Re: firewall blocks ppp0?

Re: firewall blocks ppp0?

[Chuck Gelm]

[-- Attachment #1: Type: text/plain, Size: 1978 bytes --]

How/why did your message arrive as

From:    Haines Brown <brownh@hartford-hwp.com>  Sat 6:55 PM
Subject: firewall blocks ppp0?
     To: linux-newbie@hartford-hwp.com
                     ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
                      ???????????????

This does not allow a 'reply all'    :-(

Dear Haines Brown:

 I use Roaring Penguin PPPOE. http://www.roaringpenguin.com/pppoe/
I selected permanent connection, but I am unsure if this applies
to eth# or ppp#. :-|  'adsl-setup' and 'adsl-start' are script
names with my application (Roaring Penguin).  I am assuming that
your using the same or similar.

 How do you know "I definitely have eth0 set to be permanently
 up" ?  Actually, I'm betting that it is ppp# that is set to
 demand or permanent.

 It seems that your dsl connection (PPPOE?) application is
setting up IPCHAINS, but your kernel is using IPTABLES.

You can:

- reconfigure (make config) your kernel to use IPCHAINS.

- configure IPTABLES to replace your dsl-connection application's
  attempt to use IPCHAINS.

HTH, Chuck

Haines Brown wrote:
> 
> I'm setting up a copy of RedHat 8.0 on a machine that is intended as a
> standalone machine with DSL access to Internet.
> 
> I have eth0 up and running, and did the adsl-setup with my usual valid
> information. The problem comes trying to make ppp0 active. It tries,
> but cycles between active and inactive.
> 
> When I run adsl-start with debugging, it tells me that I'm set up for
> demand-connection. I definitely have eth0 set to be permanently
> up. Does this alert refer instead to ppp0? If so, perhaps this is what
> I'd expect. Is that right?
> 
> I'm also told: ipchains: Protocol not available
> 
> That sounds to me as if my firewall (which I set to be "high"
> protection), may be blocking the ppp protocol. Does this seem to be
> the case?
> 
> I went to pursue this, and ran ipchains -L, but got the error message
> that this command is incompabible with my kernel.
> 
> What to do?
> 
> Haines Brown

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From: Chuck Gelm <nc8q@gelm.net>
To: Haines Brown <brownh@hartford-hwp.com>
Cc: linux-newbie@hartford-hwp.com
Subject: Re: firewall blocks ppp0?
Date: Sun, 24 Nov 2002 11:48:58 -0500
Message-ID: <3DE102FA.85D8F85D@gelm.net>

Dear Haines Brown:

 I use Roaring Penguin PPPOE. http://www.roaringpenguin.com/pppoe/
I selected permanent connection, but I am unsure if this applies
to eth# or ppp#. :-|  'adsl-setup' and 'adsl-start' are script
names with my application (Roaring Penguin).  I am assuming that
your using the same or similar.

 How do you know "I definitely have eth0 set to be permanently
 up" ?  Actually, I'm betting that it is ppp# that is set to
 demand or permanent.

 It seems that your dsl connection (PPPOE?) application is
setting up IPCHAINS, but your kernel is using IPTABLES.

You can:

- reconfigure (make config) your kernel to use IPCHAINS.

- configure IPTABLES to replace your dsl-connection application's
  attempt to use IPCHAINS.

HTH, Chuck

Haines Brown wrote:
> 
> I'm setting up a copy of RedHat 8.0 on a machine that is intended as a
> standalone machine with DSL access to Internet.
> 
> I have eth0 up and running, and did the adsl-setup with my usual valid
> information. The problem comes trying to make ppp0 active. It tries,
> but cycles between active and inactive.
> 
> When I run adsl-start with debugging, it tells me that I'm set up for
> demand-connection. I definitely have eth0 set to be permanently
> up. Does this alert refer instead to ppp0? If so, perhaps this is what
> I'd expect. Is that right?
> 
> I'm also told: ipchains: Protocol not available
> 
> That sounds to me as if my firewall (which I set to be "high"
> protection), may be blocking the ppp protocol. Does this seem to be
> the case?
> 
> I went to pursue this, and ran ipchains -L, but got the error message
> that this command is incompabible with my kernel.
> 
> What to do?
> 
> Haines Brown
> -
> To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-newbie" in
> the body of a message to majordomo@vger.kernel.org
> More majordomo info at  http://vger.kernel.org/majordomo-info.html
> Please read the FAQ at http://www.linux-learn.org/faqs

Re: firewall blocks ppp0?

[Haines Brown]

> Date: 	Sun, 24 Nov 2002 12:02:57 -0500
> From: Chuck Gelm <nc8q@gelm.net>
> X-Accept-Language: en
> Sender: linux-newbie-owner@vger.kernel.org
> X-Mailing-List: 	linux-newbie@vger.kernel.org
> 
> This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
> --------------3637FA4FE80086AB2A08BE64
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
> 
> How/why did your message arrive as
> 
> From:    Haines Brown <brownh@hartford-hwp.com>  Sat 6:55 PM
> Subject: firewall blocks ppp0?
>      To: linux-newbie@hartford-hwp.com
>                      ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>                       ???????????????
> 
> This does not allow a 'reply all'    :-(

Wow! Never noticed that before. I'm having a terrible time with users
being unable to start X, and thought an identity conflict might be the
cause. However, when I run # hostname, I'm whom I think I am 

But sentmail is here doing something strange. I"ve no idea what could
cause this.

Haines
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firewall blocks ppp0?

[Haines Brown]

I'm setting up a copy of RedHat 8.0 on a machine that is intended as a
standalone machine with DSL access to Internet.

I have eth0 up and running, and did the adsl-setup with my usual valid
information. The problem comes trying to make ppp0 active. It tries,
but cycles between active and inactive.

When I run adsl-start with debugging, it tells me that I'm set up for
demand-connection. I definitely have eth0 set to be permanently
up. Does this alert refer instead to ppp0? If so, perhaps this is what
I'd expect. Is that right?

I'm also told: ipchains: Protocol not available

That sounds to me as if my firewall (which I set to be "high"
protection), may be blocking the ppp protocol. Does this seem to be
the case?

I went to pursue this, and ran ipchains -L, but got the error message
that this command is incompabible with my kernel.

What to do?

Haines Brown
-
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Re: firewall blocks ppp0?

[Haines Brown]

Chuck,

>  I use Roaring Penguin PPPOE. http://www.roaringpenguin.com/pppoe/ I
> selected permanent connection, but I am unsure if this applies to
> eth# or ppp#. :-| 'adsl-setup' and 'adsl-start' are script names
> with my application (Roaring Penguin).  I am assuming that your
> using the same or similar.
> 
>  How do you know "I definitely have eth0 set to be permanently up" ?
>  Actually, I'm betting that it is ppp# that is set to demand or
>  permanent.

Yes, I also use the roaring penguin, My eth0 is made active during
boot, for I can run ifconfig and see that it is up as soon as I've
finished booting. The ppp0, on the other hand, is not up until
adsl-start is run. That is, ppp0 is on demand, while eth0 is
permanent. That's my impression, anyway. pppd is a daemon which I
assume is meant normally to be on demand.

Actually, when I run redhat-configuration-network, I see not only
eth0, but also ppp0 (trying to be active). That's not right. ppp0
should not appear (or at least it does not show up under RH7.3 as I
speak to you). I may have some kind of problem in that pppd is trying
to start ppp, rather than my starting pppoe by means of adsl-start

>  It seems that your dsl connection (PPPOE?) application is setting
> up IPCHAINS, but your kernel is using IPTABLES.

That may be, but then a good percentage of folks who get RedHat 8.0
must reconfigure and recompile their kernel, which I doubt.

> - configure IPTABLES to replace your dsl-connection application's
> attempt to use IPCHAINS.

This was my inclination, for I gather IPTables are better. I've got a
copy of Bastille, which should make my life a lot easier, not only
spotting the source of any difficulty, but setting up a secure set of
rules.

Haines
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Re: firewall blocks ppp0?

[Ray Olszewski]

Haines -- My attempt to reply to your initial message bounced due to the 
error in your To: line that someone else already pointed out (but that I 
didn't notice when replying, only when I found the bounce this morning) -- 
you really need to fix this.

As I read both this and your earlier posting, you have three independent 
configuration issues, namely --

1. ppp0  "cycles between active and inactive". If you are using RP-PPPoE in 
"on demand" mode, this may be normal. The interface gets dropped (either by 
your end or by the ISP) when there is no traffic, and it gets restored (by 
your end) when there is new traffic. If more is going on here, you will 
need to describe the problem in more detail to get help. (BTW, while pppd 
is a daemon, it can be configured in different ways -- "on demand" is one, 
and "permanent", that is, restore the connection whenever it goes down due 
to action from the other end, is another. When I had the misfortune to use 
a PPPoE connection a couple of years back, my router, using a prepackaged 
LEAF image that ran RP-PPPoE, was set for "permanent", and it worked nicely 
here with SBC's DSL service.)

2. "ipchains -L" does not work ("got the error message that this command is 
incompabible with my kernel."). Odd, since you also report that in a 
different context, the ipchains commands returns an error message ("I'm 
also told: ipchains: Protocol not available"), and ipchains has to run to 
be able to return this message.  The inconsistency here is the first thing 
to address. Please run (as root) "ipchains -nvL" and if you get an error 
message, quote the EXACT, COMPLETE message, and the EXACT command you 
enter, in your followup to us. Also identify your kernel ("uname -a" will 
serve). And finally, tell us the context in which some ipchains command IS 
running.

3. You think your firewall might be interfering with the ppp protocol. The 
way you state it, this is unlikely, since with ipchains-based firewalls, 
"protocol" refers only to layer 4 (transport layer - TCP, UDP, ICMP, 
mainly), not  layer 2 (link layer - Ethernet, ppp). The ipchains error 
message you quote is almost surely just an error in a -A or -I command 
(specifically, its -p argument) to ipchains. But to be sure, please provide 
context -- where are you "told" this (in a log file? in the dmesg buffer? 
on a console?) and what precedes and follows it there?

But your firewall and your PPPoE connection may be interfering with each 
other in a different way. If ppp0 stops and restarts, its IP address 
probably changes. Most firewalls (especially ones set to "high" protection, 
as you say yours is) block all external-interface traffic not to your 
external IP address. If your external (ppp0) IP address changes, the 
ipchains rulesets have to be cleared and restored to reflect the new IP 
address. RP-PPPoE has a way to do this, but whether it works with your 
firewall package ... well, who can guess? What firewall package are you 
using? Did you provide for RP-PPPoE to restart the firewall whenever it 
comes up?

One last thought ... what does it mean when you say "My eth0 is made active 
during boot, for I can run ifconfig and see that it is up as soon as I've 
finished booting"? The term "active" has no specific meaning, but if you 
can see the interface with "ifconfig" (rather than with "ifconfig -a"), 
that implies that it has a IP address assigned to it. In my (admittedly 
limited) experience, an eth* interface being used for PPPoE does NOT get an 
IP address assigned to it; at the network layer, your external connection 
is over ppp0, not eth0. If you are assigning an IP address to this 
interface, that might be part of your problem. Hard to say without more 
information, such as the complete output of "ifconfig -a" and "netstat -nr" 
(one way to display your routing table).

At 01:01 PM 11/24/02 -0500, Haines Brown wrote:
>Chuck,
>
> >  I use Roaring Penguin PPPOE. http://www.roaringpenguin.com/pppoe/ I
> > selected permanent connection, but I am unsure if this applies to
> > eth# or ppp#. :-| 'adsl-setup' and 'adsl-start' are script names
> > with my application (Roaring Penguin).  I am assuming that your
> > using the same or similar.
> >
> >  How do you know "I definitely have eth0 set to be permanently up" ?
> >  Actually, I'm betting that it is ppp# that is set to demand or
> >  permanent.
>
>Yes, I also use the roaring penguin, My eth0 is made active during
>boot, for I can run ifconfig and see that it is up as soon as I've
>finished booting. The ppp0, on the other hand, is not up until
>adsl-start is run. That is, ppp0 is on demand, while eth0 is
>permanent. That's my impression, anyway. pppd is a daemon which I
>assume is meant normally to be on demand.
>
>Actually, when I run redhat-configuration-network, I see not only
>eth0, but also ppp0 (trying to be active). That's not right. ppp0
>should not appear (or at least it does not show up under RH7.3 as I
>speak to you). I may have some kind of problem in that pppd is trying
>to start ppp, rather than my starting pppoe by means of adsl-start
>
> >  It seems that your dsl connection (PPPOE?) application is setting
> > up IPCHAINS, but your kernel is using IPTABLES.
>
>That may be, but then a good percentage of folks who get RedHat 8.0
>must reconfigure and recompile their kernel, which I doubt.
>
> > - configure IPTABLES to replace your dsl-connection application's
> > attempt to use IPCHAINS.
>
>This was my inclination, for I gather IPTables are better. I've got a
>copy of Bastille, which should make my life a lot easier, not only
>spotting the source of any difficulty, but setting up a secure set of
>rules.




--
-------------------------------------------"Never tell me the odds!"--------
Ray Olszewski					-- Han Solo
Palo Alto, California, USA			  ray@comarre.com
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

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Re: firewall blocks ppp0?

[Haines Brown]

Ray,

I've cleaned up some difficulties due to my floundering about (a
strangely gummed up configuration), and while the situyation seems a
bit simpler now, it still remains obscure to me. One exemple of my
confusion is that if I run adsl-status when adsl is down, it tells me
it can't find /etc/ppp/pppoe.conf, but that file no longer holds pppoe
configuration information under RH 8.0.

The simplest way to describe the present situation is to provide a bit
of the debug log:

> ...
> sent [LCP EchoRep id=0x0 magic=0xb81d9109]
> rcvd [IPCP ConfReq id=0x6c <addr 64.252.160.1>]
> sent [IPCP ConfAck id=0x6c <addr 64.252.160.1>]
> rcvd [IPCP ConfNak id=0x1 <addr 64.252.164.224>]
> sent [IPCP ConfReq id=0x2 <addr 64.252.164.224>]
> rcvd [IPCP ConfAck id=0x2 <addr 64.252.164.224>]
> local  IP address 64.252.164.224
> remote IP address 64.252.160.1
> Script /etc/ppp/ip-up started (pid 4916)
> rcvd [LCP EchoReq id=0x0 magic=0x3ddca2a6]
> sent [LCP EchoRep id=0x0 magic=0xb81d9109]
> Script /etc/ppp/ip-up finished (pid 4916), status = 0x0
> Script /usr/sbin/pppoe 
>       -p 
>	-I eth0 
>	-T 20 
>	-U  
>	-m 1412    
>	-D 0-0 
>	finished (pid 4906), status = 0x1
> Modem hangup
> Script /etc/ppp/ip-down started (pid 4950)
> Connection terminated.
> Connect time 0.4 minutes.
> Sent 30 bytes, received 58 bytes.
> Waiting for 1 child processes...
> script /etc/ppp/ip-down, pid 4950
> Script /etc/ppp/ip-down finished (pid 4950), status = 0x0

What this looks like to me is that I've actually shook hands with my
DSL provider and gotten back an IP address. The script ip-up seems to
have done its job succecssfully (exit code 0). Then the command pppoe
-p is issued to write the pppoe process ID to the file
/var/run/pppoe-adsl.pid.pppoe.

It finishes with status 0x1. I know about exit code 0 or 1, but have
no idea what 0x1 implies. Did the process complete satisfactorily or
not?  In any case, I get a hangup at that point. Apparently timing out
after a series of: "ipchains: Protocol not available" statements.

I don't understand why a successful connection results in a
hangup. The -T timeout option of 20 seconds seems about the time it takes for
my connection to die. I gather that timeout can cause trouble if
there's no traffic. The solution is to use lcp-echo-internal option
for pppd. The pppoe timeout should be about four times the LCP echo
interval. Any idea where one implements the LCP echo option?

The -m clamp value of 1412 for TCP max segment size is appropriate for
a LAN behind a gateway. Since I'm not in that situation, the option
could be omitted, I guess.

The -D option specifies the file in which to dump debug informaitno. I
gather this really slows down the process, and so wonder if it might
be causeing a timeout.

Is it possible that the dump slows things down too much, and the
Protocol not available statements just is the result of waiting for
pppoe to got going?

What I'm running now on my old system is 
  ...
  PPPOE_TIMEOUT=20
  LCP_FAILURE=3
  LCP_INTERVAL=20
  CLAMPMSS=1412
  CONNECT_POLL=6
  CONNECT_TIMEOUT=60

I don't think I have the new system configured much differently.

I'm profoundly ignorant about all these things, but something is
triggering a shutdown.

>   As I read both this and your earlier posting, you have three
>   independent configuration issues, namely --
>
>   1. ppp0 "cycles between active and inactive". If you are using
>   RP-PPPoE in "on demand" mode, this may be normal.

Yes. I set up pppoe to be run when I ask it to run, and I've concluded
the irregularity may be normal as the connection is established.

>   2. "ipchains -L" does not work ("got the error message that this
>   command is incompabible with my kernel."). Odd,

Yes, but my getting rid of a flakey configuration seems to have
stopped that behavior.

>   But your firewall and your PPPoE connection may be interfering
>   with each other in a different way. If ppp0 stops and restarts,
>   its IP address probably changes. Most firewalls (especially ones
>   set to "high" protection, as you say yours is) block all
>   external-interface traffic not to your external IP address. If
>   your external (ppp0) IP address changes, the ipchains rulesets
>   have to be cleared and restored to reflect the new IP
>   address. RP-PPPoE has a way to do this, but whether it works with
>   your firewall package ... well, who can guess? What firewall
>   package are you using? Did you provide for RP-PPPoE to restart the
>   firewall whenever it comes up?

I can't give good answers here. The firewall package is that which
shipped with RH8.0. While I've since run Bastille, I didn't use it to
mess with IPchains. But what you say may again point to timing as
pppoe tries to readjust to a new ipaddress. As for your last question,
the only configuration parameter in roaring penguin pppoe utility is
to state that I've a stand alone machine. Did you have something else
in mind here?

   One last thought ... what does it mean when you say "My eth0 is
   made active during boot, for I can run ifconfig and see that it is
   up as soon as I've finished booting"? The term "active" has no
   specific meaning,

I originally had diven my machine an IP address (something like
168.192.0.1) because I've had my mahcine on a LAN, but now am just
happy to get it to work as a stand-along workstation. When eth0 had an
address, ifconfig recported it; when I made a DSL connection, the
number changed to whatever my provider provides. I subsequently tried
to cut the IP address, and I believe (not sure) that now ifconfig
shows the eth0 as up, but with noi address until pppoe is started..


Haines Brown
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Re: firewall blocks ppp0?

[Ray Olszewski]

OK. Just as a reminder ... I don't run Red Hat here, and I don't currently 
run PPPoE on my Debian-based router. So I can't help with specifics at the 
level of what config file the RH-8.0 version or RP-PPPoE uses.

Having said that, I think you yourself have spotted the problem. A severely 
edited version of your report, below, focuses on it.

At 03:57 PM 11/25/02 -0500, Haines Brown wrote:
[...]
> > Script /usr/sbin/pppoe
> >       -p
> >       -I eth0
> >       -T 20
> >       -U
> >       -m 1412
> >       -D 0-0
> >       finished (pid 4906), status = 0x1

The problem you have here is with the -T setting. It tells pppoe to exit if 
there is no link-layer (ppp) traffic for 20 seconds.  As you go on to 
comment ...

>I don't understand why a successful connection results in a
>hangup. The -T timeout option of 20 seconds seems about the time it takes for
>my connection to die. I gather that timeout can cause trouble if
>there's no traffic. The solution is to use lcp-echo-internal option
>for pppd. The pppoe timeout should be about four times the LCP echo
>interval. Any idea where one implements the LCP echo option?

This is a pppd option ("lcp-echo-interval", not "lcp-echo-internal", BTW). 
Put it wherever the RH-8.0 implementation of pppd stores its settings (on 
my Debian system, this would be in /etc/ppp/options, but YMMV ... check 
*your* version of the pppd man page for this info).
[...]


--
-------------------------------------------"Never tell me the odds!"--------
Ray Olszewski					-- Han Solo
Palo Alto, California, USA			  ray@comarre.com
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

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Re: firewall blocks ppp0?

[Chuck Gelm]

Haines Brown wrote:
<big snip> 
 
> I originally had diven my machine an IP address (something like
> 168.192.0.1) because I've had my mahcine on a LAN, but now am just
> happy to get it to work as a stand-along workstation. When eth0 had an
> address, ifconfig recported it; when I made a DSL connection, the
> number changed to whatever my provider provides. I subsequently tried
> to cut the IP address, and I believe (not sure) that now ifconfig
> shows the eth0 as up, but with noi address until pppoe is started.

 eth0 never gets an IP address in my situation.
 Are you 'forcing' an IP address on via 'ip-up' or something?
 RP-PPPOE assigns an IP address to ppp0, not eth0.

 After 'normal' install of rp-pppoe-3.5  ;-) 
 Run:     I put adsl-start in my /etc/rd.d/rc.local script.
 I edited no files (other than rc.local) to get RP-PPPOE to work.
:-|
 This how it works for me.  Perhaps your is different. But....
Again I mention that the eth# device that attaches to the DSL modem
does not have an IP address.  Ala:

This is my LAN NIC:
eth0 Link encap:Ethernet  HWaddr 00:20:AF:10:63:D3  
     inet addr:192.168.0.1  Bcast:192.168.0.255  Mask:255.255.255.0
     UP BROADCAST RUNNING MULTICAST  MTU:1500  Metric:1
     RX packets:10581519 errors:14 dropped:0 overruns:14 frame:14
     TX packets:11506381 errors:0 dropped:0 overruns:0 carrier:0
     collisions:1837 txqueuelen:100 
     RX bytes:2017650304 (1924.1 Mb)  TX bytes:3952593210 (3769.4 Mb)
     Interrupt:5 Base address:0x300 

This is my DSL NIC:
eth1 Link encap:Ethernet  HWaddr 00:20:AF:19:F4:58  
     UP BROADCAST RUNNING MULTICAST  MTU:1500  Metric:1
     RX packets:2260684 errors:4 dropped:0 overruns:4 frame:4
     TX packets:1435674 errors:0 dropped:0 overruns:0 carrier:3
     collisions:8 txqueuelen:100 
     RX bytes:3069518901 (2927.3 Mb)  TX bytes:115487500 (110.1 Mb)
     Interrupt:10 Base address:0x200 

It is my ppp# device that gets an IP address from my DSL-ISP provider:
ppp0 Link encap:Point-to-Point Protocol  
     inet addr:123.456.789.210  P-t-P:123.456.789.1 
Mask:255.255.255.255
     UP POINTOPOINT RUNNING NOARP MULTICAST  MTU:1492  Metric:1
     RX packets:2253580 errors:0 dropped:0 overruns:0 frame:0
     TX packets:1429007 errors:0 dropped:0 overruns:0 carrier:0
     collisions:0 txqueuelen:10 
     RX bytes:3465872234 (3305.3 Mb)  TX bytes:118613004 (113.1 Mb)

HTH, Chuck

> Haines Brown
> -
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