[RFC] Remove vala from oe-core

[RFC] Remove vala from oe-core

[Jussi Kukkonen]

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Hi all,

There's currently no software built with vala in oe-core. That's not great
for vala (as it's not getting the automated testing that high quality
maintenance would require) and it's not great for oe-core (as maintenance
effort is better spent on components that _are_ used).

Based on the above there's a feature request** to remove vala from oe-core.
Please comment here or on the bug if you think this is an inappropriate
idea or have suggestions.

If the plan goes through I intend to send a patch to add vala to another
layer to minimize disruption: I guess that would be
meta-openembedded/meta-oe as vala seems to have one user in this layer and
another one on that layer ... Suggestions welcome on that as well.

Alex, note that this might affect your GI patch set (or the other way
round).


Regards,
  Jussi

**) https://bugzilla.yoctoproject.org/show_bug.cgi?id=8640

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Re: [RFC] Remove vala from oe-core

[Carlos Rafael Giani]

On 11/10/2015 03:30 PM, Alexander Kanavin wrote:
> On 11/10/2015 04:22 PM, Jussi Kukkonen wrote:
>
>> There's currently no software built with vala in oe-core. That's not
>> great for vala (as it's not getting the automated testing that high
>> quality maintenance would require) and it's not great for oe-core (as
>> maintenance effort is better spent on components that _are_ used).
>>
>> Based on the above there's a feature request** to remove vala from
>> oe-core. Please comment here or on the bug if you think this is an
>> inappropriate idea or have suggestions.
>
> I have to say no. A lot of things in oe-core (libsoup for instance) 
> come with an option to build vala bindings which in turn require 
> native vapigen binary provided by vala package.
>
> Alex
>

Doesn't vala rely on GObject introspection, which is unsupported in OE?

Re: [RFC] Remove vala from oe-core

[Alexander Kanavin]

On 11/10/2015 04:22 PM, Jussi Kukkonen wrote:

> There's currently no software built with vala in oe-core. That's not
> great for vala (as it's not getting the automated testing that high
> quality maintenance would require) and it's not great for oe-core (as
> maintenance effort is better spent on components that _are_ used).
>
> Based on the above there's a feature request** to remove vala from
> oe-core. Please comment here or on the bug if you think this is an
> inappropriate idea or have suggestions.

I have to say no. A lot of things in oe-core (libsoup for instance) come 
with an option to build vala bindings which in turn require native 
vapigen binary provided by vala package.

Alex

Re: [RFC] Remove vala from oe-core

[Alexander Kanavin]

On 11/10/2015 04:29 PM, Carlos Rafael Giani wrote:

> Doesn't vala rely on GObject introspection, which is unsupported in OE?

I posted the patchset that adds the support for gobject introspection 
the other day. There is a bonus support for vala bindings in there as well.

Alex

Re: [RFC] Remove vala from oe-core

[Paul Eggleton]

On Tuesday 10 November 2015 16:30:05 Alexander Kanavin wrote:
> On 11/10/2015 04:22 PM, Jussi Kukkonen wrote:
> > There's currently no software built with vala in oe-core. That's not
> > great for vala (as it's not getting the automated testing that high
> > quality maintenance would require) and it's not great for oe-core (as
> > maintenance effort is better spent on components that _are_ used).
> > 
> > Based on the above there's a feature request** to remove vala from
> > oe-core. Please comment here or on the bug if you think this is an
> > inappropriate idea or have suggestions.
> 
> I have to say no. A lot of things in oe-core (libsoup for instance) come
> with an option to build vala bindings which in turn require native
> vapigen binary provided by vala package.

When considering whether something belongs in OE-Core, typically we apply the 
following criteria (not that this is really formalised, but based on our 
history):

1) Is it something that a reasonable majority of people need in an embedded 
context? 

2) If the answer to #1 is no, is it something that helps us test something 
else that is in OE-Core?

3) Does it have a reasonably minimal set of dependencies that are also 
required to be in OE-Core?

Cheers,
Paul

-- 

Paul Eggleton
Intel Open Source Technology Centre

Re: [RFC] Remove vala from oe-core

[Alexander Kanavin]

On 11/10/2015 04:50 PM, Paul Eggleton wrote:

> When considering whether something belongs in OE-Core, typically we apply the
> following criteria (not that this is really formalised, but based on our
> history):
>
> 1) Is it something that a reasonable majority of people need in an embedded
> context?

I should clarify: there might be Vala software out there that someone 
would want to run in an embedded context. And that software might 
require Vala bindings for libraries that are in oe-core. If we don't 
provide those bindings, then either the layer that adds vala recipe also 
has to patch all of our oe-core recipes, or (worse!) the person who 
needs something vala-based also has to ad-hoc-patch the dependency 
recipes of that.

Alex

Re: [RFC] Remove vala from oe-core

[Paul Eggleton]

On Tuesday 10 November 2015 17:06:14 Alexander Kanavin wrote:
> On 11/10/2015 04:50 PM, Paul Eggleton wrote:
> > When considering whether something belongs in OE-Core, typically we apply
> > the following criteria (not that this is really formalised, but based on
> > our history):
> > 
> > 1) Is it something that a reasonable majority of people need in an
> > embedded context?
> 
> I should clarify: there might be Vala software out there that someone
> would want to run in an embedded context. And that software might
> require Vala bindings for libraries that are in oe-core. If we don't
> provide those bindings, then either the layer that adds vala recipe also
> has to patch all of our oe-core recipes, 

That's what we have PACKAGECONFIG for.

> or (worse!) the person who
> needs something vala-based also has to ad-hoc-patch the dependency
> recipes of that.

There shouldn't be any patching needed at all. If we were to remove this from 
OE-Core, it still does not preclude us having the appropriate PACKAGECONFIG 
options to enable it.

Cheers,
Paul

-- 

Paul Eggleton
Intel Open Source Technology Centre

Re: [RFC] Remove vala from oe-core

[Burton, Ross]

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On 10 November 2015 at 15:06, Alexander Kanavin <
alexander.kanavin@linux.intel.com> wrote:

> I should clarify: there might be Vala software out there that someone
> would want to run in an embedded context. And that software might require
> Vala bindings for libraries that are in oe-core. If we don't provide those
> bindings, then either the layer that adds vala recipe also has to patch all
> of our oe-core recipes, or (worse!) the person who needs something
> vala-based also has to ad-hoc-patch the dependency recipes of that.
>

One solution for no vala in oe-core would be for all vala-supporting
recipes in oe-core to have a PACKAGECONFIG[vala], so if someone does want
Vala then they just need to add meta-vala (for example) to their layers and
enable the PACKAGECONFIGs where they want it enabled.  There's plenty of
prior art for this behaviour in oe-core already.

Ross

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Re: [RFC] Remove vala from oe-core

[Alexander Kanavin]

On 11/10/2015 05:10 PM, Burton, Ross wrote:

>     I should clarify: there might be Vala software out there that
>     someone would want to run in an embedded context. And that software
>     might require Vala bindings for libraries that are in oe-core. If we
>     don't provide those bindings, then either the layer that adds vala
>     recipe also has to patch all of our oe-core recipes, or (worse!) the
>     person who needs something vala-based also has to ad-hoc-patch the
>     dependency recipes of that.
>
>
> One solution for no vala in oe-core would be for all vala-supporting
> recipes in oe-core to have a PACKAGECONFIG[vala], so if someone does
> want Vala then they just need to add meta-vala (for example) to their
> layers and enable the PACKAGECONFIGs where they want it enabled.
> There's plenty of prior art for this behaviour in oe-core already.


PACKAGECONFIG alone is not sufficient; to build the bindings properly, 
the package also needs to inherit vala.bbclass:

https://git.yoctoproject.org/cgit/cgit.cgi/poky-contrib/tree/meta/classes/vala.bbclass?h=akanavin/gobject-introspection-experimental


Alex

Re: [RFC] Remove vala from oe-core

[Otavio Salvador]

On Tue, Nov 10, 2015 at 1:19 PM, Alexander Kanavin
<alexander.kanavin@linux.intel.com> wrote:
> On 11/10/2015 05:10 PM, Burton, Ross wrote:
>
>>     I should clarify: there might be Vala software out there that
>>     someone would want to run in an embedded context. And that software
>>     might require Vala bindings for libraries that are in oe-core. If we
>>     don't provide those bindings, then either the layer that adds vala
>>     recipe also has to patch all of our oe-core recipes, or (worse!) the
>>     person who needs something vala-based also has to ad-hoc-patch the
>>     dependency recipes of that.
>>
>>
>> One solution for no vala in oe-core would be for all vala-supporting
>> recipes in oe-core to have a PACKAGECONFIG[vala], so if someone does
>> want Vala then they just need to add meta-vala (for example) to their
>> layers and enable the PACKAGECONFIGs where they want it enabled.
>> There's plenty of prior art for this behaviour in oe-core already.
>
>
>
> PACKAGECONFIG alone is not sufficient; to build the bindings properly, the
> package also needs to inherit vala.bbclass:
>
> https://git.yoctoproject.org/cgit/cgit.cgi/poky-contrib/tree/meta/classes/vala.bbclass?h=akanavin/gobject-introspection-experimental

and this belong to meta-vala (or other). This reduces the core and
this is something we really should to push for.

-- 
Otavio Salvador                             O.S. Systems
http://www.ossystems.com.br        http://code.ossystems.com.br
Mobile: +55 (53) 9981-7854            Mobile: +1 (347) 903-9750

Re: [RFC] Remove vala from oe-core

[Alexander Kanavin]

On 11/10/2015 05:29 PM, Otavio Salvador wrote:

>> PACKAGECONFIG alone is not sufficient; to build the bindings properly, the
>> package also needs to inherit vala.bbclass:
>>
>> https://git.yoctoproject.org/cgit/cgit.cgi/poky-contrib/tree/meta/classes/vala.bbclass?h=akanavin/gobject-introspection-experimental
>
> and this belong to meta-vala (or other). This reduces the core and
> this is something we really should to push for.

If this class is moved to meta-vala, how do you make packages in oe-core 
inherit it, or otherwise do what it does?

Alex

Re: [RFC] Remove vala from oe-core

[Otavio Salvador]

On Tue, Nov 10, 2015 at 1:37 PM, Alexander Kanavin
<alexander.kanavin@linux.intel.com> wrote:
> On 11/10/2015 05:29 PM, Otavio Salvador wrote:
>
>>> PACKAGECONFIG alone is not sufficient; to build the bindings properly,
>>> the
>>> package also needs to inherit vala.bbclass:
>>>
>>>
>>> https://git.yoctoproject.org/cgit/cgit.cgi/poky-contrib/tree/meta/classes/vala.bbclass?h=akanavin/gobject-introspection-experimental
>>
>>
>> and this belong to meta-vala (or other). This reduces the core and
>> this is something we really should to push for.
>
>
> If this class is moved to meta-vala, how do you make packages in oe-core
> inherit it, or otherwise do what it does?

bbappend files? :)

-- 
Otavio Salvador                             O.S. Systems
http://www.ossystems.com.br        http://code.ossystems.com.br
Mobile: +55 (53) 9981-7854            Mobile: +1 (347) 903-9750

Re: [RFC] Remove vala from oe-core

[Martin Jansa]

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On Tue, Nov 10, 2015 at 04:22:07PM +0200, Jussi Kukkonen wrote:
> Hi all,
> 
> There's currently no software built with vala in oe-core. That's not great
> for vala (as it's not getting the automated testing that high quality
> maintenance would require) and it's not great for oe-core (as maintenance
> effort is better spent on components that _are_ used).
> 
> Based on the above there's a feature request** to remove vala from oe-core.
> Please comment here or on the bug if you think this is an inappropriate
> idea or have suggestions.
> 
> If the plan goes through I intend to send a patch to add vala to another
> layer to minimize disruption: I guess that would be
> meta-openembedded/meta-oe as vala seems to have one user in this layer and
> another one on that layer ... Suggestions welcome on that as well.
> 
> Alex, note that this might affect your GI patch set (or the other way
> round).

It was moved from meta-oe, so if you decide to drop it from oe-core then
meta-oe is where it should return:

commit 807285c751862aaa775db5a13293007bfb3c29df
Author: Mihai Prica <mihai.prica@intel.com>
Date:   Mon Aug 26 11:50:46 2013 +0000

    vala.bbclass: add class from meta-oe
    
    This can be used by packages written in vala.
    It is required by the Midori web-browser.
    
    Signed-off-by: Mihai Prica <mihai.prica@intel.com>
    Signed-off-by: Saul Wold <sgw@linux.intel.com>
    Signed-off-by: Richard Purdie <richard.purdie@linuxfoundation.org>

commit 649b48557d8702daaf4f28482848ab0b07abed83
Author: Mihai Prica <mihai.prica@intel.com>
Date:   Mon Aug 26 11:49:26 2013 +0000

    vala: add version 0.16 from meta-oe
    
    Vala is a C#-like language dedicated to ease GObject programming.
    It is required by the Midori web-browser.
    
    Signed-off-by: Mihai Prica <mihai.prica@intel.com>
    Signed-off-by: Saul Wold <sgw@linux.intel.com>
    Signed-off-by: Richard Purdie <richard.purdie@linuxfoundation.org>

-- 
Martin 'JaMa' Jansa     jabber: Martin.Jansa@gmail.com

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Re: [RFC] Remove vala from oe-core

[Andreas Müller]

On Tue, Nov 10, 2015 at 4:39 PM, Otavio Salvador
<otavio.salvador@ossystems.com.br> wrote:
> On Tue, Nov 10, 2015 at 1:37 PM, Alexander Kanavin
> <alexander.kanavin@linux.intel.com> wrote:
>> On 11/10/2015 05:29 PM, Otavio Salvador wrote:
>>
>>>> PACKAGECONFIG alone is not sufficient; to build the bindings properly,
>>>> the
>>>> package also needs to inherit vala.bbclass:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> https://git.yoctoproject.org/cgit/cgit.cgi/poky-contrib/tree/meta/classes/vala.bbclass?h=akanavin/gobject-introspection-experimental
>>>
>>>
>>> and this belong to meta-vala (or other). This reduces the core and
>>> this is something we really should to push for.
>>
>>
>> If this class is moved to meta-vala, how do you make packages in oe-core
>> inherit it, or otherwise do what it does?
>
> bbappend files? :)

What get's solved or better by moving back and forth recipes and adding appends?

Andreas

Re: [RFC] Remove vala from oe-core

[Otavio Salvador]

On Tue, Nov 10, 2015 at 2:25 PM, Andreas Müller
<schnitzeltony@googlemail.com> wrote:
> On Tue, Nov 10, 2015 at 4:39 PM, Otavio Salvador
> <otavio.salvador@ossystems.com.br> wrote:
>> On Tue, Nov 10, 2015 at 1:37 PM, Alexander Kanavin
>> <alexander.kanavin@linux.intel.com> wrote:
>>> On 11/10/2015 05:29 PM, Otavio Salvador wrote:
>>>
>>>>> PACKAGECONFIG alone is not sufficient; to build the bindings properly,
>>>>> the
>>>>> package also needs to inherit vala.bbclass:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> https://git.yoctoproject.org/cgit/cgit.cgi/poky-contrib/tree/meta/classes/vala.bbclass?h=akanavin/gobject-introspection-experimental
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> and this belong to meta-vala (or other). This reduces the core and
>>>> this is something we really should to push for.
>>>
>>>
>>> If this class is moved to meta-vala, how do you make packages in oe-core
>>> inherit it, or otherwise do what it does?
>>
>> bbappend files? :)
>
> What get's solved or better by moving back and forth recipes and adding appends?

I see no real benefit on Vala being into the oe-core; it can be add as
all the other layers we have. This helps to reduce the oe-core size.

-- 
Otavio Salvador                             O.S. Systems
http://www.ossystems.com.br        http://code.ossystems.com.br
Mobile: +55 (53) 9981-7854            Mobile: +1 (347) 903-9750

Re: [RFC] Remove vala from oe-core

[Richard Purdie]

On Tue, 2015-11-10 at 17:37 +0200, Alexander Kanavin wrote:
> On 11/10/2015 05:29 PM, Otavio Salvador wrote:
> 
> >> PACKAGECONFIG alone is not sufficient; to build the bindings properly, the
> >> package also needs to inherit vala.bbclass:
> >>
> >> https://git.yoctoproject.org/cgit/cgit.cgi/poky-contrib/tree/meta/classes/vala.bbclass?h=akanavin/gobject-introspection-experimental
> >
> > and this belong to meta-vala (or other). This reduces the core and
> > this is something we really should to push for.
> 
> If this class is moved to meta-vala, how do you make packages in oe-core 
> inherit it, or otherwise do what it does?

Much as I dislike this, you could do something like:

inherit ${@base_contains('PACKAGECONFIG', 'vala', 'vala', '')}

Cheers,

Richard

Re: [RFC] Remove vala from oe-core

[Paul Eggleton]

On Wednesday 11 November 2015 09:17:33 Richard Purdie wrote:
> On Tue, 2015-11-10 at 17:37 +0200, Alexander Kanavin wrote:
> > On 11/10/2015 05:29 PM, Otavio Salvador wrote:
> > >> PACKAGECONFIG alone is not sufficient; to build the bindings properly,
> > >> the package also needs to inherit vala.bbclass:
> > >> 
> > >> https://git.yoctoproject.org/cgit/cgit.cgi/poky-contrib/tree/meta/class
> > >> es/vala.bbclass?h=akanavin/gobject-introspection-experimental> > 
> > > and this belong to meta-vala (or other). This reduces the core and
> > > this is something we really should to push for.
> > 
> > If this class is moved to meta-vala, how do you make packages in oe-core
> > inherit it, or otherwise do what it does?
> 
> Much as I dislike this, you could do something like:
> 
> inherit ${@base_contains('PACKAGECONFIG', 'vala', 'vala', '')}

Hmm, that's a bit yucky I have to agree. It also won't allow you to enable the 
PACKAGECONFIG value from a bbappend.

Cheers,
Paul

-- 

Paul Eggleton
Intel Open Source Technology Centre

Re: [RFC] Remove vala from oe-core

[Alexander Kanavin]

On 11/11/2015 07:17 PM, Richard Purdie wrote:
>>
>> If this class is moved to meta-vala, how do you make packages in oe-core
>> inherit it, or otherwise do what it does?
>
> Much as I dislike this, you could do something like:
>
> inherit ${@base_contains('PACKAGECONFIG', 'vala', 'vala', '')}

Ugh, yes. It's an optional circular dependency and an opaque side effect 
rolled in one.

I'd rather go with bbappends in meta-vala (even though having them means 
that oe-core has failed to serve the needs of meta-vala users), or just 
keep vala in oe-core - it's not big and doesn't have special needs.

Alex