Re: questions for alsa-devel

Re: questions for alsa-devel

[Takashi Iwai]

Hi Paul,

At Wed, 2 Oct 2002 07:57:57 -0400,
Paul Davis wrote:
> 
> takashi - i can't post to alsa-devel at the moment (my ISP and sf.net
> have messed up their configuration somehow).

oh it's bad...

> i tried sending these via
> jaroslav, but i got no reply whatsoever and they never showed up on
> the list.
 
i guess he is quite busy now to prepare the latest patches for 2.5
kernel.


> 1) do you know why support for the SiS 7012 chip has been commented
>    out of the intel8x0 module? everything else in ALSA suggests
>    that its supported, except this:
> 
> static struct pci_device_id snd_intel8x0_joystick_ids[] __devinitdata = {
> 	{ 0x8086, 0x2410, PCI_ANY_ID, PCI_ANY_ID, 0, 0, 0 },	/* 82801AA */
> 	{ 0x8086, 0x2420, PCI_ANY_ID, PCI_ANY_ID, 0, 0, 0 },	/* 82901AB */
> 	{ 0x8086, 0x2440, PCI_ANY_ID, PCI_ANY_ID, 0, 0, 0 }, /* ICH2 */
> 	{ 0x8086, 0x244c, PCI_ANY_ID, PCI_ANY_ID, 0, 0, 0 }, /* ICH2M */
> 	{ 0x8086, 0x248c, PCI_ANY_ID, PCI_ANY_ID, 0, 0, 0 },	/* ICH3 */
> 	// { 0x8086, 0x7195, PCI_ANY_ID, PCI_ANY_ID, 0, 0, 0 },	/* 440MX */
> 	// { 0x1039, 0x7012, PCI_ANY_ID, PCI_ANY_ID, 0, 0, 0 },	/* SI7012 */
> 	{ 0x10de, 0x01b2, PCI_ANY_ID, PCI_ANY_ID, 0, 0, 0 },	/* NFORCE */
> 	{ 0, }
> };

si7012 is still supported.  the array above is the list for joystick
supports :)  the pcm should work:

static struct pci_device_id snd_intel8x0_ids[] __devinitdata = {
	...
	{ 0x1039, 0x7012, PCI_ANY_ID, PCI_ANY_ID, 0, 0, DEVICE_SIS },	/* SI7012 */
	...
};


> 2) i recently compiled rc3 on a mandrake 8.2 system. everything went
> smoothly. when i went to modprobe, i got messages suggesting to me
> that there a mismatch between the kernels and the ALSA modules with
> respect to symbol versioning. (several missing symbols, all with
> versions). i've looked through the archives and tried google, but i
> can't see how to fix this or if something else is going on.

most likely the driver was built with the incompatible kernel tree.
please check whether you installed the correct kernel-source package
and configure points the right directory (you can pass the directory
via --with-kernel option).

or, it could be a problem of rc3.  i've never compiled with module
version.  could you show which symbols are missing?

also, please note that on some distribution such like SuSE, you need
to overwrite certain kernel header files to match with the running
kernel.  for example, in the case of SuSE, /boot/vmlinuz.autoconf.h
and /boot/vmlinuz.version.h must be renamed and copied to
/usr/src/linux/include/linux, if you use an SMP kernel.

i'm not sure how about on mandrake, so cc'ed to Thierry.


ciao,

Takashi


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Re: questions for alsa-devel

[Thierry Vignaud]

Takashi Iwai <tiwai@suse.de> writes:

> > 2) i recently compiled rc3 on a mandrake 8.2 system. everything
> > went smoothly. when i went to modprobe, i got messages suggesting
> > to me that there a mismatch between the kernels and the ALSA
> > modules with respect to symbol versioning. (several missing
> > symbols, all with versions). i've looked through the archives and
> > tried google, but i can't see how to fix this or if something else
> > is going on.

1) "make mrproper" should be the first step when recompiling a kernel
   from the kernel-source package since it has previously be used to
   compile our various kernel (up, smp, enterprise [smp+highmem],
   secure, linus (no patches), BOOT [for drakx installer]).

   most people don't do it and have problems.

2) alter the extraversion in main Makefile so that you don't screw up
   the mandrake kernel if you make something wrong (there's a rescue
   on the first cd but just avoid troubles)
   eg: in mdk9.0, we now alter it by default ("EXTRAVERSION = -16mdk"
   became "EXTRAVERSION = -16mdkcustom")

these 2 items should prevent versionning problems regarding modules

3) you can then steal the mdk kernel config from /boot/config (link on
   /boot/config-2.4.....)

4) note that if you boot with a kernel with alsa-0.9.0, all your alsa
   apps won't work unless you use them in oss emulation mode.

   it may be a lot simpler to update to mdk9.0, either by urpmi or by
   running drakx from cds or the net (just cat images/network.img on a
   floppy)

> most likely the driver was built with the incompatible kernel tree.
> please check whether you installed the correct kernel-source package
> and configure points the right directory (you can pass the directory
> via --with-kernel option).

alsa default to /usr/src/linux which should be a link to
linux-2.4.8...

it might just be simpler to steal juan patch that put alsa in sound
directory (look at linux-2.4.19-qX tarball and the mdk9.0 srpm spec
file)

but then, it's even simpler to recompile the srpm or just install the
binary rpm from mdk9.0 ...

> or, it could be a problem of rc3.  i've never compiled with module
> version.  could you show which symbols are missing?

hum, mdk9.0 is compiled with module versionning and we've no problems
(i mean there're bugs but not such problems)



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Re: questions for alsa-devel

[Takashi Iwai]

Hi,

At Wed, 02 Oct 2002 15:17:10 +0200,
Thierry Vignaud wrote:
> 
> Takashi Iwai <tiwai@suse.de> writes:
> 
> > > 2) i recently compiled rc3 on a mandrake 8.2 system. everything
> > > went smoothly. when i went to modprobe, i got messages suggesting
> > > to me that there a mismatch between the kernels and the ALSA
> > > modules with respect to symbol versioning. (several missing
> > > symbols, all with versions). i've looked through the archives and
> > > tried google, but i can't see how to fix this or if something else
> > > is going on.
> 
> 1) "make mrproper" should be the first step when recompiling a kernel
>    from the kernel-source package since it has previously be used to
>    compile our various kernel (up, smp, enterprise [smp+highmem],
>    secure, linus (no patches), BOOT [for drakx installer]).
> 
>    most people don't do it and have problems.
> 
> 2) alter the extraversion in main Makefile so that you don't screw up
>    the mandrake kernel if you make something wrong (there's a rescue
>    on the first cd but just avoid troubles)
>    eg: in mdk9.0, we now alter it by default ("EXTRAVERSION = -16mdk"
>    became "EXTRAVERSION = -16mdkcustom")
> 
> these 2 items should prevent versionning problems regarding modules
> 
> 3) you can then steal the mdk kernel config from /boot/config (link on
>    /boot/config-2.4.....)
 
it would be nice to collect such info for each distribution and put
them on alsa's web page.


> 4) note that if you boot with a kernel with alsa-0.9.0, all your alsa
>    apps won't work unless you use them in oss emulation mode.
 
why?  is there any incompatibility?


Takashi


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Re: questions for alsa-devel

[Thierry Vignaud]

Takashi Iwai <tiwai@suse.de> writes:

> > 4) note that if you boot with a kernel with alsa-0.9.0, all your
> >    alsa apps won't work unless you use them in oss emulation mode.
>  
> why?  is there any incompatibility?

i presume you joke ?
remember the incompatible apis of alsa-0.5.x and alsa-0.9.x ? :-)



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Re: questions for alsa-devel

[Takashi Iwai]

At Wed, 02 Oct 2002 15:37:35 +0200,
Thierry Vignaud wrote:
> 
> Takashi Iwai <tiwai@suse.de> writes:
> 
> > > 4) note that if you boot with a kernel with alsa-0.9.0, all your
> > >    alsa apps won't work unless you use them in oss emulation mode.
> >  
> > why?  is there any incompatibility?
> 
> i presume you joke ?
> remember the incompatible apis of alsa-0.5.x and alsa-0.9.x ? :-)

oh, i didn't think of apps with 0.5.x...
understood.  my silly question.


Takashi


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Re: Re: questions for alsa-devel

[Patrick Shirkey]

Takashi Iwai wrote:
> Hi,
> 
> At Wed, 02 Oct 2002 15:17:10 +0200,
> Thierry Vignaud wrote:
> 
>>Takashi Iwai <tiwai@suse.de> writes:
>>
>>
>>>>2) i recently compiled rc3 on a mandrake 8.2 system. everything
>>>>went smoothly. when i went to modprobe, i got messages suggesting
>>>>to me that there a mismatch between the kernels and the ALSA
>>>>modules with respect to symbol versioning. (several missing
>>>>symbols, all with versions). i've looked through the archives and
>>>>tried google, but i can't see how to fix this or if something else
>>>>is going on.
>>>
>>1) "make mrproper" should be the first step when recompiling a kernel
>>   from the kernel-source package since it has previously be used to
>>   compile our various kernel (up, smp, enterprise [smp+highmem],
>>   secure, linus (no patches), BOOT [for drakx installer]).
>>
>>   most people don't do it and have problems.
>>
>>2) alter the extraversion in main Makefile so that you don't screw up
>>   the mandrake kernel if you make something wrong (there's a rescue
>>   on the first cd but just avoid troubles)
>>   eg: in mdk9.0, we now alter it by default ("EXTRAVERSION = -16mdk"
>>   became "EXTRAVERSION = -16mdkcustom")
>>
>>these 2 items should prevent versionning problems regarding modules
>>
>>3) you can then steal the mdk kernel config from /boot/config (link on
>>   /boot/config-2.4.....)
> 
>  
> it would be nice to collect such info for each distribution and put
> them on alsa's web page.
> 

I will write it up if people send me the info that needs to be included. 
Like this thread.

What should the page be called though?

> 
> 
>>4) note that if you boot with a kernel with alsa-0.9.0, all your alsa
>>   apps won't work unless you use them in oss emulation mode.
> 
>  
> why?  is there any incompatibility?
> 
> 
> Takashi
> 
> 
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> 


-- 
Patrick Shirkey - Boost Hardware Ltd.
For the discerning hardware connoisseur
Http://www.boosthardware.com
Http://www.djcj.org - The Linux Audio Users guide
========================================

"Um...symbol_get and symbol_put... They're
kindof like does anyone remember like get_symbol
and put_symbol I think we used to have..."
- Rusty Russell in his talk on the module subsystem



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Re: Re: questions for alsa-devel

[James Courtier-Dutton]

Thierry Vignaud wrote:

>Takashi Iwai <tiwai@suse.de> writes:
>
>  
>
>>>4) note that if you boot with a kernel with alsa-0.9.0, all your
>>>   alsa apps won't work unless you use them in oss emulation mode.
>>>      
>>>
>> 
>>why?  is there any incompatibility?
>>    
>>
>
>i presume you joke ?
>remember the incompatible apis of alsa-0.5.x and alsa-0.9.x ? :-)
>
>  
>
You are assuming that people still use alsa-0.5.x in applications.
For example, xine (xine.sf.net) dropped support for alsa-0.5.x ages ago, 
it only supports alsa-0.9.x.
It also supports lots of other audio drivers, eg. oss, esd, arts etc.
Are there still applications out there that only support alsa-0.5.x and 
not alsa-0.9.x.
alsa-0.9.x is so much easier to program an application for than 
alsa-0.5.x ever was.

Cheers
James





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Re: Re: questions for alsa-devel

[James Tappin]

On Thu, 03 Oct 2002 11:51:35 +1000
James Courtier-Dutton <James@superbug.demon.co.uk> wrote:

J
JCD> You are assuming that people still use alsa-0.5.x in applications.
JCD> For example, xine (xine.sf.net) dropped support for alsa-0.5.x ages
JCD> ago, it only supports alsa-0.9.x.
JCD> It also supports lots of other audio drivers, eg. oss, esd, arts
JCD> etc. Are there still applications out there that only support
JCD> alsa-0.5.x and not alsa-0.9.x.

The MIDI stuff in KDE springs to mind, unless they've gotten their act
together in the 3.1 betas.

James

-- 
+------------------------+-------------------------------+---------+
| James Tappin           | School of Physics & Astronomy |  O__    |
| sjt@star.sr.bham.ac.uk | University of Birmingham      | --  \/` |
| Ph: 0121-414-6462. Fax: 0121-414-3722                  |         |
+--------------------------------------------------------+---------+


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Re: Re: questions for alsa-devel

[Thierry Vignaud]

James Courtier-Dutton <James@superbug.demon.co.uk> writes:

> You are assuming that people still use alsa-0.5.x in applications.
> For example, xine (xine.sf.net) dropped support for alsa-0.5.x ages
> ago, it only supports alsa-0.9.x.
> It also supports lots of other audio drivers, eg. oss, esd, arts etc.
> Are there still applications out there that only support alsa-0.5.x
> and not alsa-0.9.x.
> alsa-0.9.x is so much easier to program an application for than
> alsa-0.5.x ever was.

we're talking about booting with an alsa-0.9.0 kernel on a distro
builded 8 monthes ago with libalsa-0.5.x ...



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