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From: James Bottomley <James.Bottomley-d9PhHud1JfjCXq6kfMZ53/egYHeGw8Jk@public.gmane.org>
To: Tejun Heo <tj-DgEjT+Ai2ygdnm+yROfE0A@public.gmane.org>
Cc: Vivek Goyal <vgoyal-H+wXaHxf7aLQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org>,
	Peter Zijlstra <peterz-wEGCiKHe2LqWVfeAwA7xHQ@public.gmane.org>,
	Li Zefan <lizf-BthXqXjhjHXQFUHtdCDX3A@public.gmane.org>,
	containers-cunTk1MwBs9QetFLy7KEm3xJsTq8ys+cHZ5vskTnxNA@public.gmane.org,
	cgroups-u79uwXL29TY76Z2rM5mHXA@public.gmane.org,
	Andrew Morton
	<akpm-de/tnXTf+JLsfHDXvbKv3WD2FQJk+8+b@public.gmane.org>,
	Kay Sievers <kay.sievers-tD+1rO4QERM@public.gmane.org>,
	Lennart Poettering
	<lennart-mdGvqq1h2p+GdvJs77BJ7Q@public.gmane.org>,
	Frederic Weisbecker
	<fweisbec-Re5JQEeQqe8AvxtiuMwx3w@public.gmane.org>,
	linux-kernel-u79uwXL29TY76Z2rM5mHXA@public.gmane.org,
	Michal Schmidt <mschmidt-H+wXaHxf7aLQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org>
Subject: Re: [RFD] cgroup: about multiple hierarchies
Date: Fri, 16 Mar 2012 23:14:39 +0000	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <1331939679.2858.56.camel@dabdike> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <20120313155955.GB7349-hpIqsD4AKlfQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org>

On Tue, 2012-03-13 at 08:59 -0700, Tejun Heo wrote:
> Hey, Vivek.
> 
> On Tue, Mar 13, 2012 at 10:03:45AM -0400, Vivek Goyal wrote:
> > > With root being treated specially, probably as just being a equal
> > > group as other groups, I'm not fully determined about that yet.
> > 
> > So what wrong with flattening the whole hierarchy and all groups being active
> > in the path? It is not worse then second option?
> > 
> >              root
> >        /   |  |  |  \
> >       G1  G2  G3 G31 G32
> 
> It is worse because while there isn't much need for orthogonal
> hierarchies, people often need to apply different limits at different
> levels of the hierarchy for different controllers.  ie. it often
> happens that the distinction between G31 and G32 matters for one
> controller but not for others.  The problem with flattening like you
> suggested above is that it isn't a hierarchy at all - membership isn't
> recursive.
> 
> Imposing limits at single level is an additional restriction and may
> cause some config complexity but it'll be at least explicit and can
> co-exist with full hierarchy in meaningful way.

Isn't there a simple fix for this?  Each controller can decide whether
to pay attention to its cgroup parent in calculating the resource limits
or counting usage.  If the controller elects not to pay attention to its
parents when counting resources and enforcing limits, it effectively
gives you a flat hierarchy from the point of view of the controller.

What actually happens depends on how the controller calculates the
limits: if it's a global fraction, then it's completely flat, if it's
just an absolute limit, then it wouldn't pay attention to the parent
anyway, if it's a proportion, then the controller has to decide how to
divide up the parent's allocation.

James


WARNING: multiple messages have this Message-ID (diff)
From: James Bottomley <James.Bottomley@HansenPartnership.com>
To: Tejun Heo <tj@kernel.org>
Cc: Vivek Goyal <vgoyal@redhat.com>,
	Peter Zijlstra <peterz@infradead.org>,
	Li Zefan <lizf@cn.fujitsu.com>,
	containers@lists.linux-foundation.org, cgroups@vger.kernel.org,
	Andrew Morton <akpm@linux-foundation.org>,
	Kay Sievers <kay.sievers@vrfy.org>,
	Lennart Poettering <lennart@poettering.net>,
	Frederic Weisbecker <fweisbec@gmail.com>,
	linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org,
	Michal Schmidt <mschmidt@redhat.com>
Subject: Re: [RFD] cgroup: about multiple hierarchies
Date: Fri, 16 Mar 2012 23:14:39 +0000	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <1331939679.2858.56.camel@dabdike> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <20120313155955.GB7349@google.com>

On Tue, 2012-03-13 at 08:59 -0700, Tejun Heo wrote:
> Hey, Vivek.
> 
> On Tue, Mar 13, 2012 at 10:03:45AM -0400, Vivek Goyal wrote:
> > > With root being treated specially, probably as just being a equal
> > > group as other groups, I'm not fully determined about that yet.
> > 
> > So what wrong with flattening the whole hierarchy and all groups being active
> > in the path? It is not worse then second option?
> > 
> >              root
> >        /   |  |  |  \
> >       G1  G2  G3 G31 G32
> 
> It is worse because while there isn't much need for orthogonal
> hierarchies, people often need to apply different limits at different
> levels of the hierarchy for different controllers.  ie. it often
> happens that the distinction between G31 and G32 matters for one
> controller but not for others.  The problem with flattening like you
> suggested above is that it isn't a hierarchy at all - membership isn't
> recursive.
> 
> Imposing limits at single level is an additional restriction and may
> cause some config complexity but it'll be at least explicit and can
> co-exist with full hierarchy in meaningful way.

Isn't there a simple fix for this?  Each controller can decide whether
to pay attention to its cgroup parent in calculating the resource limits
or counting usage.  If the controller elects not to pay attention to its
parents when counting resources and enforcing limits, it effectively
gives you a flat hierarchy from the point of view of the controller.

What actually happens depends on how the controller calculates the
limits: if it's a global fraction, then it's completely flat, if it's
just an absolute limit, then it wouldn't pay attention to the parent
anyway, if it's a proportion, then the controller has to decide how to
divide up the parent's allocation.

James



  parent reply	other threads:[~2012-03-16 23:14 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 211+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
2012-02-21 21:19 [RFD] cgroup: about multiple hierarchies Tejun Heo
2012-02-21 21:19 ` Tejun Heo
     [not found] ` <20120221211938.GE12236-hpIqsD4AKlfQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org>
2012-02-21 21:21   ` Tejun Heo
2012-02-21 21:21   ` Tejun Heo
2012-02-21 21:21     ` Tejun Heo
     [not found]     ` <20120221212106.GF12236-hpIqsD4AKlfQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org>
2012-02-22 13:34       ` Glauber Costa
2012-02-22 13:34       ` Glauber Costa
2012-02-22 13:34         ` Glauber Costa
     [not found]         ` <4F44EEE4.2000809-bzQdu9zFT3WakBO8gow8eQ@public.gmane.org>
2012-02-23  7:45           ` Serge E. Hallyn
2012-02-23  7:45           ` Serge E. Hallyn
2012-02-23  7:45             ` Serge E. Hallyn
     [not found]             ` <20120223074526.GA15835-7LNsyQBKDXoIagZqoN9o3w@public.gmane.org>
2012-02-23 17:29               ` Tejun Heo
2012-02-23 17:29                 ` Tejun Heo
     [not found]                 ` <20120223172915.GC22536-hpIqsD4AKlfQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org>
2012-02-23 18:47                   ` Serge Hallyn
2012-02-23 18:47                     ` Serge Hallyn
2012-02-26  4:59       ` Konstantin Khlebnikov
2012-02-26  4:59         ` Konstantin Khlebnikov
2012-02-26  4:59       ` Konstantin Khlebnikov
2012-02-22 13:30   ` Peter Zijlstra
2012-02-22 13:30   ` Peter Zijlstra
2012-02-22 13:30     ` Peter Zijlstra
2012-02-22 13:37     ` Glauber Costa
2012-02-22 13:37     ` Glauber Costa
2012-02-22 13:37       ` Glauber Costa
2012-02-22 18:01     ` Tejun Heo
2012-02-22 18:01       ` Tejun Heo
2012-02-22 18:01     ` Tejun Heo
2012-02-23  7:39     ` Li Zefan
2012-02-23  7:39     ` Li Zefan
2012-02-23  7:39       ` Li Zefan
2012-02-22 15:45   ` Frederic Weisbecker
2012-02-22 15:45     ` Frederic Weisbecker
     [not found]     ` <20120222154501.GA1693-oHC15RC7JGTpAmv0O++HtFaTQe2KTcn/@public.gmane.org>
2012-02-22 18:22       ` Tejun Heo
2012-02-22 18:22         ` Tejun Heo
2012-02-27 17:46         ` Frederic Weisbecker
     [not found]         ` <20120222182207.GC32694-hpIqsD4AKlfQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org>
2012-02-27 17:46           ` Frederic Weisbecker
2012-02-22 18:22       ` Tejun Heo
2012-02-22 16:38   ` Vivek Goyal
2012-02-22 16:38     ` Vivek Goyal
     [not found]     ` <20120222163858.GB4128-H+wXaHxf7aLQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org>
2012-02-22 16:57       ` Vivek Goyal
2012-02-22 16:57         ` Vivek Goyal
     [not found]         ` <20120222165714.GC4128-H+wXaHxf7aLQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org>
2012-02-22 18:43           ` Tejun Heo
2012-02-22 18:43           ` Tejun Heo
2012-02-22 18:43             ` Tejun Heo
2012-02-23  9:41           ` Peter Zijlstra
2012-02-23  9:41             ` Peter Zijlstra
2012-02-23 14:13             ` Peter Zijlstra
2012-02-23 14:13               ` Peter Zijlstra
2012-03-01 17:19               ` Michal Schmidt
2012-03-01 17:19                 ` Michal Schmidt
     [not found]                 ` <4F4FAF89.3090706-H+wXaHxf7aLQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org>
2012-03-01 18:03                   ` Peter Zijlstra
2012-03-01 18:03                     ` Peter Zijlstra
2012-03-02 11:08                     ` Michal Schmidt
2012-03-02 11:08                       ` Michal Schmidt
     [not found]                       ` <4F50AA22.9080007-H+wXaHxf7aLQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org>
2012-03-02 11:23                         ` Peter Zijlstra
2012-03-02 11:23                         ` Peter Zijlstra
2012-03-02 11:23                           ` Peter Zijlstra
2012-03-02 11:28                           ` Michal Schmidt
2012-03-02 11:28                             ` Michal Schmidt
     [not found]                             ` <4F50AEC3.5090807-H+wXaHxf7aLQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org>
2012-03-02 11:34                               ` Peter Zijlstra
2012-03-02 11:34                                 ` Peter Zijlstra
2012-03-01 20:26                   ` Mike Galbraith
2012-03-01 20:26                   ` Mike Galbraith
2012-03-01 20:26                     ` Mike Galbraith
     [not found]                     ` <1330633603.7414.49.camel-YqMYhexLQo31wTEvPJ5Q0F6hYfS7NtTn@public.gmane.org>
2012-03-01 21:02                       ` Vivek Goyal
2012-03-01 21:02                         ` Vivek Goyal
     [not found]                         ` <20120301210213.GF13533-H+wXaHxf7aLQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org>
2012-03-01 22:04                           ` Mike Galbraith
2012-03-01 22:04                             ` Mike Galbraith
     [not found]                             ` <1330639448.7414.97.camel-YqMYhexLQo31wTEvPJ5Q0F6hYfS7NtTn@public.gmane.org>
2012-03-01 22:38                               ` C Anthony Risinger
2012-03-01 22:38                               ` C Anthony Risinger
2012-03-01 22:38                                 ` C Anthony Risinger
2012-03-02 10:51                               ` Michal Schmidt
2012-03-02 10:51                                 ` Michal Schmidt
     [not found]                                 ` <4F50A63F.40306-H+wXaHxf7aLQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org>
2012-03-02 11:52                                   ` Mike Galbraith
2012-03-02 11:52                                     ` Mike Galbraith
2012-03-02 11:52                                   ` Mike Galbraith
2012-03-05 12:43                               ` Lennart Poettering
2012-03-05 12:43                                 ` Lennart Poettering
     [not found]                                 ` <20120305124310.GD10929-kS5D54t9nk0aINubkmmoJbNAH6kLmebB@public.gmane.org>
2012-03-05 15:47                                   ` Mike Galbraith
2012-03-05 15:47                                     ` Mike Galbraith
     [not found]                                     ` <1330962421.7368.69.camel-YqMYhexLQo31wTEvPJ5Q0F6hYfS7NtTn@public.gmane.org>
2012-03-05 19:58                                       ` Mike Galbraith
2012-03-05 19:58                                         ` Mike Galbraith
2012-03-05 15:47                                   ` Mike Galbraith
2012-03-01 22:04                           ` Mike Galbraith
2012-03-01 21:02                       ` Vivek Goyal
2012-03-02  2:43                       ` Kay Sievers
2012-03-02  2:43                         ` Kay Sievers
     [not found]                         ` <CAPXgP12_A=uz_p92eBN49DTSKj7iP0rChW9cE81aZKWEjOH5nA-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org>
2012-03-02 10:15                           ` Peter Zijlstra
2012-03-02 10:15                           ` Peter Zijlstra
2012-03-02 10:15                             ` Peter Zijlstra
2012-03-02 11:16                       ` Michal Schmidt
2012-03-02 11:16                         ` Michal Schmidt
     [not found]                         ` <4F50ABF2.5070809-H+wXaHxf7aLQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org>
2012-03-02 11:24                           ` Peter Zijlstra
2012-03-02 11:24                             ` Peter Zijlstra
2012-03-02 11:24                           ` Peter Zijlstra
2012-02-23 21:38             ` Vivek Goyal
2012-02-23 21:38               ` Vivek Goyal
     [not found]               ` <20120223213847.GK19691-H+wXaHxf7aLQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org>
2012-02-23 22:34                 ` Tejun Heo
2012-02-23 22:34                   ` Tejun Heo
     [not found]                   ` <20120223223457.GJ22536-hpIqsD4AKlfQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org>
2012-02-28 21:16                     ` Vivek Goyal
2012-02-28 21:16                       ` Vivek Goyal
     [not found]                       ` <20120228211627.GH9920-H+wXaHxf7aLQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org>
2012-02-28 21:21                         ` Peter Zijlstra
2012-02-28 21:21                           ` Peter Zijlstra
2012-02-28 21:35                           ` Vivek Goyal
2012-02-28 21:35                             ` Vivek Goyal
     [not found]                             ` <20120228213526.GI9920-H+wXaHxf7aLQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org>
2012-02-28 21:43                               ` Peter Zijlstra
2012-02-28 21:43                                 ` Peter Zijlstra
2012-02-28 21:54                                 ` Vivek Goyal
2012-02-28 21:54                                   ` Vivek Goyal
     [not found]                                   ` <20120228215439.GJ9920-H+wXaHxf7aLQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org>
2012-02-28 22:00                                     ` Peter Zijlstra
2012-02-28 22:00                                       ` Peter Zijlstra
2012-02-28 22:31                                       ` Vivek Goyal
2012-02-28 22:31                                         ` Vivek Goyal
2012-02-28 21:53                               ` Peter Zijlstra
2012-02-28 21:53                                 ` Peter Zijlstra
2012-02-28 22:09                                 ` Vivek Goyal
2012-02-28 22:09                                   ` Vivek Goyal
2012-02-24 11:33                 ` Peter Zijlstra
2012-02-24 11:33                   ` Peter Zijlstra
2012-02-22 16:57       ` Vivek Goyal
2012-02-22 18:33       ` Tejun Heo
2012-02-22 18:33         ` Tejun Heo
     [not found]         ` <20120222183351.GD32694-hpIqsD4AKlfQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org>
2012-02-23 19:41           ` Vivek Goyal
2012-02-23 19:41             ` Vivek Goyal
     [not found]             ` <20120223194109.GI19691-H+wXaHxf7aLQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org>
2012-02-23 22:38               ` Tejun Heo
2012-02-23 22:38                 ` Tejun Heo
2012-02-23 22:38               ` Tejun Heo
2012-02-22 18:33       ` Tejun Heo
2012-02-23  7:59       ` Li Zefan
2012-02-23  7:59       ` Li Zefan
2012-02-23  7:59         ` Li Zefan
     [not found]         ` <4F45F1F0.2010102-BthXqXjhjHXQFUHtdCDX3A@public.gmane.org>
2012-02-23 20:32           ` Vivek Goyal
2012-02-23 20:32             ` Vivek Goyal
2012-02-22 16:38   ` Vivek Goyal
2012-02-23  8:22   ` Li Zefan
2012-02-23  8:22     ` Li Zefan
     [not found]     ` <4F45F742.1060605-BthXqXjhjHXQFUHtdCDX3A@public.gmane.org>
2012-02-23 17:33       ` Tejun Heo
2012-02-23 17:33       ` Tejun Heo
2012-02-23 17:33         ` Tejun Heo
2012-02-23  8:22   ` Li Zefan
2012-03-03  9:58   ` Eric W. Biederman
     [not found]     ` <m162em2efy.fsf-+imSwln9KH6u2/kzUuoCbdi2O/JbrIOy@public.gmane.org>
2012-03-03 14:26       ` Serge Hallyn
2012-03-03 14:26       ` Serge Hallyn
2012-03-03 14:26         ` Serge Hallyn
2012-03-05 11:37   ` Lennart Poettering
2012-03-05 11:37     ` Lennart Poettering
2012-03-05 11:37   ` Lennart Poettering
2012-03-12 22:10   ` Tejun Heo
2012-03-12 22:10   ` Tejun Heo
2012-03-12 22:10     ` Tejun Heo
     [not found]     ` <20120312221050.GG23255-hpIqsD4AKlfQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org>
2012-03-12 22:22       ` Peter Zijlstra
2012-03-12 22:22         ` Peter Zijlstra
2012-03-12 22:28         ` Tejun Heo
2012-03-12 22:28           ` Tejun Heo
     [not found]           ` <20120312222817.GI23255-hpIqsD4AKlfQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org>
2012-03-12 22:31             ` Lennart Poettering
2012-03-12 22:31             ` Lennart Poettering
2012-03-12 22:31               ` Lennart Poettering
     [not found]               ` <20120312223113.GB18359-kS5D54t9nk0aINubkmmoJbNAH6kLmebB@public.gmane.org>
2012-03-12 23:00                 ` Tejun Heo
2012-03-12 23:00                   ` Tejun Heo
     [not found]                   ` <20120312230020.GL23255-hpIqsD4AKlfQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org>
2012-03-12 23:02                     ` Peter Zijlstra
2012-03-12 23:02                       ` Peter Zijlstra
2012-03-12 23:09                       ` Tejun Heo
2012-03-12 23:09                       ` Tejun Heo
2012-03-12 23:09                         ` Tejun Heo
2012-03-12 23:43                       ` Lennart Poettering
2012-03-12 23:43                         ` Lennart Poettering
2012-03-12 23:00                 ` Tejun Heo
2012-03-12 22:32             ` Peter Zijlstra
2012-03-12 22:32               ` Peter Zijlstra
2012-03-12 22:39               ` Tejun Heo
2012-03-12 22:39                 ` Tejun Heo
     [not found]                 ` <20120312223944.GJ23255-hpIqsD4AKlfQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org>
2012-03-12 22:44                   ` Peter Zijlstra
2012-03-12 22:44                     ` Peter Zijlstra
2012-03-12 23:04                     ` Tejun Heo
2012-03-12 23:04                       ` Tejun Heo
     [not found]                       ` <20120312230416.GM23255-hpIqsD4AKlfQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org>
2012-03-13 14:10                         ` Vivek Goyal
2012-03-13 14:10                           ` Vivek Goyal
     [not found]                           ` <20120313141032.GD29169-H+wXaHxf7aLQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org>
2012-03-13 16:11                             ` C Anthony Risinger
2012-03-13 16:11                               ` C Anthony Risinger
     [not found]                               ` <CAGAVQTGus7LUWV3AdhAFy--gr=uJRWtSGjuP69-EckBiXy0qVg-JsoAwUIsXosN+BqQ9rBEUg@public.gmane.org>
2012-03-13 16:30                                 ` C Anthony Risinger
2012-03-13 16:30                                   ` C Anthony Risinger
2012-03-13 16:11                             ` C Anthony Risinger
2012-03-13 17:25                             ` Peter Zijlstra
2012-03-13 17:25                               ` Peter Zijlstra
2012-03-13 17:31                               ` Peter Zijlstra
2012-03-13 17:31                                 ` Peter Zijlstra
2012-03-13 10:11                     ` Glauber Costa
2012-03-13 10:11                     ` Glauber Costa
2012-03-13 10:11                       ` Glauber Costa
2012-03-12 22:39               ` Tejun Heo
2012-03-13 14:03             ` Vivek Goyal
2012-03-13 14:03               ` Vivek Goyal
     [not found]               ` <20120313140345.GC29169-H+wXaHxf7aLQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org>
2012-03-13 15:59                 ` Tejun Heo
2012-03-13 15:59                 ` Tejun Heo
2012-03-13 15:59                   ` Tejun Heo
     [not found]                   ` <20120313155955.GB7349-hpIqsD4AKlfQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org>
2012-03-16 23:14                     ` James Bottomley
2012-03-16 23:14                     ` James Bottomley [this message]
2012-03-16 23:14                       ` James Bottomley
2012-03-12 22:22       ` Peter Zijlstra
2012-03-12 22:37       ` Serge Hallyn
2012-03-12 22:37       ` Serge Hallyn
2012-03-12 22:37         ` Serge Hallyn
2012-03-12 22:55         ` Tejun Heo
2012-03-12 22:55           ` Tejun Heo
2012-03-12 22:55         ` Tejun Heo
2012-03-13 13:49       ` Vivek Goyal
2012-03-13 13:49         ` Vivek Goyal
     [not found]         ` <20120313134922.GB29169-H+wXaHxf7aLQT0dZR+AlfA@public.gmane.org>
2012-03-13 16:02           ` Tejun Heo
2012-03-13 16:02             ` Tejun Heo
2012-03-13 16:02           ` Tejun Heo
  -- strict thread matches above, loose matches on Subject: below --
2012-02-21 21:19 Tejun Heo

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