kvmarm@lists.cs.columbia.edu" <kvmarm@lists.cs.columbia.edu>,
	"linux-arm-kernel@lists.infradead.org"
	<linux-arm-kernel@lists.infradead.org>
Subject: Re: [RFC] ARM VM System Sepcification
Date: Wed, 26 Feb 2014 18:13:27 -0500	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <530E7517.2010806@codeaurora.org> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <CAL_Jsq+3jBdca9zVnxHG+7pxy2_316emsP=PB3WkTMQP0JYBYQ@mail.gmail.com>

On 02/26/2014 05:49 PM, Rob Herring wrote:
> On Wed, Feb 26, 2014 at 1:55 PM, Arnd Bergmann <arnd@arndb.de> wrote:
>> On Wednesday 26 February 2014 10:34:54 Christoffer Dall wrote:
>>> ARM VM System Specification
>>> ===========================
>>>
>>> Goal
>>> ----
>>> The goal of this spec is to allow suitably-built OS images to run on
>>> all ARM virtualization solutions, such as KVM or Xen.
>>>
>>> Recommendations in this spec are valid for aarch32 and aarch64 alike, and
>>> they aim to be hypervisor agnostic.
>>>
>>> Note that simply adhering to the SBSA [2] is not a valid approach,
>>> for example because the SBSA mandates EL2, which will not be available
>>> for VMs.  Further, the SBSA mandates peripherals like the pl011, which
>>> may be controversial for some ARM VM implementations to support.
>>> This spec also covers the aarch32 execution mode, not covered in the
>>> SBSA.
>>
>> I would prefer if we can stay as close as possible to SBSA for individual
>> hardware components, and only stray from it when there is a strong reason.
>> pl011-subset doesn't sound like a significant problem to implement,
>> especially as SBSA makes the DMA part of that optional. Can you
>> elaborate on what hypervisor would have a problem with that?
> 
> The SBSA only spec's a very minimal pl011 subset which is only
> suitable for early serial output. Not only is there no DMA, but there
> are no interrupts and maybe no input. I think it also assumes the uart
> is enabled and configured already by firmware. It is all somewhat
> pointless because the location is still not known or discoverable by
> early code. Just mandating a real pl011 would have been better, but I
> guess uart IP is value add for some. There is a downside to the pl011
> which is the tty name is different from x86 uarts which gets exposed
> to users and things like libvirt.

Can you just use /dev/console? That's what I use in my init scripts for
portability from PL011 to DCC.

Christopher

-- 
Employee of Qualcomm Innovation Center, Inc.
Qualcomm Innovation Center, Inc. is a member of Code Aurora Forum,
hosted by the Linux Foundation.

  parent reply	other threads:[~2014-02-26 23:13 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 222+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2014-02-26 18:34 [RFC] ARM VM System Sepcification Christoffer Dall
2014-02-26 18:34 ` Christoffer Dall
     [not found] ` < CACxGe6tjuytsYAn6Hadf0AK+REzHgRydgbHPafL8+Sdtd_tMUA@mail.gmail.com>
2014-02-26 19:27 ` Christopher Covington
2014-02-26 19:27 ` Christopher Covington
2014-02-26 19:27   ` Christopher Covington
2014-02-26 19:51   ` Christoffer Dall
2014-02-26 19:51     ` Christoffer Dall
2014-02-27 13:12     ` Christopher Covington
2014-02-27 13:12       ` Christopher Covington
2014-02-27 16:02       ` Christoffer Dall
2014-02-27 16:02         ` Christoffer Dall
2014-02-27 16:02       ` Christoffer Dall
2014-03-01 15:41       ` Grant Likely
2014-03-01 15:41         ` Grant Likely
2014-02-27 13:12     ` Christopher Covington
2014-02-26 19:51   ` Christoffer Dall
2014-02-26 19:55 ` Arnd Bergmann
2014-02-26 19:55   ` Arnd Bergmann
2014-02-26 20:05   ` Christoffer Dall
2014-02-26 20:05     ` Christoffer Dall
2014-02-26 20:22     ` Arnd Bergmann
2014-02-26 20:22       ` Arnd Bergmann
     [not found]       ` < CABGGisxHOVqLcG7hVAuAzdeic41KWSLLBSjQLSJQcjTXLhNCow@mail.gmail.com>
2014-02-26 21:56       ` Rob Herring
2014-02-26 21:56         ` Rob Herring
2014-02-26 22:21         ` Christoffer Dall
2014-02-26 22:21           ` Christoffer Dall
2014-02-27  7:30           ` Arnd Bergmann
2014-02-27  7:30             ` Arnd Bergmann
2014-02-27 10:05             ` Paolo Bonzini
2014-02-27 10:05             ` Paolo Bonzini
2014-02-27 10:05               ` Paolo Bonzini
2014-02-27  7:30           ` Arnd Bergmann
2014-03-01 19:12           ` Grant Likely
2014-03-01 19:12             ` Grant Likely
2014-03-01 19:12           ` Grant Likely
2014-02-26 22:21         ` Christoffer Dall
2014-02-26 21:56       ` Rob Herring
2014-02-26 20:22     ` Arnd Bergmann
2014-02-27  9:35     ` Catalin Marinas
2014-02-27  9:35     ` Catalin Marinas
2014-02-27  9:35       ` Catalin Marinas
2014-02-26 20:05   ` Christoffer Dall
2014-02-26 20:19   ` Paolo Bonzini
2014-02-26 20:19     ` Paolo Bonzini
2014-02-26 20:20     ` Peter Maydell
2014-02-26 20:20     ` Peter Maydell
2014-02-26 20:20       ` Peter Maydell
2014-02-26 20:19   ` Paolo Bonzini
2014-02-26 21:48   ` Leif Lindholm
2014-02-26 21:48   ` Leif Lindholm
2014-02-26 21:48     ` Leif Lindholm
2014-02-26 22:25     ` Christoffer Dall
2014-02-26 22:25       ` Christoffer Dall
2014-03-01 19:20       ` Grant Likely
2014-03-01 19:20       ` Grant Likely
2014-03-01 19:20         ` Grant Likely
2014-02-26 22:25     ` Christoffer Dall
2014-02-27 12:31     ` Stefano Stabellini
2014-02-27 12:31     ` Stefano Stabellini
2014-02-27 12:31       ` Stefano Stabellini
2014-02-27 14:00       ` Arnd Bergmann
2014-02-27 14:00         ` Arnd Bergmann
2014-02-27 14:24         ` Alexander Graf
2014-02-27 14:24         ` Alexander Graf
2014-02-27 14:24           ` Alexander Graf
2014-02-27 19:56           ` Arnd Bergmann
2014-02-27 19:56           ` Arnd Bergmann
2014-02-27 19:56             ` Arnd Bergmann
2014-02-28  0:05             ` Alexander Graf
2014-02-28  0:05               ` Alexander Graf
2014-02-28 10:01               ` Arnd Bergmann
2014-02-28 10:01               ` Arnd Bergmann
2014-02-28 10:01                 ` Arnd Bergmann
2014-02-28 13:38               ` Riku Voipio
     [not found]               ` <CB7DBE07-42BD-4588-AC9E-CB0BF95A811A-l3A5Bk7waGM@public.gmane.org>
2014-02-28 13:38                 ` Riku Voipio
2014-02-28 14:44               ` Stefano Stabellini
2014-02-28 14:44                 ` Stefano Stabellini
2014-02-28 14:44               ` Stefano Stabellini
2014-02-28  0:05             ` Alexander Graf
2014-03-01 19:25         ` Grant Likely
2014-03-01 19:25         ` Grant Likely
2014-03-01 19:25           ` Grant Likely
2014-02-27 14:00       ` Arnd Bergmann
2014-02-26 22:49   ` Rob Herring
2014-02-26 22:49     ` Rob Herring
2014-02-26 22:54     ` Peter Maydell
2014-02-26 22:54     ` Peter Maydell
2014-02-26 22:54       ` Peter Maydell
2014-02-26 23:08       ` Rob Herring
2014-02-26 23:08       ` Rob Herring
2014-02-26 23:08         ` Rob Herring
2014-02-26 23:14         ` Peter Maydell
2014-02-26 23:14         ` Peter Maydell
2014-02-26 23:14           ` Peter Maydell
2014-02-27  4:06           ` Nicolas Pitre
2014-02-27  4:06             ` Nicolas Pitre
2014-02-27  4:06           ` Nicolas Pitre
2014-02-27 11:36         ` Robie Basak
2014-02-27 11:36           ` Robie Basak
2014-02-27 11:36         ` Robie Basak
2014-02-26 23:13     ` Christopher Covington [this message]
2014-02-26 23:13       ` Christopher Covington
2014-02-26 23:13     ` Christopher Covington
2014-02-26 22:49   ` Rob Herring
2014-02-26 19:55 ` Arnd Bergmann
2014-02-26 21:05 ` Michael Hudson-Doyle
2014-02-26 21:05   ` Michael Hudson-Doyle
2014-02-26 21:08   ` Christoffer Dall
2014-02-26 21:08   ` Christoffer Dall
2014-02-26 21:08     ` Christoffer Dall
2014-02-26 21:05 ` Michael Hudson-Doyle
2014-02-26 22:35 ` Grant Likely
2014-02-26 22:35 ` Grant Likely
2014-02-26 22:47   ` Christoffer Dall
2014-02-26 22:47   ` Christoffer Dall
2014-02-26 22:47     ` Christoffer Dall
2014-02-27 12:27   ` Stefano Stabellini
2014-02-27 12:27   ` Stefano Stabellini
2014-02-27 12:27     ` Stefano Stabellini
2014-03-01 19:54     ` Grant Likely
2014-03-01 19:54       ` Grant Likely
2014-03-02  9:29       ` Peter Maydell
2014-03-02  9:29       ` Peter Maydell
2014-03-02  9:29         ` Peter Maydell
2014-03-01 19:54     ` Grant Likely
2014-02-27 12:55   ` Peter Maydell
2014-02-27 12:55     ` Peter Maydell
2014-02-27 12:55   ` Peter Maydell
2014-02-27  0:41 ` Blibbet
2014-02-27  0:41 ` Blibbet
2014-02-27  0:41   ` Blibbet
     [not found] ` <20140226134251.0436294e@anubis.ausil.us>
     [not found]   ` <CAMJs5B9bCs8Oz2Zg4UK--A3H4AaZRPMwy7SpxYom-1--_=qhBQ@mail.gmail.com>
     [not found]     ` <20140226151536.58154704@anubis.ausil.us>
2014-02-27 17:34       ` Grant Likely
2014-02-27 17:34       ` Grant Likely
2014-02-27 17:34         ` Grant Likely
2014-03-01 15:27 ` Grant Likely
2014-03-01 15:27 ` Grant Likely
2014-03-01 15:27   ` Grant Likely
2014-03-03  1:13   ` Christoffer Dall
2014-03-03  1:13     ` Christoffer Dall
2014-03-03  1:13   ` Christoffer Dall
2014-03-06  8:52   ` Robie Basak
2014-03-06  8:52   ` Robie Basak
2014-03-06  8:52     ` Robie Basak
2014-03-06  9:46     ` Paolo Bonzini
2014-03-06  9:46     ` Paolo Bonzini
2014-03-06  9:46       ` Paolo Bonzini
2014-03-06 11:44       ` Laszlo Ersek
2014-03-06 11:44       ` Laszlo Ersek
2014-03-06 11:44         ` Laszlo Ersek
2014-03-06 12:04         ` Robie Basak
2014-03-06 12:04           ` Robie Basak
2014-03-06 12:10           ` Paolo Bonzini
2014-03-06 12:10             ` Paolo Bonzini
2014-03-06 12:10           ` Paolo Bonzini
2014-03-07 12:24           ` Grant Likely
2014-03-07 12:24             ` Grant Likely
     [not found]             ` < 20140322010206.GF25519@cbox>
2014-03-22  2:29             ` Christoffer Dall
2014-03-22  2:29               ` Christoffer Dall
2014-03-22  8:08               ` Paolo Bonzini
2014-03-22  8:08                 ` Paolo Bonzini
2014-03-23  3:19                 ` Christoffer Dall
2014-03-23  3:19                   ` Christoffer Dall
2014-03-23  3:29                   ` Christoffer Dall
2014-03-23  3:29                     ` Christoffer Dall
2014-03-24  9:57                     ` Robie Basak
2014-03-24  9:57                     ` Robie Basak
2014-03-24  9:57                       ` Robie Basak
2014-03-24 10:46                       ` Paolo Bonzini
2014-03-24 10:46                         ` Paolo Bonzini
2014-03-24 10:46                       ` Paolo Bonzini
2014-03-23  3:29                   ` Christoffer Dall
2014-03-23  3:19                 ` Christoffer Dall
2014-03-22  8:08               ` Paolo Bonzini
2014-03-22 12:23               ` Grant Likely
2014-03-22 12:23                 ` Grant Likely
2014-03-22 19:57                 ` Paolo Bonzini
2014-03-22 19:57                 ` Paolo Bonzini
2014-03-22 19:57                   ` Paolo Bonzini
2014-03-22 22:35                   ` Grant Likely
2014-03-22 22:35                     ` Grant Likely
2014-03-22 22:35                   ` Grant Likely
2014-03-22 23:38                   ` Michael Casadevall
2014-03-22 23:38                   ` Michael Casadevall
2014-03-22 23:38                     ` Michael Casadevall
2014-03-23  0:33                     ` Laszlo Ersek
2014-03-23  0:33                     ` Laszlo Ersek
2014-03-23  0:33                       ` Laszlo Ersek
2014-03-23  3:23                 ` Christoffer Dall
2014-03-23  3:23                   ` Christoffer Dall
2014-03-23  3:23                 ` Christoffer Dall
2014-03-24  9:03                 ` Ian Campbell
2014-03-24  9:03                   ` Ian Campbell
2014-03-24 10:41                   ` Paolo Bonzini
2014-03-24 10:41                     ` Paolo Bonzini
2014-03-24 10:47                     ` Ian Campbell
2014-03-24 10:47                       ` Ian Campbell
2014-03-24 10:47                     ` Ian Campbell
2014-03-24 10:41                   ` Paolo Bonzini
2014-03-24 12:13                   ` Grant Likely
2014-03-24 12:13                   ` Grant Likely
2014-03-24 12:13                     ` Grant Likely
2014-03-24 12:16                     ` Ian Campbell
2014-03-24 12:16                       ` Ian Campbell
2014-03-24 12:16                     ` Ian Campbell
2014-03-24  9:03                 ` Ian Campbell
2014-03-22 12:23               ` Grant Likely
2014-03-22  2:29             ` Christoffer Dall
2014-03-07 12:24           ` Grant Likely
2014-03-06 12:04         ` Robie Basak
2014-03-07 12:19       ` Grant Likely
2014-03-07 12:19         ` Grant Likely
2014-03-07 12:19       ` Grant Likely
2014-03-08 11:41       ` Michael Casadevall
2014-03-08 11:41       ` Michael Casadevall
2014-03-08 11:41         ` Michael Casadevall
2014-03-08 20:41         ` Laszlo Ersek
2014-03-08 20:41         ` Laszlo Ersek
2014-03-08 20:41           ` Laszlo Ersek
2014-03-07 12:09     ` Grant Likely
2014-03-07 12:09     ` Grant Likely
2014-03-07 12:09       ` Grant Likely
  -- strict thread matches above, loose matches on Subject: below --
2014-02-26 18:34 Christoffer Dall

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