From: Robert Millan <rmh@aybabtu.com>
To: The development of GRUB 2 <grub-devel@gnu.org>
Subject: Re: about smartcards (Re: TPM support status ?)
Date: Thu, 20 Aug 2009 22:02:11 +0200 [thread overview]
Message-ID: <20090820200211.GA28050@thorin> (raw)
In-Reply-To: <4A8D9776.9030809@own-hero.net>
On Thu, Aug 20, 2009 at 08:35:34PM +0200, decoder wrote:
> Robert Millan wrote:
>> SmartCards are a single-purpose device. Users don't install software in them,
>>
> You don't install software in a TPM module either.
>> and they don't have any user interface (other than a button or so) that could
>> be used to implement DRM
> This is wrong. Smartcards of course have a an interface to interact with
> them.
Yes, but it's usually just a button or similar. It doesn't behave like a
computer.
The same happens with your oven or your fridge. They run software and have a
user interface, but they don't work like a computer.
> And yes, you could use a Smartcard to do DRM.
No, you can't. What you can do is use the smartcard for authentication
in a computer that has been previously rigged against its user. In this
case it is the computer which implements DRM, not the card.
>> , so it's not an issue if their owners can't modify
>> their firmware (which could even be in a ROM).
>>
> The TPM can't modify anything either. A TPM is a _passive_ crypto module.
What does this have to do with anything? Being passive doesn't prevent it
from being used in coercion schemes like:
"Either you use this TPM to certify you're running Crippleware Reader
2.0 or you can't read this book"
--
Robert Millan
The DRM opt-in fallacy: "Your data belongs to us. We will decide when (and
how) you may access your data; but nobody's threatening your freedom: we
still allow you to remove your data and not access it at all."
next prev parent reply other threads:[~2009-08-20 20:02 UTC|newest]
Thread overview: 83+ messages / expand[flat|nested] mbox.gz Atom feed top
2009-08-19 11:00 TPM support status ? Emmanuel Fleury
2009-08-19 11:51 ` Vladimir 'phcoder' Serbinenko
2009-08-19 12:25 ` Michael Gorven
2009-08-19 12:42 ` Vladimir 'phcoder' Serbinenko
2009-08-19 13:24 ` Michael Gorven
2009-08-19 13:48 ` Vladimir 'phcoder' Serbinenko
2009-08-19 19:49 ` Michael Gorven
2009-08-19 20:13 ` Vladimir 'phcoder' Serbinenko
2009-08-19 14:01 ` Robert Millan
2009-08-19 19:53 ` Michael Gorven
2009-08-19 20:15 ` Vladimir 'phcoder' Serbinenko
2009-08-20 16:17 ` Robert Millan
2009-08-19 14:10 ` Robert Millan
2009-08-19 15:44 ` Isaac Dupree
2009-08-19 17:20 ` Vladimir 'phcoder' Serbinenko
2009-08-19 17:25 ` Duboucher Thomas
2009-08-19 17:39 ` Isaac Dupree
2009-08-19 18:01 ` Vladimir 'phcoder' Serbinenko
2009-08-19 18:36 ` Duboucher Thomas
2009-08-19 18:48 ` Vladimir 'phcoder' Serbinenko
2009-08-19 20:13 ` Michael Gorven
2009-08-19 20:25 ` Vladimir 'phcoder' Serbinenko
2009-08-20 7:38 ` Michael Gorven
2009-08-20 10:15 ` Vladimir 'phcoder' Serbinenko
2009-08-20 10:22 ` Michael Gorven
2009-08-20 10:29 ` Vladimir 'phcoder' Serbinenko
2009-08-20 16:36 ` Duboucher Thomas
2009-08-19 20:03 ` Michael Gorven
2009-08-19 20:18 ` Vladimir 'phcoder' Serbinenko
2009-08-19 14:42 ` Robert Millan
2009-08-19 20:16 ` Michael Gorven
2009-08-19 20:27 ` Vladimir 'phcoder' Serbinenko
2009-08-19 20:33 ` Michael Gorven
2009-08-19 20:34 ` Vladimir 'phcoder' Serbinenko
2009-08-19 20:45 ` Duboucher Thomas
2009-08-20 16:09 ` Robert Millan
2009-08-20 16:17 ` Michael Gorven
2009-08-20 16:13 ` Robert Millan
2009-08-19 14:34 ` Robert Millan
2009-08-19 16:33 ` Duboucher Thomas
2009-08-19 17:04 ` Vladimir 'phcoder' Serbinenko
2009-08-19 18:13 ` Duboucher Thomas
2009-08-19 18:37 ` Vladimir 'phcoder' Serbinenko
2009-08-19 19:16 ` Duboucher Thomas
2009-08-19 19:28 ` Vladimir 'phcoder' Serbinenko
2009-08-19 20:13 ` Duboucher Thomas
2009-08-19 20:22 ` Vladimir 'phcoder' Serbinenko
2009-08-19 20:37 ` Duboucher Thomas
2009-08-19 20:42 ` Michal Suchanek
2009-08-19 20:57 ` Duboucher Thomas
2009-08-19 21:00 ` Vladimir 'phcoder' Serbinenko
2009-08-19 21:07 ` Duboucher Thomas
2009-08-19 23:39 ` Michal Suchanek
2009-08-19 20:44 ` Vladimir 'phcoder' Serbinenko
2009-08-20 7:40 ` Michael Gorven
2009-08-20 10:19 ` Vladimir 'phcoder' Serbinenko
2009-08-19 19:21 ` Michal Suchanek
2009-08-20 7:41 ` Michael Gorven
2009-08-20 7:49 ` Michal Suchanek
2009-08-20 7:52 ` Michael Gorven
2009-08-20 7:59 ` Michal Suchanek
2009-08-20 8:07 ` Michael Gorven
2009-08-20 8:20 ` Michal Suchanek
2009-08-20 8:33 ` Michael Gorven
2009-08-20 10:21 ` Vladimir 'phcoder' Serbinenko
2009-08-20 10:58 ` Michal Suchanek
2009-08-20 11:15 ` Michael Gorven
2009-08-20 11:24 ` Vladimir 'phcoder' Serbinenko
2009-08-20 11:38 ` Michal Suchanek
2009-08-20 13:06 ` Vladimir 'phcoder' Serbinenko
2009-08-20 16:31 ` Duboucher Thomas
2009-08-20 17:47 ` about smartcards (Re: TPM support status ?) Robert Millan
2009-08-20 18:35 ` decoder
2009-08-20 19:48 ` Vladimir 'phcoder' Serbinenko
2009-08-20 20:02 ` Robert Millan [this message]
2009-08-20 20:11 ` decoder
2009-08-20 20:24 ` Vladimir 'phcoder' Serbinenko
2009-08-20 20:30 ` Robert Millan
2009-08-20 20:16 ` TPM support status ? Vladimir 'phcoder' Serbinenko
2009-08-20 17:50 ` Duboucher Thomas
2009-08-21 11:42 ` Michal Suchanek
2009-08-20 16:48 ` Robert Millan
2009-08-20 16:20 ` Robert Millan
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