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From: Anthony Liguori <anthony@codemonkey.ws>
To: "Richard W.M. Jones" <rjones@redhat.com>
Cc: Avi Kivity <avi@redhat.com>,
	qemu-devel@nongnu.org, Gleb Natapov <gleb@redhat.com>,
	kvm@vger.kernel.org
Subject: Re: [Qemu-devel] Anyone seeing huge slowdown launching qemu with Linux 2.6.35?
Date: Tue, 03 Aug 2010 11:39:43 -0500	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <4C58464F.1010303@codemonkey.ws> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <20100803145337.GF22211@amd.home.annexia.org>

On 08/03/2010 09:53 AM, Richard W.M. Jones wrote:
> On Tue, Aug 03, 2010 at 05:38:25PM +0300, Avi Kivity wrote:
>    
>> The time will only continue to grow as you add features and as the
>> distro bloats naturally.
>>
>> Much better to create it once and only update it if some dependent
>> file changes (basically the current on-the-fly code + save a list of
>> file timestamps).
>>      
> This applies to both cases, the initrd could also be saved, so:
>
>    
>>> Total saving: 115ms.
>>>        
>> 815 ms by my arithmetic.
>>      
> no, not true, 115ms.
>
>    
>> You also save 3*N-2*P memory where N is the size of your initrd and
>> P is the actual amount used by the guest.
>>      
> Can you explain this?
>
>    
>> Loading a file into memory is plenty fast if you use the standard
>> interfaces.  -kernel -initrd is a specialized interface.
>>      
> Why bother with any command line options at all?  After all, they keep
> changing and causing problems for qemu's users ...  Apparently we're
> all doing stuff "wrong", in ways that are never explained by the
> developers.
>    

Let's be fair.  I think we've all agreed to adjust the fw_cfg interface 
to implement DMA.  The only requirement was that the DMA operation not 
be triggered from a single port I/O but rather based on a polling 
operation which better fits the way real hardware works.

Is this a regression?  Probably.  But performance regressions that 
result from correctness fixes don't get reverted.  We have to find an 
approach to improve performance without impacting correctness.

That said, the general view of -kernel/-append is that these are 
developer options and we don't really look at it as a performance 
critical interface.  We could do a better job of communicating this to 
users but that's true of most of the features we support.

Regards,

Anthony Liguori

> Rich.
>
>    


WARNING: multiple messages have this Message-ID (diff)
From: Anthony Liguori <anthony@codemonkey.ws>
To: "Richard W.M. Jones" <rjones@redhat.com>
Cc: kvm@vger.kernel.org, Avi Kivity <avi@redhat.com>,
	Gleb Natapov <gleb@redhat.com>,
	qemu-devel@nongnu.org
Subject: Re: [Qemu-devel] Anyone seeing huge slowdown launching qemu with Linux 2.6.35?
Date: Tue, 03 Aug 2010 11:39:43 -0500	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <4C58464F.1010303@codemonkey.ws> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <20100803145337.GF22211@amd.home.annexia.org>

On 08/03/2010 09:53 AM, Richard W.M. Jones wrote:
> On Tue, Aug 03, 2010 at 05:38:25PM +0300, Avi Kivity wrote:
>    
>> The time will only continue to grow as you add features and as the
>> distro bloats naturally.
>>
>> Much better to create it once and only update it if some dependent
>> file changes (basically the current on-the-fly code + save a list of
>> file timestamps).
>>      
> This applies to both cases, the initrd could also be saved, so:
>
>    
>>> Total saving: 115ms.
>>>        
>> 815 ms by my arithmetic.
>>      
> no, not true, 115ms.
>
>    
>> You also save 3*N-2*P memory where N is the size of your initrd and
>> P is the actual amount used by the guest.
>>      
> Can you explain this?
>
>    
>> Loading a file into memory is plenty fast if you use the standard
>> interfaces.  -kernel -initrd is a specialized interface.
>>      
> Why bother with any command line options at all?  After all, they keep
> changing and causing problems for qemu's users ...  Apparently we're
> all doing stuff "wrong", in ways that are never explained by the
> developers.
>    

Let's be fair.  I think we've all agreed to adjust the fw_cfg interface 
to implement DMA.  The only requirement was that the DMA operation not 
be triggered from a single port I/O but rather based on a polling 
operation which better fits the way real hardware works.

Is this a regression?  Probably.  But performance regressions that 
result from correctness fixes don't get reverted.  We have to find an 
approach to improve performance without impacting correctness.

That said, the general view of -kernel/-append is that these are 
developer options and we don't really look at it as a performance 
critical interface.  We could do a better job of communicating this to 
users but that's true of most of the features we support.

Regards,

Anthony Liguori

> Rich.
>
>    

  parent reply	other threads:[~2010-08-03 16:39 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 285+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2010-08-03 11:13 [Qemu-devel] Anyone seeing huge slowdown launching qemu with Linux 2.6.35? Richard W.M. Jones
2010-08-03 11:33 ` Gleb Natapov
2010-08-03 12:10   ` Richard W.M. Jones
2010-08-03 12:37     ` Gleb Natapov
2010-08-03 12:48       ` Richard W.M. Jones
2010-08-03 13:19         ` Avi Kivity
2010-08-03 13:19           ` Avi Kivity
2010-08-03 14:05           ` Richard W.M. Jones
2010-08-03 14:38             ` Avi Kivity
2010-08-03 14:53               ` Richard W.M. Jones
2010-08-03 16:10                 ` Avi Kivity
2010-08-03 16:28                   ` Richard W.M. Jones
2010-08-03 16:44                     ` Avi Kivity
2010-08-03 16:46                       ` Anthony Liguori
2010-08-03 16:46                         ` Anthony Liguori
2010-08-03 16:50                         ` Avi Kivity
2010-08-03 16:50                           ` Avi Kivity
2010-08-03 16:53                           ` Anthony Liguori
2010-08-03 16:53                             ` Anthony Liguori
2010-08-03 17:01                             ` Avi Kivity
2010-08-03 17:01                               ` Avi Kivity
2010-08-03 17:42                               ` Anthony Liguori
2010-08-03 17:42                                 ` Anthony Liguori
2010-08-03 17:58                                 ` Avi Kivity
2010-08-03 17:58                                   ` Avi Kivity
2010-08-03 18:11                                   ` Richard W.M. Jones
2010-08-03 18:11                                     ` Richard W.M. Jones
2010-08-03 18:26                                   ` Anthony Liguori
2010-08-03 18:26                                     ` Anthony Liguori
2010-08-03 18:43                                     ` Avi Kivity
2010-08-03 18:43                                       ` Avi Kivity
2010-08-03 18:47                                       ` Avi Kivity
2010-08-03 18:47                                         ` Avi Kivity
2010-08-03 18:55                                       ` Anthony Liguori
2010-08-03 18:55                                         ` Anthony Liguori
2010-08-03 19:00                                         ` Avi Kivity
2010-08-03 19:00                                           ` Avi Kivity
2010-08-03 19:05                                       ` Gleb Natapov
2010-08-03 19:05                                         ` Gleb Natapov
2010-08-03 19:09                                         ` Avi Kivity
2010-08-03 19:09                                           ` Avi Kivity
2010-08-03 19:15                                         ` Anthony Liguori
2010-08-03 19:15                                           ` Anthony Liguori
2010-08-03 19:24                                           ` Avi Kivity
2010-08-03 19:24                                             ` Avi Kivity
2010-08-03 19:38                                             ` Anthony Liguori
2010-08-03 19:38                                               ` Anthony Liguori
2010-08-03 19:41                                               ` Avi Kivity
2010-08-03 19:41                                                 ` Avi Kivity
2010-08-03 19:47                                                 ` Anthony Liguori
2010-08-03 19:47                                                   ` Anthony Liguori
2010-08-04  5:47                                                   ` Avi Kivity
2010-08-04  5:47                                                     ` Avi Kivity
2010-08-03 21:24                                                 ` Gerd Hoffmann
2010-08-03 21:24                                                   ` Gerd Hoffmann
2010-08-03 21:20                                             ` Gerd Hoffmann
2010-08-03 21:20                                               ` Gerd Hoffmann
2010-08-04  5:53                                               ` Avi Kivity
2010-08-04  5:53                                                 ` Avi Kivity
2010-08-04  7:56                                                 ` Gerd Hoffmann
2010-08-04  7:56                                                   ` Gerd Hoffmann
2010-08-04  8:17                                                   ` Avi Kivity
2010-08-04  8:17                                                     ` Avi Kivity
2010-08-04  8:43                                                     ` Gleb Natapov
2010-08-04  8:43                                                       ` Gleb Natapov
2010-08-04  9:22                                                     ` Gerd Hoffmann
2010-08-04  9:22                                                       ` Gerd Hoffmann
2010-08-04 13:04                                                     ` Anthony Liguori
2010-08-04 13:04                                                       ` Anthony Liguori
2010-08-04 13:07                                                       ` Gleb Natapov
2010-08-04 13:07                                                         ` Gleb Natapov
2010-08-04 13:15                                                         ` Anthony Liguori
2010-08-04 13:15                                                           ` Anthony Liguori
2010-08-04 13:24                                                           ` Richard W.M. Jones
2010-08-04 13:24                                                             ` Richard W.M. Jones
2010-08-04 13:26                                                             ` Gleb Natapov
2010-08-04 13:26                                                               ` Gleb Natapov
2010-08-04 14:22                                                               ` Anthony Liguori
2010-08-04 14:22                                                                 ` Anthony Liguori
2010-08-04 14:38                                                                 ` Gleb Natapov
2010-08-04 14:38                                                                   ` Gleb Natapov
2010-08-04 14:50                                                                   ` Anthony Liguori
2010-08-04 14:50                                                                     ` Anthony Liguori
2010-08-04 15:01                                                                     ` Gleb Natapov
2010-08-04 15:01                                                                       ` Gleb Natapov
2010-08-04 15:07                                                                       ` Anthony Liguori
2010-08-04 15:07                                                                         ` Anthony Liguori
2010-08-04 15:15                                                                         ` Gleb Natapov
2010-08-04 15:15                                                                           ` Gleb Natapov
2010-08-04 22:41                                                                       ` Kevin O'Connor
2010-08-04 22:41                                                                         ` Kevin O'Connor
2010-08-04 16:26                                                             ` Avi Kivity
2010-08-04 16:26                                                               ` Avi Kivity
2010-08-04 13:34                                                           ` Gleb Natapov
2010-08-04 13:34                                                             ` Gleb Natapov
2010-08-04 13:52                                                             ` Anthony Liguori
2010-08-04 13:52                                                               ` [Qemu-devel] " Anthony Liguori
2010-08-04 14:00                                                               ` Gleb Natapov
2010-08-04 14:00                                                                 ` Gleb Natapov
2010-08-04 14:14                                                                 ` Anthony Liguori
2010-08-04 14:14                                                                   ` Anthony Liguori
2010-08-04 14:36                                                                   ` Gleb Natapov
2010-08-04 14:36                                                                     ` Gleb Natapov
2010-08-04 14:22                                                                 ` Paolo Bonzini
2010-08-04 14:22                                                                   ` Paolo Bonzini
2010-08-04 14:39                                                                   ` Anthony Liguori
2010-08-04 14:39                                                                     ` Anthony Liguori
2010-08-04 16:33                                                                     ` Avi Kivity
2010-08-04 16:33                                                                       ` Avi Kivity
2010-08-04 16:30                                                               ` Avi Kivity
2010-08-04 16:30                                                                 ` Avi Kivity
2010-08-04 16:36                                                                 ` Avi Kivity
2010-08-04 16:36                                                                   ` Avi Kivity
2010-08-04 16:44                                                                   ` Anthony Liguori
2010-08-04 16:44                                                                     ` Anthony Liguori
2010-08-04 16:52                                                                     ` Avi Kivity
2010-08-04 16:52                                                                       ` Avi Kivity
2010-08-04 17:37                                                                     ` Gleb Natapov
2010-08-04 17:37                                                                       ` Gleb Natapov
2010-08-05  7:28                                                                     ` Gerd Hoffmann
2010-08-05  7:28                                                                       ` Gerd Hoffmann
2010-08-05  7:34                                                                       ` Gleb Natapov
2010-08-05  7:34                                                                         ` Gleb Natapov
2010-08-05  7:56                                                                         ` Avi Kivity
2010-08-05  7:56                                                                           ` Avi Kivity
2010-08-05  7:59                                                                           ` Gleb Natapov
2010-08-05  7:59                                                                             ` Gleb Natapov
2010-08-05  8:45                                                                             ` Avi Kivity
2010-08-05  8:45                                                                               ` Avi Kivity
2010-08-05  8:48                                                                               ` Gleb Natapov
2010-08-05  8:48                                                                                 ` Gleb Natapov
2010-08-05 13:43                                                                       ` Anthony Liguori
2010-08-05 13:43                                                                         ` Anthony Liguori
2010-08-04 16:45                                                                   ` Alexander Graf
2010-08-04 16:45                                                                     ` Alexander Graf
2010-08-04 16:54                                                                     ` Avi Kivity
2010-08-04 16:54                                                                       ` Avi Kivity
2010-08-04 17:01                                                                       ` Alexander Graf
2010-08-04 17:01                                                                         ` Alexander Graf
2010-08-04 17:14                                                                         ` Avi Kivity
2010-08-04 17:14                                                                           ` Avi Kivity
2010-08-04 17:27                                                                           ` Alexander Graf
2010-08-04 17:27                                                                             ` Alexander Graf
2010-08-04 17:34                                                                             ` Avi Kivity
2010-08-04 17:34                                                                               ` Avi Kivity
2010-08-04 20:06                                                                               ` David S. Ahern
2010-08-04 20:06                                                                                 ` David S. Ahern
2010-08-04 20:16                                                                                 ` Richard W.M. Jones
2010-08-04 20:16                                                                                   ` Richard W.M. Jones
2010-08-05  2:38                                                                                 ` Avi Kivity
2010-08-05  2:38                                                                                   ` Avi Kivity
2010-08-04 17:26                                                                     ` Anthony Liguori
2010-08-04 17:26                                                                       ` Anthony Liguori
2010-08-04 17:31                                                                       ` Alexander Graf
2010-08-04 17:31                                                                         ` Alexander Graf
2010-08-04 17:35                                                                         ` Avi Kivity
2010-08-04 17:35                                                                           ` Avi Kivity
2010-08-04 17:36                                                                         ` Anthony Liguori
2010-08-04 17:36                                                                           ` Anthony Liguori
2010-08-04 17:36                                                                           ` Alexander Graf
2010-08-04 17:36                                                                             ` Alexander Graf
2010-08-04 17:46                                                                   ` Richard W.M. Jones
2010-08-04 17:46                                                                     ` Richard W.M. Jones
2010-08-04 17:50                                                                     ` Avi Kivity
2010-08-04 17:50                                                                       ` Avi Kivity
2010-08-04 18:13                                                                     ` Alexander Graf
2010-08-04 18:13                                                                       ` [Qemu-devel] " Alexander Graf
2010-08-04 18:16                                                                       ` Anthony Liguori
2010-08-04 18:16                                                                         ` Anthony Liguori
2010-08-04 18:18                                                                         ` Alexander Graf
2010-08-04 18:18                                                                           ` Alexander Graf
2010-08-04 18:19                                                                         ` Avi Kivity
2010-08-04 18:19                                                                           ` Avi Kivity
2010-08-04 18:18                                                                       ` Avi Kivity
2010-08-04 18:18                                                                         ` Avi Kivity
2010-08-04 16:42                                                                 ` Anthony Liguori
2010-08-04 16:42                                                                   ` Anthony Liguori
2010-08-04 13:22                                                         ` Richard W.M. Jones
2010-08-04 13:22                                                           ` Richard W.M. Jones
2010-08-04 13:29                                                           ` Gleb Natapov
2010-08-04 13:29                                                             ` Gleb Natapov
2010-08-04 16:25                                                       ` Avi Kivity
2010-08-04 16:25                                                         ` Avi Kivity
2010-08-03 22:06                                             ` Richard W.M. Jones
2010-08-03 22:06                                               ` Richard W.M. Jones
2010-08-04  5:54                                               ` Avi Kivity
2010-08-04  5:54                                                 ` Avi Kivity
2010-08-04  9:24                                                 ` Richard W.M. Jones
2010-08-04  9:24                                                   ` Richard W.M. Jones
2010-08-04  9:27                                                   ` Gleb Natapov
2010-08-04  9:27                                                     ` Gleb Natapov
2010-08-04  9:52                                                   ` Avi Kivity
2010-08-04  9:52                                                     ` Avi Kivity
2010-08-04 11:33                                                     ` Richard W.M. Jones
2010-08-04 11:33                                                       ` Richard W.M. Jones
2010-08-04 11:36                                                       ` Avi Kivity
2010-08-04 11:36                                                         ` Avi Kivity
2010-08-04 12:07                                                       ` Gleb Natapov
2010-08-04 12:07                                                         ` Gleb Natapov
2010-08-04 12:59                                                   ` Anthony Liguori
2010-08-04 12:59                                                     ` Anthony Liguori
2010-08-03 19:26                                           ` Gleb Natapov
2010-08-03 19:26                                             ` Gleb Natapov
2010-08-03 19:13                                       ` Richard W.M. Jones
2010-08-03 19:13                                         ` Richard W.M. Jones
2010-08-03 19:17                                         ` Gleb Natapov
2010-08-03 19:17                                           ` Gleb Natapov
2010-08-03 19:19                                         ` Anthony Liguori
2010-08-03 19:19                                           ` Anthony Liguori
2010-08-03 19:22                                         ` Avi Kivity
2010-08-03 19:22                                           ` Avi Kivity
2010-08-03 20:00                                           ` Richard W.M. Jones
2010-08-03 20:00                                             ` Richard W.M. Jones
2010-08-03 20:49                                             ` Anthony Liguori
2010-08-03 20:49                                               ` Anthony Liguori
2010-08-03 21:13                                               ` Paolo Bonzini
2010-08-03 21:13                                                 ` Paolo Bonzini
2010-08-03 21:34                                                 ` Anthony Liguori
2010-08-03 21:34                                                   ` Anthony Liguori
2010-08-04  7:57                                                   ` Paolo Bonzini
2010-08-04  7:57                                                     ` Paolo Bonzini
2010-08-04  8:19                                                     ` Avi Kivity
2010-08-04  8:19                                                       ` Avi Kivity
2010-08-04 12:53                                                     ` Anthony Liguori
2010-08-04 12:53                                                       ` Anthony Liguori
2010-08-04 16:44                                                       ` Avi Kivity
2010-08-04 16:44                                                         ` Avi Kivity
2010-08-04 16:46                                                         ` Anthony Liguori
2010-08-04 16:46                                                           ` Anthony Liguori
2010-08-04 16:48                                                           ` Alexander Graf
2010-08-04 16:48                                                             ` Alexander Graf
2010-08-04 16:49                                                             ` Anthony Liguori
2010-08-04 16:49                                                               ` Anthony Liguori
2010-08-04 16:51                                                               ` Alexander Graf
2010-08-04 16:51                                                                 ` Alexander Graf
2010-08-04 17:01                                                               ` Paolo Bonzini
2010-08-04 17:01                                                                 ` Paolo Bonzini
2010-08-04 17:19                                                                 ` Avi Kivity
2010-08-04 17:19                                                                   ` Avi Kivity
2010-08-04 17:25                                                                   ` Alexander Graf
2010-08-04 17:25                                                                     ` Alexander Graf
2010-08-04 17:27                                                                   ` Anthony Liguori
2010-08-04 17:27                                                                     ` Anthony Liguori
2010-08-04 17:37                                                                     ` Avi Kivity
2010-08-04 17:37                                                                       ` Avi Kivity
2010-08-04 17:53                                                                       ` Anthony Liguori
2010-08-04 17:53                                                                         ` Anthony Liguori
2010-08-04 18:05                                                                         ` Alexander Graf
2010-08-04 18:05                                                                           ` Alexander Graf
2010-08-04  5:56                                               ` Avi Kivity
2010-08-04  5:56                                                 ` Avi Kivity
2010-08-04  1:17                                             ` Jamie Lokier
2010-08-04  1:17                                               ` Jamie Lokier
2010-08-04  8:21                                         ` Avi Kivity
2010-08-04  8:21                                           ` Avi Kivity
2010-08-04 14:51                                       ` David S. Ahern
2010-08-04 14:51                                         ` David S. Ahern
2010-08-04 14:57                                         ` Anthony Liguori
2010-08-04 14:57                                           ` Anthony Liguori
2010-08-04 15:25                                           ` Gleb Natapov
2010-08-04 15:25                                             ` Gleb Natapov
2010-08-04 15:31                                             ` Alexander Graf
2010-08-04 15:31                                               ` Alexander Graf
2010-08-04 15:48                                               ` Gleb Natapov
2010-08-04 15:48                                                 ` Gleb Natapov
2010-08-04 15:59                                                 ` Alexander Graf
2010-08-04 15:59                                                   ` Alexander Graf
2010-08-04 16:08                                                   ` Gleb Natapov
2010-08-04 16:08                                                     ` Gleb Natapov
2010-08-04 16:48                                                     ` Avi Kivity
2010-08-04 16:48                                                       ` Avi Kivity
2010-08-04 23:17                                             ` Kevin O'Connor
2010-08-04 23:17                                               ` Kevin O'Connor
2010-08-05  5:26                                               ` Gleb Natapov
2010-08-05  5:26                                                 ` Gleb Natapov
2010-08-03 16:56                           ` Anthony Liguori
2010-08-03 16:56                             ` Anthony Liguori
2010-08-03 16:48                       ` Avi Kivity
2010-08-03 17:00                         ` Richard W.M. Jones
2010-08-03 17:05                           ` Avi Kivity
2010-08-03 16:56                       ` Richard W.M. Jones
2010-08-03 17:08                         ` Avi Kivity
2010-08-03 16:39                 ` Anthony Liguori [this message]
2010-08-03 16:39                   ` Anthony Liguori
2010-08-03 16:43                   ` Richard W.M. Jones

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