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From: David Reaver <me@davidreaver.com>
To: Steven Rostedt <rostedt@goodmis.org>
Cc: Greg Kroah-Hartman <gregkh@linuxfoundation.org>,
	 "Rafael J . Wysocki" <rafael@kernel.org>,
	 Danilo Krummrich <dakr@kernel.org>,
	 Christian Brauner <brauner@kernel.org>,
	 Alexander Viro <viro@zeniv.linux.org.uk>,
	linux-fsdevel@vger.kernel.org,  cocci@inria.fr,
	linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org
Subject: Re: [cocci] [RFC PATCH 0/6] debugfs: Replace dentry with an opaque handle in debugfs API
Date: Mon, 10 Feb 2025 09:59:24 -0800	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <867c5x3clf.fsf@davidreaver.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <20250210115313.69299472@gandalf.local.home> (Steven Rostedt's message of "Mon, 10 Feb 2025 11:53:13 -0500")

Steven Rostedt <rostedt@goodmis.org> writes:

>
> No it will not be fine. You should not be using dentry at all. I thought
> this was going to convert debugfs over to kernfs. The debugfs_node should
> be using kernfs and completely eliminate the use of dentry.
>
> <snip>
>
> What caller should ever touch a dentry? What I got from my "conversation"
> with Linus, is that dentry is an internal caching descriptor of the VFS
> layer, and should only be used by the VFS layer. Nothing outside of VFS
> should ever need a dentry.
>
> -- Steve

I agree that just wrapping a dentry shouldn't be the final state for
debugfs_node, but this patch series is _only_ trying to introduce
debugfs_node as an opaque wrapper/handle.

It isn't clear to me that there is consensus on even using kernfs for
debugfs. Even if there was consensus, a full conversion to kernfs would
take 10x as much code and be extremely difficult to automate. For
example, using kernfs would require migrating all of the debugfs users'
file_operations to use the kernfs equivalent.

I figure any change away from persistent dentry handles for debugfs
requires introducing something akin to debugfs_node, so we could get
that out of the way first.

Thanks,
David Reaver

WARNING: multiple messages have this Message-ID (diff)
From: David Reaver <me@davidreaver.com>
To: Steven Rostedt <rostedt@goodmis.org>
Cc: Greg Kroah-Hartman <gregkh@linuxfoundation.org>,
	 "Rafael J . Wysocki" <rafael@kernel.org>,
	 Danilo Krummrich <dakr@kernel.org>,
	 Christian Brauner <brauner@kernel.org>,
	 Alexander Viro <viro@zeniv.linux.org.uk>,
	linux-fsdevel@vger.kernel.org,  cocci@inria.fr,
	linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org
Subject: Re: [RFC PATCH 0/6] debugfs: Replace dentry with an opaque handle in debugfs API
Date: Mon, 10 Feb 2025 09:59:24 -0800	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <867c5x3clf.fsf@davidreaver.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <20250210115313.69299472@gandalf.local.home> (Steven Rostedt's message of "Mon, 10 Feb 2025 11:53:13 -0500")

Steven Rostedt <rostedt@goodmis.org> writes:

>
> No it will not be fine. You should not be using dentry at all. I thought
> this was going to convert debugfs over to kernfs. The debugfs_node should
> be using kernfs and completely eliminate the use of dentry.
>
> <snip>
>
> What caller should ever touch a dentry? What I got from my "conversation"
> with Linus, is that dentry is an internal caching descriptor of the VFS
> layer, and should only be used by the VFS layer. Nothing outside of VFS
> should ever need a dentry.
>
> -- Steve

I agree that just wrapping a dentry shouldn't be the final state for
debugfs_node, but this patch series is _only_ trying to introduce
debugfs_node as an opaque wrapper/handle.

It isn't clear to me that there is consensus on even using kernfs for
debugfs. Even if there was consensus, a full conversion to kernfs would
take 10x as much code and be extremely difficult to automate. For
example, using kernfs would require migrating all of the debugfs users'
file_operations to use the kernfs equivalent.

I figure any change away from persistent dentry handles for debugfs
requires introducing something akin to debugfs_node, so we could get
that out of the way first.

Thanks,
David Reaver

  parent reply	other threads:[~2025-02-10 17:59 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 38+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2025-02-10  5:20 [cocci] [RFC PATCH 0/6] debugfs: Replace dentry with an opaque handle in debugfs API David Reaver
2025-02-10  5:20 ` David Reaver
2025-02-10  5:20 ` [cocci] [RFC PATCH 1/6] debugfs: Add temporary "#define debugfs_node dentry" directives David Reaver
2025-02-10  5:20   ` David Reaver
2025-02-10  5:20 ` [cocci] [RFC PATCH 2/6] debugfs: Add helper functions for debugfs_node encapsulation David Reaver
2025-02-10  5:20   ` David Reaver
2025-02-10  5:20 ` [cocci] [RFC PATCH 3/6] relay: Replace dentry with debugfs_node David Reaver
2025-02-10  5:20   ` David Reaver
2025-02-10  5:20 ` [cocci] [RFC PATCH 4/6] debugfs: Automated conversion from dentry to debugfs_node David Reaver
2025-02-10  5:20   ` David Reaver
2025-02-10  5:20 ` [cocci] [RFC PATCH 5/6] debugfs: Manual fixes for incomplete Coccinelle conversions David Reaver
2025-02-10  5:20   ` David Reaver
2025-02-10 16:45   ` [cocci] " Steven Rostedt
2025-02-10 16:45     ` Steven Rostedt
2025-02-10 17:53     ` [cocci] " David Reaver
2025-02-10 17:53       ` David Reaver
2025-02-10  5:20 ` [cocci] [RFC PATCH 6/6] debugfs: Replace debugfs_node #define with struct wrapping dentry David Reaver
2025-02-10  5:20   ` David Reaver
2025-02-10  5:58   ` [cocci] " Al Viro
2025-02-10  5:58     ` Al Viro
2025-02-10 15:33   ` kernel test robot
2025-02-10 15:44   ` kernel test robot
2025-02-10  5:53 ` [cocci] [RFC PATCH 0/6] debugfs: Replace dentry with an opaque handle in debugfs API Al Viro
2025-02-10  5:53   ` Al Viro
2025-02-10  7:08 ` [cocci] " Greg Kroah-Hartman
2025-02-10  7:08   ` Greg Kroah-Hartman
2025-02-10 16:08   ` [cocci] " David Reaver
2025-02-10 16:08     ` David Reaver
2025-02-10 16:53     ` [cocci] " Steven Rostedt
2025-02-10 16:53       ` Steven Rostedt
2025-02-10 17:00       ` [cocci] " Al Viro
2025-02-10 17:00         ` Al Viro
2025-02-10 17:12         ` [cocci] " Steven Rostedt
2025-02-10 17:12           ` Steven Rostedt
2025-02-10 17:25           ` [cocci] " Steven Rostedt
2025-02-10 17:25             ` Steven Rostedt
2025-02-10 17:59       ` David Reaver [this message]
2025-02-10 17:59         ` David Reaver

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