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From: Nix <nix@esperi.org.uk>
To: David Leimbach <leimy2k@gmail.com>
Cc: Bodo Eggert <7eggert@gmx.de>, Marc Perkel <marc@perkel.com>,
	Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton <lkcl@lkcl.net>,
	linux-kernel@vger.kernel.org
Subject: Re: what's next for the linux kernel?
Date: Wed, 05 Oct 2005 20:21:22 +0100	[thread overview]
Message-ID: <87zmpng47h.fsf@amaterasu.srvr.nix> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <3e1162e60510050941l55485cbdgf6135e314a015d8f@mail.gmail.com> (David Leimbach's message of "Wed, 5 Oct 2005 09:41:10 -0700")

On Wed, 5 Oct 2005, David Leimbach said:
>> 1) make namespaces joinable in a sane way
>> 2) wait for the shared subtree patch
>> 3) make pam join the per-user-namespace
>> 4) make pam automount tmpfs on the private /tmp
> 
> I'm not sure what you mean by a joinable namespace.  I also am not
> sure I want them :-).

They are namespaces which processes can join. Right now you can do
it by chrooting into /proc/{pid}/root, but this is, as Bodo said,
not a very sane API.

Without this, a user starting two sessions gets two namespaces,
which is profoundly counterintuitive from the user's POV.

> I think of namespaces as being fundamental to the process model and
> that they are inherited from the parent and new ones are created in a
> sort of COW fashion [or at least have similar behavior].

Yes, but you can change them too (that's what e.g. mount() is for!)

> You might want a session namespace instead of a joinable per-process
> namespace but I think that might be a slightly different point of
> view.

I think that's the idea; a filesystem holding namespaces that you're
allowed to chroot() into.

-- 
`Next: FEMA neglects to take into account the possibility of
fire in Old Balsawood Town (currently in its fifth year of drought
and home of the General Grant Home for Compulsive Arsonists).'
            --- James Nicoll

  reply	other threads:[~2005-10-05 19:21 UTC|newest]

Thread overview: 246+ messages / expand[flat|nested]  mbox.gz  Atom feed  top
     [not found] <4TiWy-4HQ-3@gated-at.bofh.it>
2005-10-02 22:43 ` what's next for the linux kernel? Robert Hancock
2005-10-02 23:32   ` Gene Heskett
2005-10-02 23:41     ` Vadim Lobanov
2005-10-02 23:48     ` Rik van Riel
2005-10-03  3:50       ` Gene Heskett
2005-10-03  9:39         ` Jesper Juhl
     [not found] ` <4U0XH-3Gp-39@gated-at.bofh.it>
2005-10-04 22:04   ` Bodo Eggert
2005-10-05 10:36     ` Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
2005-10-05 23:12       ` Nix
2005-10-05 23:28         ` Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
2005-10-05 23:49           ` Nix
2005-10-05 14:34     ` Nix
2005-10-05 14:41       ` Marc Perkel
2005-10-05 14:44         ` Lennart Sorensen
2005-10-05 14:48           ` Marc Perkel
2005-10-05 14:56             ` Lennart Sorensen
2005-10-05 15:08               ` Marc Perkel
2005-10-05 15:26                 ` Lennart Sorensen
2005-10-05 19:16                 ` Nix
2005-10-05 19:30                   ` Marc Perkel
2005-10-05 20:26                     ` Nix
2005-10-08 16:49                     ` Denis Vlasenko
2005-10-05 19:40                   ` Al Viro
2005-10-05 19:49                     ` Marc Perkel
2005-10-05 19:55                       ` Lennart Sorensen
2005-10-05 20:25                     ` linux-os (Dick Johnson)
2005-10-05 20:31                 ` Nix
2005-10-05 14:59             ` Nigel Rantor
2005-10-05 16:16             ` Bodo Eggert
2005-10-05 19:37             ` Florin Malita
2005-10-05 19:44               ` Marc Perkel
2005-10-05 19:52                 ` Lennart Sorensen
2005-10-05 20:05                   ` Marc Perkel
2005-10-05 20:23                     ` Lennart Sorensen
2005-10-06  2:56                     ` Horst von Brand
2005-10-06  3:50                       ` Marc Perkel
2005-10-06  4:12                         ` Please STOP ! [was: what's next for the linux kernel?] Willy Tarreau
2005-10-06  3:19                           ` [VERY-OT SCOX Crap] " jmerkey
2005-10-05 20:21                 ` what's next for the linux kernel? Valdis.Kletnieks
2005-10-05 20:58                 ` Dave Neuer
2005-10-05 21:05                 ` Bodo Eggert
2005-10-07 14:14                   ` 'Undeleting' an open file Giuseppe Bilotta
2005-10-07 14:25                     ` Bernd Petrovitsch
2005-10-07 14:25                     ` Jose Celestino
2005-10-07 14:30                     ` Ian Campbell
2005-10-07 14:43                       ` Bernd Petrovitsch
2005-10-07 15:04                         ` Andreas Schwab
2005-10-07 15:14                         ` Alex Riesen
2005-10-07 15:51                           ` Bernd Petrovitsch
2005-10-07 14:30                     ` Miquel van Smoorenburg
2005-10-07 17:25                       ` Giuseppe Bilotta
2005-10-06  6:43                 ` what's next for the linux kernel? Steven Rostedt
2005-10-05 19:54             ` Bernd Petrovitsch
2005-10-07  0:11             ` Joe Bob Spamtest
2005-10-05 14:52           ` linux-os (Dick Johnson)
2005-10-05 14:57             ` Lennart Sorensen
2005-10-05 15:26               ` linux-os (Dick Johnson)
2005-10-05 15:24         ` Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
2005-10-05 15:30           ` Lennart Sorensen
2005-10-05 15:42             ` Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
2005-10-05 15:55               ` Lennart Sorensen
2005-10-06 15:41                 ` Ragnar Hojland Espinosa
2005-10-05 14:55       ` David Leimbach
2005-10-05 16:25         ` Bodo Eggert
2005-10-05 16:41           ` David Leimbach
2005-10-05 19:21             ` Nix [this message]
2005-10-05 23:23             ` Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
2005-10-06  9:53               ` grundig
2005-10-06 10:45                 ` Tomasz Kłoczko
2005-10-06 15:18                 ` Greg Norris
2005-10-05 20:27     ` Marc Perkel
2005-10-05 20:41       ` Julian Blake Kongslie
2005-10-05 20:51         ` Bas Westerbaan
2005-10-05 20:57           ` Julian Blake Kongslie
     [not found]   ` <4Uis4-4pZ-5@gated-at.bofh.it>
2005-10-05 17:43     ` Bodo Eggert
2005-10-05 19:27       ` Nix
2005-10-05 20:04         ` Bodo Eggert
2005-10-06 23:24 Joe Bob Spamtest
  -- strict thread matches above, loose matches on Subject: below --
2005-10-06  3:53 Nikolay N. Ivanov
     [not found] <DE88BDF02F4319469812588C7950A97E9312A6@ussunex1.palmsource.com>
2005-10-06  0:03 ` Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
2005-10-06  0:14   ` David S. Miller
2005-10-06  1:11     ` Nigel Rantor
2005-10-06 11:10     ` Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
2005-10-06 15:44       ` Al Viro
2005-10-06  0:51   ` Howard Chu
     [not found] <mail.linux.kernel/20051003203037.GG8548@lkcl.net>
     [not found] ` <05Oct4.173802edt.33143@gpu.utcc.utoronto.ca>
2005-10-05 12:07   ` Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
2005-10-05 12:31     ` Jens Axboe
2005-10-05 13:35       ` Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
2005-10-05 13:40         ` Jens Axboe
2005-10-05 15:29           ` Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
2005-10-05 15:51             ` Jens Axboe
2005-10-05 16:38               ` Steven Rostedt
2005-10-05 23:24                 ` Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
2005-10-05 17:01     ` Dave Neuer
     [not found]     ` <161717d50510050957t2eaa3af0u8c6b3b4d327497a9@mail.gmail.com>
2005-10-05 23:05       ` Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
2005-10-04  4:11 Martin Fouts
2005-10-02 20:47 Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
2005-10-02 21:05 ` Rik van Riel
2005-10-02 23:05   ` Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
2005-10-02 23:26     ` Rik van Riel
2005-10-03  1:26       ` Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
2005-10-03  1:53         ` Rik van Riel
2005-10-02 23:37     ` Vadim Lobanov
2005-10-03  0:54       ` Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
2005-10-03  1:20         ` Vadim Lobanov
2005-10-03  1:47           ` Al Viro
2005-10-03  1:50             ` Vadim Lobanov
2005-10-03  1:53               ` Al Viro
2005-10-03  2:00                 ` Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
2005-10-03  9:34                 ` Erik Mouw
2005-10-03  1:53           ` Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
2005-10-03  2:31             ` Vadim Lobanov
2005-10-02 23:14               ` D. Hazelton
2005-10-03 10:36             ` Giuseppe Bilotta
2005-10-03 21:34               ` Nix
2005-10-03 18:19             ` Lennart Sorensen
2005-10-04 12:53               ` Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
2005-10-04 13:13                 ` linux-os (Dick Johnson)
2005-10-04 13:47                 ` Lennart Sorensen
2005-10-04 17:12                   ` Bill Davidsen
2005-10-04 16:20                 ` Gene Heskett
2005-10-03  2:12         ` Horst von Brand
2005-10-03 16:32           ` Valdis.Kletnieks
2005-10-03 19:02             ` Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
2005-10-03  2:55         ` Valdis.Kletnieks
2005-10-03  3:25           ` Rik van Riel
2005-10-03 19:13           ` Alan Cox
2005-10-03 21:22           ` Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
2005-10-03  5:03         ` Sonny Rao
2005-10-03 21:12           ` Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
2005-10-03 23:46             ` Sonny Rao
2005-10-03 19:18         ` Alan Cox
2005-10-03 21:07           ` Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
2005-10-03 22:05             ` Alan Cox
2005-10-04 14:01               ` Andi Kleen
2005-10-04  3:51             ` Valdis.Kletnieks
2005-10-03  0:04     ` Martin J. Bligh
2005-10-03  0:14       ` Randy.Dunlap
2005-10-03  0:44         ` Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
2005-10-03  7:50           ` Meelis Roos
2005-10-03 18:08             ` Lennart Sorensen
2005-10-03 18:28               ` linux-os (Dick Johnson)
2005-10-03 20:00                 ` Jon Masters
2005-10-03 18:56               ` Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
2005-10-03  1:10       ` Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
2005-10-03  1:18         ` Rik van Riel
2005-10-03  1:27         ` Chase Venters
2005-10-04 12:59           ` Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
2005-10-04 15:01             ` Tushar Adeshara
2005-10-04 15:04             ` Nikita Danilov
2005-10-04 15:58               ` Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
2005-10-04 16:17               ` Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
2005-10-04 17:15                 ` Nikita Danilov
2005-10-04 17:23                   ` Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
2005-10-04 17:40                     ` Nikita Danilov
2005-10-04 17:30                 ` Rik van Riel
2005-10-06  0:07                   ` Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
2005-10-06  9:56                     ` David Weinehall
2005-10-06 17:23                     ` Rik van Riel
2005-10-06 19:22                       ` Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
2005-10-07  0:38                         ` Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
2005-10-07  1:10                           ` Al Viro
2005-10-07  0:40                         ` Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
2005-10-03 17:56         ` Joe Bob Spamtest
     [not found]           ` <20051003185804.GB8548@lkcl.net>
     [not found]             ` <43418834.6070400@spamtest.viacore.net>
2005-10-03 20:30               ` Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
2005-10-02 22:49 ` Christoph Hellwig
2005-10-02 23:24   ` Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
2005-10-03  4:04     ` Willy Tarreau
2005-10-03  0:38   ` Kurt Wall
2005-10-03  0:36 ` Kurt Wall
2005-10-03  0:43   ` David Leimbach
2005-10-03  5:45 ` Nick Piggin
2005-10-03 14:20 ` Jon Masters
2005-10-03 16:00   ` Miklos Szeredi
2005-10-03 19:12     ` Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
2005-10-03 19:31       ` Miklos Szeredi
2005-10-03 20:22   ` Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
2005-10-03 21:55     ` Jon Masters
2005-10-04  1:33     ` Jason Stubbs
2005-10-04 12:22       ` Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
2005-10-04 19:47 ` Marc Perkel
2005-10-04 21:15   ` Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
2005-10-04 23:40   ` Chase Venters
2005-10-05  5:35     ` Valdis.Kletnieks
2005-10-05 10:07       ` Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
2005-10-05  6:54     ` Steven Rostedt
2005-10-05 10:03       ` Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
2005-10-05 10:26     ` Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
2005-10-05 11:04       ` Diego Calleja
2005-10-06 19:15         ` Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
2005-10-06  5:04       ` Chase Venters
2005-10-06 15:10         ` Michael Concannon
2005-10-06 19:28           ` Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
2005-10-06 20:13             ` Michael Concannon
2005-10-06 20:22               ` Michael Concannon
2005-10-06 21:05               ` Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
2005-10-06 21:20               ` Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
2005-10-06 21:53                 ` Michael Concannon
2005-10-06 22:24                   ` Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
2005-10-06 22:41                     ` Michael Concannon
2005-10-06 22:41                     ` Michael Concannon
2005-10-07  1:05                 ` Howard Chu
2005-10-08 22:27                 ` Helge Hafting
2005-10-08 22:42                   ` Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
2005-10-05  0:59   ` Horst von Brand
2005-10-05  1:22   ` D. Hazelton
2005-10-05  5:49     ` Marc Perkel
2005-10-05  6:03       ` Valdis.Kletnieks
2005-10-05  9:24       ` Nikita Danilov
2005-10-05  9:56         ` Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
2005-10-05 10:30           ` Nikita Danilov
2005-10-05 11:13             ` Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
2005-10-05 12:17               ` Nikita Danilov
2005-10-05 12:36                 ` Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
2005-10-05 18:47           ` Horst von Brand
2005-10-05 23:03             ` Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
2005-10-05 21:55               ` jmerkey
2005-10-05 23:36                 ` Neil Brown
2005-10-05 22:21                   ` jmerkey
2005-10-05 23:42                   ` David Leimbach
2005-10-06  3:06               ` Horst von Brand
2005-10-06 10:54                 ` Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
2005-10-06  8:03               ` Valdis.Kletnieks
2005-10-06  9:31                 ` Helge Hafting
2005-10-06 14:40                   ` Horst von Brand
2005-10-06 18:34                   ` Valdis.Kletnieks
2005-10-05 11:16         ` Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
2005-10-05 13:21         ` Marc Perkel
2005-10-05 13:52           ` Nikita Danilov
2005-10-05 23:53           ` Helge Hafting
2005-10-05 16:36         ` Tim Bird
2005-10-05 13:45       ` D. Hazelton
2005-10-05 10:09     ` Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
2005-10-05 10:23       ` Valdis.Kletnieks
2005-10-05 11:14         ` Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
2005-10-05 14:17   ` Nix
2005-10-05 15:54   ` Rik van Riel
2005-10-05 15:58     ` Marc Perkel
2005-10-05 16:15       ` Al Viro
2005-10-05 16:23         ` Marc Perkel
2005-10-05 19:30           ` Lennart Sorensen
2005-10-05 22:48             ` Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton
2005-10-06 10:28               ` Nikita Danilov
2005-10-07  0:59               ` Joe Bob Spamtest
2005-10-07  0:25       ` Joe Bob Spamtest
2005-10-05 20:11     ` Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton

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