All of lore.kernel.org
 help / color / mirror / Atom feed
From: Dave Hansen <dave@linux.vnet.ibm.com>
To: KAMEZAWA Hiroyuki <kamezawa.hiroyu@jp.fujitsu.com>
Cc: "Rafael J. Wysocki" <rjw@sisk.pl>,
	Yasunori Goto <y-goto@jp.fujitsu.com>,
	Nigel Cunningham <ncunningham@crca.org.au>,
	Matt Tolentino <matthew.e.tolentino@intel.com>,
	linux-pm@lists.osdl.org, Dave Hansen <haveblue@us.ibm.com>,
	linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org, linux-mm@kvack.org, pavel@suse.cz,
	Mel Gorman <mel@skynet.ie>, Andy Whitcroft <apw@shadowen.org>,
	Andrew Morton <akpm@linux-foundation.org>
Subject: Re: [linux-pm] [PATCH] hibernation should work ok with memory hotplug
Date: Wed, 05 Nov 2008 16:28:01 -0800	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <1225931281.11514.27.camel@nimitz> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <20081106091441.6517c072.kamezawa.hiroyu@jp.fujitsu.com>

On Thu, 2008-11-06 at 09:14 +0900, KAMEZAWA Hiroyuki wrote:
> Ok, please consider "when memory hotplug happens." 
> 
> In general, it happens when
>   1. memory is inserted to slot.
>   2. the firmware notifes the system to enable already inserted memory.
> 
> To trigger "1", you have to open cover of server/pc. Do you open pc while the system
> starts hibernation ? for usual people, no.

You're right, this won't happen very often.  We're trying to close a
theoretical hole that hasn't ever been observed in practice.  But, we
don't exactly leave races in code just because we haven't observed them.
I think this is a classic race.

If we don't close it now, then someone doing some really weirdo hotplug
is going to run into it at some point.  Who knows what tomorrow's
hardware/firmware will do?

> To trigger "2", the user have special console to tell firmware "enable this memory".
> Such firmware console or users have to know "the system works well." And, more important,
> when the system is suspended, the firmware can't do hotplug because the kernel is sleeping.
> So, such firmware console or operator have to know the system status.
> 
> Am I missing some ? Current linux can know PCI/USB hotplug while the
> system is suspended ?

* echo 'disk' > /sys/power/state
* count number of pages to write to disk
* turn all interrupts off
* copy pages to disk
* power down

I think the race we're trying to close is the one between when we count
pages and when we turn interrupts off.  I assume that there is a reason
that we don't do the *entire* hibernation process with interrupts off,
probably because it would "lock" the system up for too long, and can
even possibly fail.

-- Dave

--
To unsubscribe, send a message with 'unsubscribe linux-mm' in
the body to majordomo@kvack.org.  For more info on Linux MM,
see: http://www.linux-mm.org/ .
Don't email: <a href=mailto:"dont@kvack.org"> email@kvack.org </a>

WARNING: multiple messages have this Message-ID (diff)
From: Dave Hansen <dave@linux.vnet.ibm.com>
To: KAMEZAWA Hiroyuki <kamezawa.hiroyu@jp.fujitsu.com>
Cc: "Rafael J. Wysocki" <rjw@sisk.pl>,
	Yasunori Goto <y-goto@jp.fujitsu.com>,
	Nigel Cunningham <ncunningham@crca.org.au>,
	Matt Tolentino <matthew.e.tolentino@intel.com>,
	linux-pm@lists.osdl.org, Dave Hansen <haveblue@us.ibm.com>,
	linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org, linux-mm@kvack.org, pavel@suse.cz,
	Mel Gorman <mel@skynet.ie>, Andy Whitcroft <apw@shadowen.org>,
	Andrew Morton <akpm@linux-foundation.org>
Subject: Re: [linux-pm] [PATCH] hibernation should work ok with memory hotplug
Date: Wed, 05 Nov 2008 16:28:01 -0800	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <1225931281.11514.27.camel@nimitz> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <20081106091441.6517c072.kamezawa.hiroyu@jp.fujitsu.com>

On Thu, 2008-11-06 at 09:14 +0900, KAMEZAWA Hiroyuki wrote:
> Ok, please consider "when memory hotplug happens." 
> 
> In general, it happens when
>   1. memory is inserted to slot.
>   2. the firmware notifes the system to enable already inserted memory.
> 
> To trigger "1", you have to open cover of server/pc. Do you open pc while the system
> starts hibernation ? for usual people, no.

You're right, this won't happen very often.  We're trying to close a
theoretical hole that hasn't ever been observed in practice.  But, we
don't exactly leave races in code just because we haven't observed them.
I think this is a classic race.

If we don't close it now, then someone doing some really weirdo hotplug
is going to run into it at some point.  Who knows what tomorrow's
hardware/firmware will do?

> To trigger "2", the user have special console to tell firmware "enable this memory".
> Such firmware console or users have to know "the system works well." And, more important,
> when the system is suspended, the firmware can't do hotplug because the kernel is sleeping.
> So, such firmware console or operator have to know the system status.
> 
> Am I missing some ? Current linux can know PCI/USB hotplug while the
> system is suspended ?

* echo 'disk' > /sys/power/state
* count number of pages to write to disk
* turn all interrupts off
* copy pages to disk
* power down

I think the race we're trying to close is the one between when we count
pages and when we turn interrupts off.  I assume that there is a reason
that we don't do the *entire* hibernation process with interrupts off,
probably because it would "lock" the system up for too long, and can
even possibly fail.

-- Dave


  reply	other threads:[~2008-11-06  0:28 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 105+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2008-10-29 10:59 [PATCH] hibernation should work ok with memory hotplug Pavel Machek
2008-10-29 12:25 ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2008-11-03 20:51   ` Andrew Morton
2008-11-03 20:51     ` Andrew Morton
2008-11-03 21:18     ` [linux-pm] " Nigel Cunningham
2008-11-03 21:18       ` Nigel Cunningham
2008-11-03 21:21     ` Dave Hansen
2008-11-03 22:24       ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2008-11-03 22:24         ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2008-11-03 22:34         ` Dave Hansen
2008-11-03 22:34           ` Dave Hansen
2008-11-03 23:05           ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2008-11-03 23:05             ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2008-11-03 23:10             ` Dave Hansen
2008-11-03 23:10               ` Dave Hansen
2008-11-04  0:29               ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2008-11-04  0:29                 ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2008-11-04  0:52                 ` Dave Hansen
2008-11-04  0:52                   ` Dave Hansen
2008-11-03 23:39           ` Andy Whitcroft
2008-11-03 23:39             ` Andy Whitcroft
2008-11-04  4:02           ` [linux-pm] " Nigel Cunningham
2008-11-04  4:02             ` Nigel Cunningham
2008-11-04  7:08             ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2008-11-04  7:08               ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2008-11-04  7:36               ` Dave Hansen
2008-11-04  7:36                 ` Dave Hansen
2008-11-04  8:54                 ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2008-11-04  8:54                   ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2008-11-04 15:21                   ` Dave Hansen
2008-11-04 15:21                     ` Dave Hansen
2008-11-04 15:35                     ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2008-11-04 15:35                       ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2008-11-04 15:39                       ` Dave Hansen
2008-11-04 15:39                         ` Dave Hansen
2008-11-04 16:34                         ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2008-11-04 16:34                           ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2008-11-04 16:59                           ` Dave Hansen
2008-11-05  0:38                             ` KAMEZAWA Hiroyuki
2008-11-05  0:38                               ` KAMEZAWA Hiroyuki
2008-11-05 11:08                               ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2008-11-05 11:08                                 ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2008-11-06  0:14                                 ` KAMEZAWA Hiroyuki
2008-11-06  0:14                                   ` KAMEZAWA Hiroyuki
2008-11-06  0:28                                   ` Dave Hansen [this message]
2008-11-06  0:28                                     ` Dave Hansen
2008-11-06  0:53                                     ` KAMEZAWA Hiroyuki
2008-11-06  0:53                                       ` KAMEZAWA Hiroyuki
2008-11-06  2:03                                       ` Nigel Cunningham
2008-11-06  2:03                                         ` Nigel Cunningham
2008-11-06  2:13                                         ` KAMEZAWA Hiroyuki
2008-11-06  2:13                                           ` KAMEZAWA Hiroyuki
2008-11-06 14:47                                       ` Alan Stern
2008-11-06 14:47                                         ` Alan Stern
2008-11-07  1:09                                         ` KAMEZAWA Hiroyuki
2008-11-07  1:09                                           ` KAMEZAWA Hiroyuki
2008-11-07  1:09                                           ` KAMEZAWA Hiroyuki
2008-11-06  8:47                                     ` Pavel Machek
2008-11-06  8:47                                       ` Pavel Machek
2008-11-06  1:17                                   ` KAMEZAWA Hiroyuki
2008-11-06  1:17                                     ` KAMEZAWA Hiroyuki
2008-11-06  1:43                                     ` Nigel Cunningham
2008-11-06  1:43                                       ` Nigel Cunningham
2008-11-06  1:54                                       ` KAMEZAWA Hiroyuki
2008-11-06  1:54                                         ` KAMEZAWA Hiroyuki
2008-11-06  1:59                                         ` KAMEZAWA Hiroyuki
2008-11-06  1:59                                           ` KAMEZAWA Hiroyuki
2008-11-06  2:00                                         ` Nigel Cunningham
2008-11-06  2:00                                           ` Nigel Cunningham
2008-11-06  2:07                                           ` KAMEZAWA Hiroyuki
2008-11-06  2:07                                             ` KAMEZAWA Hiroyuki
2008-11-06  3:12                                             ` KAMEZAWA Hiroyuki
2008-11-06  3:12                                               ` KAMEZAWA Hiroyuki
2008-11-06  3:28                                               ` Yasunori Goto
2008-11-06  3:28                                                 ` Yasunori Goto
2008-11-06  6:04                                                 ` KAMEZAWA Hiroyuki
2008-11-06  6:04                                                   ` KAMEZAWA Hiroyuki
2008-11-06 14:48                                           ` Alan Stern
2008-11-06 14:48                                             ` Alan Stern
2008-11-06 14:48                                             ` Alan Stern
2008-11-06 20:46                                             ` Nigel Cunningham
2008-11-06 20:46                                               ` Nigel Cunningham
2008-11-06  9:12                                     ` Pavel Machek
2008-11-06  9:12                                       ` Pavel Machek
2008-11-06  9:12                                       ` KAMEZAWA Hiroyuki
2008-11-06  9:12                                         ` KAMEZAWA Hiroyuki
2008-11-06  9:26                                         ` Nigel Cunningham
2008-11-06  9:26                                           ` Nigel Cunningham
2008-11-06 14:43                                   ` Alan Stern
2008-11-06 14:43                                     ` Alan Stern
2008-11-06 14:43                                     ` Alan Stern
2008-11-04  7:09             ` Dave Hansen
2008-11-04  7:09               ` Dave Hansen
2008-11-04  7:30               ` Nigel Cunningham
2008-11-04  7:30                 ` Nigel Cunningham
2008-11-04  7:53                 ` Dave Hansen
2008-11-04  7:53                   ` Dave Hansen
2008-11-05  9:10                   ` Nigel Cunningham
2008-11-05  9:10                     ` Nigel Cunningham
2008-11-05 10:58                     ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2008-11-05 10:58                       ` Rafael J. Wysocki
2008-11-05 16:23                     ` Dave Hansen
2008-11-05 16:23                       ` Dave Hansen
2008-11-06 12:28     ` Pavel Machek
2008-11-06 12:28       ` Pavel Machek

Reply instructions:

You may reply publicly to this message via plain-text email
using any one of the following methods:

* Save the following mbox file, import it into your mail client,
  and reply-to-all from there: mbox

  Avoid top-posting and favor interleaved quoting:
  https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Posting_style#Interleaved_style

* Reply using the --to, --cc, and --in-reply-to
  switches of git-send-email(1):

  git send-email \
    --in-reply-to=1225931281.11514.27.camel@nimitz \
    --to=dave@linux.vnet.ibm.com \
    --cc=akpm@linux-foundation.org \
    --cc=apw@shadowen.org \
    --cc=haveblue@us.ibm.com \
    --cc=kamezawa.hiroyu@jp.fujitsu.com \
    --cc=linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org \
    --cc=linux-mm@kvack.org \
    --cc=linux-pm@lists.osdl.org \
    --cc=matthew.e.tolentino@intel.com \
    --cc=mel@skynet.ie \
    --cc=ncunningham@crca.org.au \
    --cc=pavel@suse.cz \
    --cc=rjw@sisk.pl \
    --cc=y-goto@jp.fujitsu.com \
    /path/to/YOUR_REPLY

  https://kernel.org/pub/software/scm/git/docs/git-send-email.html

* If your mail client supports setting the In-Reply-To header
  via mailto: links, try the mailto: link
Be sure your reply has a Subject: header at the top and a blank line before the message body.
This is an external index of several public inboxes,
see mirroring instructions on how to clone and mirror
all data and code used by this external index.