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From: David Howells <dhowells@redhat.com>
To: Josef Sipek <jsipek@fsl.cs.sunysb.edu>
Cc: sds@tycho.nsa.gov, jmorris@namei.org, chrisw@sous-sol.org,
	selinux@tycho.nsa.gov, linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org,
	aviro@redhat.com
Subject: Re: Security issues with local filesystem caching
Date: Thu, 26 Oct 2006 10:56:08 +0100	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <7864.1161856568@redhat.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <20061025202155.GB3854@filer.fsl.cs.sunysb.edu>

Josef Sipek <jsipek@fsl.cs.sunysb.edu> wrote:

> Hrm. How do you do DAC checks if you don't copy over the permissions without
> alteration?

You have to remember there are two filesystem layers involved.  NFS or other
netfs does the DAC, MAC, whatever checks to see whether the user can access a
file.  NFS then asks the cache to back the netfs file and the cache creates a
file in the local filesystem to do that.

The cache file doesn't need the DAC/MAC/whatever attributes applied to the
netfs file, and, in fact, may not be able to support what the netfs deals
with.

> I'm wondering, why don't just you duplicate all the attributes of the files
> (including xattrs)? That would take care of most if not all the DAC/MAC
> issues, no?

You're forgetting that the userspace cache manager daemon still has to access
the cache.

> >  (1) Do all the cache operations in their own thread (sort of like knfsd).
>  
> In our case it works well, however we have only very specific times when we
> need to use the work queue, so the performance hit doesn't hurt us as much
> as it would hurt you - I'm assuming you'd be using the thread for a sizable
> portion of calls you get.

I'm not sure exactly.  Actually, I could probably deal with read/write ops
inline - though I don't have a file struct to carry a security context - but
getting and releasing inodes would certainly wind up being farmed off.
Consider the automounter releasing an NFS share that's been heavily used...

> I'm thinking that it would be nice to combine the caching related security
> code with those for stackable filesystems.

That's fine by me, though I want the security on a cache file to be different
to that on the netfs file it's backing.

David

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WARNING: multiple messages have this Message-ID (diff)
From: David Howells <dhowells@redhat.com>
To: Josef Sipek <jsipek@fsl.cs.sunysb.edu>
Cc: sds@tycho.nsa.gov, jmorris@namei.org, chrisw@sous-sol.org,
	selinux@tycho.nsa.gov, linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org,
	aviro@redhat.com
Subject: Re: Security issues with local filesystem caching
Date: Thu, 26 Oct 2006 10:56:08 +0100	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <7864.1161856568@redhat.com> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <20061025202155.GB3854@filer.fsl.cs.sunysb.edu>

Josef Sipek <jsipek@fsl.cs.sunysb.edu> wrote:

> Hrm. How do you do DAC checks if you don't copy over the permissions without
> alteration?

You have to remember there are two filesystem layers involved.  NFS or other
netfs does the DAC, MAC, whatever checks to see whether the user can access a
file.  NFS then asks the cache to back the netfs file and the cache creates a
file in the local filesystem to do that.

The cache file doesn't need the DAC/MAC/whatever attributes applied to the
netfs file, and, in fact, may not be able to support what the netfs deals
with.

> I'm wondering, why don't just you duplicate all the attributes of the files
> (including xattrs)? That would take care of most if not all the DAC/MAC
> issues, no?

You're forgetting that the userspace cache manager daemon still has to access
the cache.

> >  (1) Do all the cache operations in their own thread (sort of like knfsd).
>  
> In our case it works well, however we have only very specific times when we
> need to use the work queue, so the performance hit doesn't hurt us as much
> as it would hurt you - I'm assuming you'd be using the thread for a sizable
> portion of calls you get.

I'm not sure exactly.  Actually, I could probably deal with read/write ops
inline - though I don't have a file struct to carry a security context - but
getting and releasing inodes would certainly wind up being farmed off.
Consider the automounter releasing an NFS share that's been heavily used...

> I'm thinking that it would be nice to combine the caching related security
> code with those for stackable filesystems.

That's fine by me, though I want the security on a cache file to be different
to that on the netfs file it's backing.

David

  parent reply	other threads:[~2006-10-26  9:56 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 105+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2006-10-25 10:14 Security issues with local filesystem caching David Howells
2006-10-25 10:14 ` David Howells
2006-10-25 16:52 ` Nate Diller
2006-10-25 16:52   ` Nate Diller
2006-10-25 16:48   ` Jeff V. Merkey
2006-10-25 17:21     ` David Howells
2006-10-25 17:21       ` David Howells
2006-10-25 17:42       ` Jeff V. Merkey
2006-10-25 18:15         ` David Howells
2006-10-25 18:15           ` David Howells
2006-10-25 20:21 ` Josef Sipek
2006-10-25 20:28   ` Josef Sipek
2006-10-26  9:56   ` David Howells [this message]
2006-10-26  9:56     ` David Howells
2006-10-27 15:54     ` Josef Sipek
2006-10-25 21:12 ` Stephen Smalley
2006-10-25 21:12   ` Stephen Smalley
2006-10-26 10:40   ` David Howells
2006-10-26 10:40     ` David Howells
2006-10-26 12:51     ` Stephen Smalley
2006-10-26 12:51       ` Stephen Smalley
2006-10-26 16:04       ` David Howells
2006-10-26 16:04         ` David Howells
2006-10-26 16:34         ` Stephen Smalley
2006-10-26 16:34           ` Stephen Smalley
2006-10-26 17:09           ` David Howells
2006-10-26 17:09             ` David Howells
2006-10-26 17:45             ` Stephen Smalley
2006-10-26 17:45               ` Stephen Smalley
2006-10-26 22:53               ` David Howells
2006-10-26 22:53                 ` David Howells
2006-10-27 14:48                 ` Stephen Smalley
2006-10-27 14:48                   ` Stephen Smalley
2006-10-27 15:42                   ` David Howells
2006-10-27 15:42                     ` David Howells
2006-10-27 16:10                     ` Stephen Smalley
2006-10-27 16:10                       ` Stephen Smalley
2006-10-27 16:25                       ` David Howells
2006-10-27 16:25                         ` David Howells
2006-10-27 17:09                         ` Stephen Smalley
2006-10-27 17:09                           ` Stephen Smalley
2006-10-27 17:34                           ` David Howells
2006-10-27 17:34                             ` David Howells
2006-10-27 14:41               ` David Howells
2006-10-27 14:41                 ` David Howells
2006-10-27 15:03                 ` Stephen Smalley
2006-10-27 16:12                   ` David Howells
2006-10-27 16:37                     ` Stephen Smalley
2006-10-27 17:28                       ` David Howells
2006-10-27 18:10                         ` Stephen Smalley
2006-10-30 15:13                           ` David Howells
2006-10-31 16:19                           ` David Howells
2006-10-31 16:51                             ` Stephen Smalley
2006-10-31 19:21                               ` David Howells
2006-10-25 23:37 ` Alan Cox
2006-10-26  0:32   ` Al Viro
2006-10-26 10:45     ` David Howells
2006-10-26 10:45       ` David Howells
2006-10-26 10:54     ` Alan Cox
2006-10-26  9:14 ` Jan Dittmer
2006-10-26 10:55   ` David Howells
2006-10-26 10:55     ` David Howells
2006-10-26 11:52   ` Alan Cox
2006-10-31 21:26 ` David Howells
2006-10-31 21:26   ` David Howells
2006-11-01 13:28   ` Stephen Smalley
2006-11-01 13:28     ` Stephen Smalley
2006-11-01 15:34     ` David Howells
2006-11-01 15:34       ` David Howells
2006-11-01 15:58       ` Karl MacMillan
2006-11-01 15:58         ` Karl MacMillan
2006-11-01 17:45         ` Stephen Smalley
2006-11-01 17:45           ` Stephen Smalley
2006-11-02 16:29           ` Karl MacMillan
2006-11-02 16:29             ` Karl MacMillan
2006-11-02 18:04             ` Stephen Smalley
2006-11-02 18:04               ` Stephen Smalley
2006-11-01 17:30       ` Stephen Smalley
2006-11-01 17:30         ` Stephen Smalley
2006-11-02 17:16         ` David Howells
2006-11-02 17:16           ` David Howells
2006-11-02 19:49           ` Trond Myklebust
2006-11-02 20:38             ` David Howells
2006-11-02 20:38               ` David Howells
2006-11-02 21:24               ` Trond Myklebust
2006-11-03 10:27                 ` David Howells
2006-11-03 10:27                   ` David Howells
2006-11-03 13:41                   ` Trond Myklebust
2006-11-03 15:23                     ` David Howells
2006-11-03 15:23                       ` David Howells
2006-11-03 17:30                       ` Trond Myklebust
2006-11-14 19:22                         ` David Howells
2006-11-14 19:22                           ` David Howells
2006-11-15 14:05                           ` Trond Myklebust
2006-11-15 15:28                             ` David Howells
2006-11-15 15:28                               ` David Howells
2006-11-15 16:41                               ` Trond Myklebust
2006-11-15 18:17                                 ` David Howells
2006-11-15 18:17                                   ` David Howells
2006-11-03 15:33                     ` David Howells
2006-11-03 15:33                       ` David Howells
2006-11-02 20:33           ` Stephen Smalley
2006-11-02 20:33             ` Stephen Smalley
2006-11-02 21:05             ` David Howells
2006-11-02 21:05               ` David Howells

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